jamamafegan Posted August 16, 2021 Author Share Posted August 16, 2021 Some Afghans blaming the West for betraying them by bailing. Is that fair? I’m not sure it is. If indeed the Afghan military has been funded trillions by the Americans and put up zero fight against the Taliban then that’s on the Afghan government. Biden looked daft when he said the Taliban won’t take over but I do agree with the sentiment to take US troops out of there and that the Afghans must learn to look after themselves. Is it the job of the US military or indeed any other military to be permanently deployed in a country to protect them? I don’t think it is. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inanimate Carbon Rod Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 57 minutes ago, 101 said: No just the rims but anything they think they can hang on to the video's of folk falling off are tragic, not sure why the Americans are taking off with so many folk hanging on The oic of the plane probably has orders that the plane takes off regardless, probably worried the plane would be overrun and unable to take off or be damaged with the crowds. Not saying its not barbaric looking but they will be completing their objective regardless. 15 minutes ago, jamamafegan said: Some Afghans blaming the West for betraying them by bailing. Is that fair? I’m not sure it is. If indeed the Afghan military has been funded trillions by the Americans and put up zero fight against the Taliban then that’s on the Afghan government. Biden looked daft when he said the Taliban won’t take over but I do agree with the sentiment to take US troops out of there and that the Afghans must learn to look after themselves. Is it the job of the US military or indeed any other military to be permanently deployed in a country to protect them? I don’t think it is. Much like the Middle East we completely destabilised the area, left it to a band of corrupt puppets and a government that was essentially doomed to fail because the Afghan people weren’t behind them. I can only speak for the stories ive been told about the ANA that basically it was the only paid work for many and they joined for a wage with no intention of taking up arms, some recruits were ex taliban previously etc. Its a complete cluster f**k totally devoid of a simple solution. We probably shouldnt have invaded anyway, but since we did we shouldnt have left in that fucking mess. Its completely staggering, Raab no where to be seen, Boris and Biden chuckling away. We’ve seen a corrupt brexit, tory profiteering in the midst of a pandemic, completely mis-managing the NHS, abandoning the people to afghanistan to be ruled by the people who oppressed them previously. Absolutely f**k the UK. What an arsehole country. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky88 Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 1 hour ago, 101 said: China "ready for friendly relations" with the Taliban government. If China and America are going to negotiate with them and deal with them as a legitimate government then you have to imagine the rest of the world will fall into this position. Appeasing the Taliban won't go down well in USA. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 25 minutes ago, jamamafegan said: Some Afghans blaming the West for betraying them by bailing. Is that fair? Yes. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, sparky88 said: Appeasing the Taliban won't go down well in USA. The Americans have blown all their leverage over China in the last few years with sanctions, tariffs and banning Chinese firms from international contracts etc. China will just do what it wants now. Edited August 16, 2021 by welshbairn 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 Not quite last flight out of Da Nang stuff yet but definitely getting there: 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 29 minutes ago, sparky88 said: Appeasing the Taliban won't go down well in USA. Rightly or wrongly they went over the heads of the former Afghan government and met with them a number of times, to me doing so put them well on their way to legitimacy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamthebam Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 13 hours ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said: Imagine making Trump look competent. Trump would have done the same thing. He pulled out of Syria. There is an isolationist tendency in the Republican Party who would have supported such a move. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
placidcasual Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 There's a really good documentary available on iplayer, Bitter Lake, about the continual mistakes foreign powers make in Afghanistan. Well worth a watch imo. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 21 minutes ago, tamthebam said: Trump would have done the same thing. He pulled out of Syria. There is an isolationist tendency in the Republican Party who would have supported such a move. Yeah, Biden's just carrying out what Trump agreed to. I don't really see what choice he had, it was always going to end like this, just a matter of when. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 One of the interesting things about this is that the Taliban now control what, in the late 1990s and early 2000s, were the heartlands of the Northern Alliance. I’ve heard it suggested that the Taliban have changed since the 1990s but no-one really knows I guess. I doubt they will have relationships with al-Queda or any group like it, the downsides rather obviously outweigh the up. How they deal with the local actors who have been opposed to them in the past is interesting to me. How Afghanistan and the West deals with the exodus of Afghans is another big open question. I saw videos of people fleeing to Iran and Uzbekistan online earlier, if the flow becomes as large as it could then these countries could be destabilised. Also, European countries will face large numbers of refugees trying to reach the EU which will have its own impact.Watching news reports from various channels there seems to be a more conscious effort to have positive PR.Whether the reality lives up to that is another matter. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 It will be funny if the Taliban just let girls go to school and all the blue tick libs will be absolutely snookered. It's already happening. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 The population of Afghanistan has doubled since 2001. The majority of people there never lived under the previous Taliban regime. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 Some Afghans blaming the West for betraying them by bailing. Is that fair? I’m not sure it is. If indeed the Afghan military has been funded trillions by the Americans and put up zero fight against the Taliban then that’s on the Afghan government. Biden looked daft when he said the Taliban won’t take over but I do agree with the sentiment to take US troops out of there and that the Afghans must learn to look after themselves. Is it the job of the US military or indeed any other military to be permanently deployed in a country to protect them? I don’t think it is. The extent of our involvement should be facilitating asylum applications and making it as easy as possible for anyone who wants to seek asylum elsewhere to do so and those of us who intervened in Afghanistan should be willing to take as substantial a bulk of those refugees as we can.In that vein it’s probably Good that we currently have a very public discussion going on atm where influential people are doing their best to narrow the parameters of who deserves asylum as much as possible. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottsdad Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 There must be thousands of Afgans who have helped and aided the British military and diplomatic forces in recent years who are in fear for their lives. We should be bringing these people here and resettling them, but sadly the gatekeeper is Priti Patel who, one imagines, would rather see them left behind than helped. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Tattiescone Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 21 minutes ago, ICTChris said: The population of Afghanistan has doubled since 2001. The majority of people there never lived under the previous Taliban regime. In 2001 there were 6 million Afghan refugees. I wonder how many returned after the fall of the Taliban. I suspect a much larger number will be leaving now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melanius Mullarkey Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 Looking forward to Aberdeen away to Sporting Kabul in next seasons Europa Conference R1 qualifier. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonHMFC Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 1 minute ago, Fullerene said: In 2001 there were 6 million Afghan refugees. I wonder how many returned after the fall of the Taliban. I suspect a much larger number will be leaving now. I work with a lad who fled back in 2001 (he thinks) unfortunately his family didn't make it out, he ended up in Hull, before being sent down to Exeter, he now lives in Essex (probably a joke to be made here). He isn't sure of his exact birth date and therefore age, although he thinks he is around 26. We went out for dinner a few months ago and I asked him about Afghanistan and if he'd go back etc, he said he was keen to see his family that were still there but had been told not to attempt coming over as the Taliban were starting to become a lot more visible and kidnapping was a real possibility. He was also pretty convinced about what is happening now would happen. He's been off the past few days, have sent him a couple texts just checking in and he seems utterly dejected. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennett Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 6 hours ago, ICTJohnboy said: Were they expecting the US/UK trained Afghan army to mount a spirited defence of the country? Probably trained and equipped the Taliban. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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