Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[Marshmallo]

1 hour ago, philpy said:

Overheard idiot neighbour talking to a friend earlier "fucking snakes man, why would someone do that?? So much for us being a close community"

Me..

[DeeTillEhDeh]

If that’s your main gripe then you’ve got your priorities wrong.

Do you think trial by media is acceptable?

 

I would have expected better from you.

 

Due process is important - if she has broken the Civil Service Code then fine - but it shouldn't be politicians or hypocrital hacks making that decision.

 

Where the First Minister does have a role is in deciding if the CMO should still be part of the PR on relation to coronavirus - that I think was a difficult decision. I think she was in one of those damned if she does and damned iif she doesn't scenarios. With that initial grilling out the way it may be easier to sideline the CMO when it comes to media briefings.

[Granny Danger]

1 minute ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

Do you think trial by media is acceptable?

I would have expected better from you.

Due process is important - if she has broken the Civil Service Code then fine - but it shouldn't be politicians or hypocrital hacks making that decision.

You said it’s your main gripe, it’s not mine.  I’m not bothered about the technicalities I think she should go.  She made a clear, deliberate decision; she knew what she was doing.  That’s my main gripe.

[effeffsee_the2nd]

Not sure how influential this guy is but sounds like a policy reversal could be coming if we reach a plateau and it trundles on for a bit.
https://metro.co.uk/2020/04/04/herd-immunity-considered-end-lockdown-pms-adviser-says-12507209/

Seems to be a media whirlind of this guy, but but sweeden huvnae done it and there Awrite vs put everyone on house arrest, the longer the better possibly for upto 18 months if it saves one life ..then everything will be fine again [emoji30]

I’m guessing the correct strategy will be somewhere in the middle. If we allow for everyone to catch it then im sure the death rate will be unacceptable . If we have a protracted shutdown then you have to seriously wonder what kind of society we would be helping people to survive into going forward.
Those who want a much stricter lockdown forget that there is always a certain percentage of people who have a “ naebody tells ME whit tae do “ attitude and it’s them who you see having bbqs in the park . Having the polis goin round like the gestapo checking folks papers is not in anybody’s interest of that I’m sure. I think the french are being heavy handed
All in all i think what were doing is actually fine and time will prove it . After this wee quarantine period we can phase in the lifting of restrictions over a few weeks and months and it should work a treat
Thats my take anyway

[DeeTillEhDeh]

You said it’s your main gripe, it’s not mine.  I’m not bothered about the technicalities I think she should go.  She made a clear, deliberate decision; she knew what she was doing.  That’s my main gripe.

I think she should go too - but through the correct process.

[GordonS]

4 hours ago, Diamonds are Forever said:

 

Absolutely. It is consistently depressing the inability of so many people to actually have an opinion on something that isn't filtered through their political leanings first. You'd think an issue as big as this would be able to be above politics, but clearly not.

Her actions are not a 'mistake', they are that of a privileged person thinking the guidance doesn't apply to her like it does to the average Joe. She has zero credibility. When the face of the government's guidelines can't even stick to them then what chance have they got of stopping people going down the park for a BBQ? 

At best, she will be shunted to the background to help dictate policy but not be involved in communicating. She really should be sacked though.

 Tens of thousands of Scots who've lost their jobs must be asking what it takes from someone like her to lose hers.

I felt even the opposition politicians went easy on her because she's one of their own. Willie Rennie, who represents the constituency she came to, couldn't bring himself to seriously criticise her.

I can't say whether she should get her jotters at this point, because by all accounts she's doing an excellent job and it's more important to save lives and manage the NHS as well as possible right now. And employment law might make it difficult to let her continue now and then dismiss her later. We'll see.

[GordonS]

3 hours ago, ThatBoyRonaldo said:

Don't know if this has been said before now but Jason Leitch isn't an epidemiologist either - he's a dentist/oral & maxfacs doctor to trade. AFAIK some doctors are very precious/childish about him being in charge while in their eyes not being a 'real' doctor.

 

Fair point bud.

[Mark Connolly]

1 hour ago, superbigal said:

She was telt on youtube is quite amusing. My links not working if someone can put it up.

 

 

@Tynierose - do you still have that banhammer handy?

[GordonS]

3 hours ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

My view is that Calderwood should have tendered her resignation and Sturgeon should have accepted it. However, none of us experts here on a fans football forum are 24/7 in the cockpit of trying to control a pandemic and the FM has presumably had to make a very serious judgement here, I mean it's hardly a plumber fucking off in the middle of a bathroom refurb is it ?

That should not be interpreted as partisan support for Sturgeon or the Scottish Government, but on the other hand it would not matter a damn to elements of the media what was decided - haters are gonna hate irrespective.

Sacking/ resigning is one issue, but what should have been beyond doubt is that she couldn't appear on that podium again.

[welshbairn]

7 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

Do you think trial by media is acceptable?

 

I know this isn't your main point, but I can't believe she hasn't resigned. Thought at first that it must have been last weekend they were talking about when the rules were slightly less clear, but after a full week of being plastered over the telly telling the public not to do exactly what she did, it's unfuckingbelievable, and nothing to do with the media, other than doing their job and exposing her utter hypocrisy. Any other job it would be oooh, bit naughty but no real harm; not hers. 

[NotThePars]

1 hour ago, Detournement said:

I'm sure you have nice wooden flooring, a nice corner couch and a big telly. 

However I am quite fond of direct sunlight.

Stick your head out the window like a dog. Coincidentally, I am proud to announce I've landed a job in the civil service as the Chief Medical Officer and will be advising Sturgeon from tomorrow.

 

 

45 minutes ago, sophia said:

I thought it would be a good idea to listen to a podcast with him and Matt Forde earlier.

I won't make that mistake again.

I gave up when he claimed that to win independence, 6% of no voters had to be convinced to switch.

 

Thinking that was a good idea rivals Granny Danger's vote for Brexit in sheer stupidity. 

[sophia]

 

2 minutes ago, GordonS said:

 Tens of thousands of Scots who've lost their jobs must be asking what it takes from someone like her to lose hers.

I felt even the opposition politicians went easy on her because she's one of their own. Willie Rennie, who represents the constituency she came to, couldn't bring himself to seriously criticise her.

I can't say whether she should get her jotters at this point, because by all accounts she's doing an excellent job and it's more important to save lives and manage the NHS as well as possible right now. And employment law might make it difficult to let her continue now and then dismiss her later. We'll see.

He called for her to resign!

My rule of thumb is that if Willie Rennie is a hyena, I'd prefer to think hard about running with the pack.

She's a human being, albeit a highly skilled and paid one, that has been suddenly thrust into a daily regime that must be beyond her, or most people's for that matter, comfort zone and she made an error of judgement

It appears she will no longer have public facing duties. I trust this satisfies the blood lust.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

 

 

 

 Tens of thousands of Scots who've lost their jobs must be asking what it takes from someone like her to lose hers.

I felt even the opposition politicians went easy on her because she's one of their own. Willie Rennie, who represents the constituency she came to, couldn't bring himself to seriously criticise her.

I can't say whether she should get her jotters at this point, because by all accounts she's doing an excellent job and it's more important to save lives and manage the NHS as well as possible right now. And employment law might make it difficult to let her continue now and then dismiss her later. We'll see.

 

Not employment law as such but the Civil Service Management Code - section 4.5 covers this.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/566900/CSMC_November_2016.docx

 

 

 

Section 4.5.3 states:

 

 

"It is for departments and agencies to define the circumstances in which initiation of disciplinary procedures may be appropriate. It is not necessary to attempt to define every circumstance. However departments’ and agencies’ rules for staff must make clear the circumstances in which the application of the disciplinary procedures may be considered, and these must include:

 

 

* breaches of the organisation’s standards of conduct or other forms of misconduct (see paragraph 4.1.4); and

 

 

* any other circumstances in which the behaviour, action or inaction of individuals significantly disrupts or damages the performance or reputation of the organisation;

 

 

* as well as other circumstances covered by the statutory dispute resolution procedures."

 

 

 

 

[madwullie]

2 hours ago, Lex said:

Got to laugh really, it’s utterly ludicrous levels of incompetence and entitlement. Couldn’t make it up.

Not surprised she hasn’t been sacked yet right enough, good mates with Nicola apparently.

Is she going to continue to do the briefings telling us all to do avoid unnecessary travel...?

Absolute madness.

Apparently not no

[Gaz]

Stepping down from briefings according to the Grauniad, will still be involved from a medical point of view.

[GordonS]

2 minutes ago, sophia said:

 

He called for her to resign!

My rule of thumb is that if Willie Rennie is a hyena, I'd prefer to think hard about running with the pack.

She's a human being, albeit a highly skilled and paid one, that has been suddenly thrust into a daily regime that must be beyond her, or most people's for that matter, comfort zone and she made an error of judgement

It appears she will no longer have public facing duties. I trust this satisfies the blood lust.

Rennie gave a stronger quote later, but even then, he prefaced it with, "It is with great regret that we say that the chief medical officer will need to go."

Why the "great regret"? And "need to go"; it's pretty soft and kind language. 

2 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

Not employment law as such but the Civil Service Management Code - section 4.5 covers this.
 

It would still be a matter of employment law whether letting her continue now would constitute acceptance of the breach, for which she could not be dismissed later.

[ICTChris]

I love civil servants.

“I think you’ll find that sacking this person would be a breach of clause 7.4 subsection 5, paragraph 6a of the non-committal agreement in principle that was counter signed by the sub committee responsible for th principle of agreement,”

“But...”

“I don’t care how many bodies they found in his drains! Until you meet these simple and reasonable criteria Mr Nilsen must be kept in situ. I’ll contact Wakefield Prison to get his standing desk fitted tomorrow”

[DeeTillEhDeh]

I know this isn't your main point, but I can't believe she hasn't resigned. Thought at first that it must have been last weekend they were talking about when the rules were slightly less clear, but after a full week of being plastered over the telly telling the public not to do exactly what she did, it's unfuckingbelievable, and nothing to do with the media, other than doing their job and exposing her utter hypocrisy. Any other job it would be oooh, bit naughty but no real harm; not hers. 

The point being that it isnt the media or politicians who make the decisions. 

I personally believe that she she should be disciplined - but through the correct processes.

 

Looking at the Civil Service Management Code Section 4.5.3 it looks likely there is a disciplinary case to at least investigate .

 

 

 

[jagfox]

2 hours ago, philpy said:

Overheard idiot neighbour talking to a friend earlier "fucking snakes man, why would someone do that?? So much for us being a close community"

Me..

[DeeTillEhDeh]

It would still be a matter of employment law whether letting her continue now would constitute acceptance of the breach, for which she could not be dismissed later.

You can still work whilst facing a disciplinary investigation - that's how I take it.