Left Back Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 9 minutes ago, welshbairn said: The vaccine roll out cost f**k all compared to the testing regime that I've never understood the logic for, and all the PPE side deals for friends of the Tories. The thing that's seriously wrong is thinking the vaccine job is done for a global pandemic, while most of the world hasn't seen one, far less a booster. Estimated at close to £12bn spent on the vaccine rollout almost a year ago. Bound to have gone up since then so hardly buttons. https://www.ft.com/content/58b11945-71b1-4f96-b389-695e162642fb 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Left Back Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 8 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said: Over 4 billion people have received at least one dose globally so not sure that's accurate. It’s not. More than half of the global population have received at least one vaccine dose. https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations?country=OWID_WRL 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 ...and there's definitely no shortage of vaccine at this point in middle and higher income countries so no harm giving the morons who are still hesitant about taking it some added incentive with policies like the one Austria is contemplating. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 24 minutes ago, welshbairn said: The vaccine roll out cost f**k all compared to the testing regime that I've never understood the logic for, and all the PPE side deals for friends of the Tories. It's still a large amount of public money, and more importantly, a large amount of time spent using trained staff to deliver jabs when the wider health service is, as they never tire of telling us, under extreme pressure. The collective benefits certainly outweigh the costs until this point, but we will see diminishing returns in the very near future if the shan Delta variant remains endemic/seasonal. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Left Back Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 6 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said: ...and there's definitely no shortage of vaccine at this point in middle and higher income countries so no harm giving the morons who are still hesitant about taking it some added incentive with policies like the one Austria is contemplating. What on earth does availability of vaccines have to do with vaccine hesitancy? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 5 minutes ago, oaksoft said: You'll need to take that up with the posters who are doing it. I'm only interested in tackling your "moral code" argument. If you insist. Name a society that doesn't have a moral code that punishes breaches. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elixir Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 2 hours ago, Johnny van Axeldongen said: If you restrict the unvaccinated and cases continue to rise – then what? Blame those who 'only' have two doses? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 39 minutes ago, oaksoft said: I'm not playing your "changing the goalposts" game. When did I do that? You're the one who brought up the Nazis and fucking Pol Pot! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elixir Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 Think wee Rab has been on the cooking sherry the night. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MP_MFC Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 Denmark reinstating their Coronapass and looking to extend it to workplaces. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 Incentivising vaccination at this point is rational and not comparable to the way Sweden got pilloried for following the pre-existing pandemic protocols rather than joining the over the top nanny state populist measures adopted elsewhere. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee Bully Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 8 hours ago, MP_MFC said: Denmark reinstating their Coronapass and looking to extend it to workplaces. That can’t be right. Only a week or so ago @Elixir was urging us to look at Denmark and the fact they were getting rid of all of their restrictions. It was a “total minter” that we weren’t following Denmark. Presumably we should now do as we were urged by @Elixir, and follow Denmarks lead? 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 2 hours ago, LongTimeLurker said: Incentivising vaccination at this point is rational and not comparable to the way Sweden got pilloried for following the pre-existing pandemic protocols rather than joining the over the top nanny state populist measures adopted elsewhere. The way to incentivise vaccination is to produce a vaccine which actually benefits the people who is it offered to. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 I don't see that as ominous, just a recognition that it's moving from pandemic to endemic and we'll need regular boosters like the flu. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MP_MFC Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 The CMO commenting on the Dutch lockdown saying he doesn’t think it’ll be the last one in the coming days and weeks. I’ve supported just about all measures until this point but another lockdown is one I will not abide - that would result in a resignation from the SNP membership. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 17 minutes ago, MP_MFC said: The CMO commenting on the Dutch lockdown saying he doesn’t think it’ll be the last one in the coming days and weeks. I’ve supported just about all measures until this point but another lockdown is one I will not abide - that would result in a resignation from the SNP membership. Our hospitalisations and deaths are in a downward trajectory with fairly minor mitigations compared to most of Europe. I wouldn't be too gloomy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elixir Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 2 hours ago, Wee Bully said: That can’t be right. Only a week or so ago @Elixir was urging us to look at Denmark and the fact they were getting rid of all of their restrictions. It was a “total minter” that we weren’t following Denmark. Presumably we should now do as we were urged by @Elixir, and follow Denmarks lead? As disappointing as it is, it probably was wishful to think a country like Denmark which has had minimal spread through its population wouldn't end up having a large wave of infections. The same will happen in Norway, Australia, New Zealand, East Asian countries, etc. Whether this remains an appropriate response given the real world evidence from neighbouring countries is doubtful. The reason it's frustrating is because Scotland is in a better position than Denmark in terms of moving on from the pandemic. We have considerably more immunity in the population from people having had the virus, and comparable vaccination rates but vaccination which was more effective due to an 8-12 week interval rather than 3-6. I believe Denmark also won't be a vaccine-only policy. It is extremely easy to get free PCR tests there, and recovery from infection is accepted. There is also little doubt they will de-escalate once the situation has subsided. None of this takes away from the fact our nearest neighbours, with whom we have shared the epidemic, got rid of all the pantomime measures we have had to continue enduring up here four months ago. Yet the end result has been the same. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elixir Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 29 minutes ago, welshbairn said: I don't see that as ominous, just a recognition that it's moving from pandemic to endemic and we'll need regular boosters like the flu. A fair comment for a change... 21 minutes ago, MP_MFC said: The CMO commenting on the Dutch lockdown saying he doesn’t think it’ll be the last one in the coming days and weeks. I’ve supported just about all measures until this point but another lockdown is one I will not abide - that would result in a resignation from the SNP membership. A lot of Europe have utterly f**ked it by delaying their exit wave until the winter. Despite some with decent vaccination rates there will still be sizeable pockets with zero immunity. It's intolerable for people who were already at next to no risk but decided to get vaccinated anyway, though. 1 minute ago, welshbairn said: Our hospitalisations and deaths are in a downward trajectory with fairly minor mitigations compared to most of Europe. I wouldn't be too gloomy. Yes, the booster rollout seems to be having a quite noticeable impact on the vulnerable and hospital admissions in Scotland despite cases rising among younger folk again. Yet we all know there's next to no chance of the Scottish Government not meddling even further come Tuesday. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MP_MFC Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 Our hospitalisations and deaths are in a downward trajectory with fairly minor mitigations compared to most of Europe. I wouldn't be too gloomy.I was on that track but when the CMO starts tweeting about it and some MSPs/prominent government advisers are doing so too, it gets the ears up more than usual. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bairnardo Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 3 hours ago, Wee Bully said: That can’t be right. Only a week or so ago @Elixir was urging us to look at Denmark and the fact they were getting rid of all of their restrictions. It was a “total minter” that we weren’t following Denmark. Presumably we should now do as we were urged by @Elixir, and follow Denmarks lead? It will never cease to be the worst take of the thread, when someone wades in all chuffed with rising infections and measures being taken, so that they can own an internet stranger who would prefer it if their life wasn't restricted. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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