Sarto Mutiny Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 My favourite Coulthard moment was when Schumacher squared up to him in the garage and Coulthard was taking zero steps back. He's a big lad, I'd like to have seen how that went if folk hadn't been holding Schumacher back. I agree, a bit more devilment, a bit less accepting of Mika's position, and he might have been a world champion. But he didn't believe he was one of the top guys.1999 should have been his year. In the best car, Mika Hakkinen's brain and Michael Schumacher's leg were away for half the season, but sadly he utterly fucked it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeek Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 (edited) I'm a fan of neither of them, but f**k me Red Bull need to get over themselves. https://www.planetf1.com/news/red-bull-no-revenge-maybe-legal-action/ There was a point a few years back when Verstappen crashed into anything that moved and a lot of things that didn't, so a bit rich to call Hamilton a reckless driver.... well at least since 07/08 with Massa! Theres also been few times that Max has done the old Senna thing of "I'll put my car here and it's up to you whether we have an accident or not" which usually is fine, but sooner or later someone will come with that same attitude. Neither intended to have the crash but certainly both could have done more to avoid it. Having an incident like that is also good for the sport, we still talk about Senna / Prost 30 years later! Edited July 21, 2021 by Jeek 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherrif John Bunnell Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 Red Bull need to wind their necks in and move on. Verstappen should win this Championship with races to spare, but Hamilton suddenly appears to have them completely rattled. Shades of the year that Vettel should have won for Ferrari, before completely falling to pieces late in the season. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IainMorton Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 12 hours ago, GordonS said: My favourite Coulthard moment was when Schumacher squared up to him in the garage and Coulthard was taking zero steps back. He's a big lad, I'd like to have seen how that went if folk hadn't been holding Schumacher back. Schumacher wouldn’t have gotten very far as DC still had his helmet on. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajwffc Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 My favourite Coulthard moment was when Schumacher squared up to him in the garage and Coulthard was taking zero steps back. He's a big lad, I'd like to have seen how that went if folk hadn't been holding Schumacher back. I agree, a bit more devilment, a bit less accepting of Mika's position, and he might have been a world champion. But he didn't believe he was one of the top guys.In all its glory 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonS Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 2 hours ago, IainMorton said: Schumacher wouldn’t have gotten very far as DC still had his helmet on. Even without his helmet Coulthard's mighty jaw could clearly, clearly take a punch or two. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherrif John Bunnell Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 Spa 98 was a ludicrous race. There's no chance they'd race in those conditions these days. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afc_36_0 Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 Coulthard was also riddled with bad luck and unreliability.I agree red bull need to stop greeting and get on with it, they have a better car so should still have the advantage 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottsdad Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 6 hours ago, Sarto Mutiny said: 17 hours ago, GordonS said: My favourite Coulthard moment was when Schumacher squared up to him in the garage and Coulthard was taking zero steps back. He's a big lad, I'd like to have seen how that went if folk hadn't been holding Schumacher back. I agree, a bit more devilment, a bit less accepting of Mika's position, and he might have been a world champion. But he didn't believe he was one of the top guys. 1999 should have been his year. In the best car, Mika Hakkinen's brain and Michael Schumacher's leg were away for half the season, but sadly he utterly fucked it. Totally agree. 98 was a good, close-run fight and Schumacher again finishing second in the championship. This would have been his third season in a row fighting at the top for the first Ferrari title in years. He and Ferrari were choking to win it. I think Schumacher might have edged it had he not snapped his leg. Hakkinen was a monster in qualifying - 11 pole positions that year - but only 5 wins. For me the Hakkinen-Schumacher battles were about as good as F1 gets. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Khaki Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 (edited) Considering Eddie Irvine and Mika Salo managed to take it down to the final race, I'm pretty certain Schumi would have comfortably won the title in '99 had he not broken his leg, never mind 'edged' it. Irvine only managed 4th, 6th, and 7th place finishes in a 3 race spell taking in Spa, Monza, and Nurburgring, and lost the title by 2 points. I'm sure Shumi would have scored far more heavily in those races and had it wrapped up before Japan. The only way Coulthard was ever going to win the title was if McLaren had a Brawn style year where they were by far and away the superior car on the grid for 75% of the season, and he was paired with a complete also-ran as a team mate. He simply wasn't on a par with the top drivers of his era, was invariably second best to his team mate, and when fate did hand him opportunities he found ways to chuck it away as often as he grasped it. He struggled in the wet as well. Career number 2 essentially. A good number 2 granted, but that's all he was in reality. Personally I'd put him behind the likes of Button, Massa, Barrichello, and Berger in the 'solid second driver' stakes. Edited July 21, 2021 by Boo Khaki 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonS Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 7 minutes ago, Boo Khaki said: He simply wasn't on a par with the top drivers of his era, was invariably second best to his team mate, and when fate did hand him opportunities he found ways to chuck it away as often as he grasped it. He struggled in the wet as well. Career number 2 essentially. A good number 2 granted, but that's all he was in reality. Personally I'd put him behind the likes of Button, Massa, Barrichello, and Berger in the 'solid second driver' stakes. That's exactly how Coulthard describes himself in interviews. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Khaki Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 Fair enough, at least he's humble enough to recognise that and admit it. It was funny back in the day though reading the 'this is my time' pieces in the preview mags every single year. Naw mate. Mibbe if Mika doesn't turn up for work for a year solid, Schumi breaks his leg again, Williams continue to be a running joke, and Ferrari don't bother running a second car... His '98 Spa was epic though. Nearly kills half the field with an idiot mistake at the start, slows to a crawl on the racing line in zero-visibility conditions, then thankfully has the entire McLaren pit crew there to prevent him being torn limb from limb by a seething Schumi. I've had bad days at work, but that takes some beating. I've also never crashed into a pit lane entry either 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonS Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 Chain Bear with solid analysis as usual. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottsdad Posted July 22, 2021 Share Posted July 22, 2021 The odd thing with Coulthard's career was the end of 97/start of 98. By the end of the 97 season he was the driver who had won races with Williams and McLaren, but under team orders gave the win for the last race of the season to Hakkinen (Hakkinen's first ever win). Same happened at the first race of the 98 season. So clearly, at some point in 97 when Coulthard was driving very well and securing big results, McLaren put their weight behind Hakkinen instead. In hindsight the right decision as Hakkinen won 2 titles and coulthard ended up in his shadow, and then Raikkonen's shadow. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Khaki Posted July 22, 2021 Share Posted July 22, 2021 Vaguely remember Ron Dennis talking about how they felt they 'owed' Mika since he'd been with them through thick and thin, his accident, and so on, so they honestly felt like he should have first dibs on any success as and when it turned up. Also, that first win was a significant psychological hurdle to get out of the way, so I can't say I really blame them for Jerez because they might have legitimately felt that was necessary to propel Hakkinen on to a genuine title challenge the next season. This was still the era of 1/2 drivers really, and before the team orders scandals, and I think a significant part of it was that Coulthard came to them already a race winner but not really viewed as a title challenger. I suppose that's partly contradictory, because McLaren always poo-pooed the idea of No.1 and No.2 drivers, but speaking pragmatically I think they probably realised that while Coulthard was good enough to win races, it was the other guy who was actually good enough to win them a Championship in a straight fight with Schumi. And yeah, apart from his first McLaren season when he couldn't finish a race, Kimi really emphasised just why McLaren never went all-in on a Coulthard title bid. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottsdad Posted July 22, 2021 Share Posted July 22, 2021 I watched the GP at the weekend and it's almost sad to see Raikkonen these days. Up until his title win he was utterly awesome. The year he won, 2007, was the absolute peak. Alonso and Hamilton were duking it out for the title and nobody really thought Raikkonen had a chance. He took podiums in each of the last 7 races, winning 4, and beat them both by a single point. For half a season he was untouchable. Even before then, though, at McLaren he was runner-up twice and was just so bloody fast. In a way the worst thing to happen to him was winning his title. He suddenly lost half a second a lap and has never been the same since - like Villeneuve after the marshal died in Australia, or Hakkinen after his kid was born. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Khaki Posted July 22, 2021 Share Posted July 22, 2021 To be fair, he was pretty much on it during his Lotus comeback as well, as he still had a sniff of top team drives at that point. It's motivating himself once he's in a comfortable position that seems to be the issue, or at least it was across the latter part of his career. I think it's age catching up now though. Still had the odd moment last season, but this year it's been totally forgettable. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afc_36_0 Posted July 23, 2021 Share Posted July 23, 2021 Raikkonen out and bottas in rumours are growing, having russell, norris and hamilton all in competitive cars would be great for the brits. Fingers crossed the 2022 changes shake up the grid and improve the racing as much as they think it will. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherrif John Bunnell Posted July 23, 2021 Share Posted July 23, 2021 The next sprint race trial is going to be at Monza. That could be fun, especially with everyone trying to get a tow from each other. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottsdad Posted July 23, 2021 Share Posted July 23, 2021 I quite enjoyed the sprint race last time out. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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