Alloa VS Accies

[Ian Mcleod]

9 minutes ago, Vegetableman said:

 

yeah i saw them all waiting when i drove from the LIDL carpark,  wee assholes  barely 16 most of them , not real fans ,sorry to hear and feel it for the fans in the bus , and as an ex bus driver the driver and company as well .

Yep one of those I wonder what they're parents would think if they knew what their child is up to behind their backs. 

[lanky_ffc]

2 hours ago, LeodhasXD said:

Based on my instincts on football?

Assume this is quite a simple calculation of xG vs xG against per game, but Wyscout's xPoints algorithm thinks you're almost 12 points better off than you should be too.

I'm a big fan of data in football but I'd tread with caution when using xG at this level of football. It's heavily influenced by shot location which is fine in the top leagues where there are multiple camera angles and the tracking data can give the exact coordinates. Less reliable as you get further down the leagues.

I'd love to believe that data but Accies are up there on merit and I think the betting markets will struggle to split us next weekend.

 

Edited December 9, 2023 by lanky_ffc

[LeodhasXD]

8 minutes ago, lanky_ffc said:

I'm a big fan of data in football but I'd tread with caution when using xG at this level of football. It's heavily influenced by shot location which is fine in the top leagues where there are multiple camera angles and the tracking data can give the exact coordinates. Less reliable as you get further down the leagues.

I'd love to believe that data but Accies are up there on merit and I think the betting markets will struggle to split us next weekend.

 

Like I say I've watched plenty of Hamilton games too. I don't think they are as impressive as Falkirk have been ie - the eye test has been applied. Not just looking at a table. 

Edited December 9, 2023 by LeodhasXD

[LeodhasXD]

 

[AGPar]

46 minutes ago, Ian Mcleod said:

A Falkirk win would mean we would be 6 points behind after they win their game in hand that is far from acceptable. 

It would mean absolutely nothing of the sort. You're simply characterising it in that manner to somehow strengthen your argument that Rankin needs emptied. You'll be well aware that our game in hand is against a Cove Rangers side who (a) have won their last seven straight league games and 8 including the SC and (b) we have performed woefully against since we started playing them a few years ago - 6 points gained from an available 24.

You dropped a couple of points at a difficult venue today and we took advantage, just as we dropped a couple of points at a difficult venue 11/12 days ago and you took advantage. I've seen nothing whatsoever to suggest it won't be that sort of title race well into next year, and possibly all the way through to May. Dunfermline had already taken a firm stranglehold on the league by this time last year and never looked like relinquishing it. And yet, after 16 games they had gained 35 points - both clubs are currently ahead of that, and we've played a game less. I'd love us to be doing what they did last season, but have pretty much accepted that the consistency and form of Hamilton means that is almost certainly not going to happen. That's why every draw or defeat for either side - and we'll have them sooner or later - is being magnified. Apart from a period in January/February Dunfermline never had to contend with any sort of genuine threat, and from March the cigars were out.

At this stage I would not be hugely surprised by any scenario - Falkirk win it/Hamilton win it/both of us still flailing about at this level in 12 months time whilst Cove are back playing Championship football. Bugger all will be decided next week and we are under pressure too - any Falkirk fan who does not have their head in the clouds (and admittedly that excludes an ever-increasing percentage of our fanbase) will be  very, very wary of our tendency to shit the bed in the biggest way possible in any game that matters flaring up again next Saturday. It's simply happened too often. If we cannot eradicate that we will be going absolutely nowhere.

[Zaltan]

Only based on the highlights Hamilton defending is bad, also subbing out Zanatta seems weird he is involved in most of Hamiltons chances

[Ian Mcleod]

11 minutes ago, AGPar said:

It would mean absolutely nothing of the sort. You're simply characterising it in that manner to somehow strengthen your argument that Rankin needs emptied. You'll be well aware that our game in hand is against a Cove Rangers side who (a) have won their last seven straight league games and 8 including the SC and (b) we have performed woefully against since we started playing them a few years ago - 6 points gained from an available 24.

You dropped a couple of points at a difficult venue today and we took advantage, just as we dropped a couple of points at a difficult venue 11/12 days ago and you took advantage. I've seen nothing whatsoever to suggest it won't be that sort of title race well into next year, and possibly all the way through to May. Dunfermline had already taken a firm stranglehold on the league by this time last year and never looked like relinquishing it. And yet, after 16 games they had gained 35 points - both clubs are currently ahead of that, and we've played a game less. I'd love us to be doing what they did last season, but have pretty much accepted that the consistency and form of Hamilton means that is almost certainly not going to happen. That's why every draw or defeat for either side - and we'll have them sooner or later - is being magnified. Apart from a period in January/February Dunfermline never had to contend with any sort of genuine threat, and from March the cigars were out.

At this stage I would not be hugely surprised by any scenario - Falkirk win it/Hamilton win it/both of us still flailing about at this level in 12 months time whilst Cove are back playing Championship football. Bugger all will be decided next week and we are under pressure too - any Falkirk fan who does not have their head in the clouds (and admittedly that excludes an ever-increasing percentage of our fanbase) will be  very, very wary of our tendency to shit the bed in the biggest way possible in any game that matters flaring up again next Saturday. It's simply happened too often. If we cannot eradicate that we will be going absolutely nowhere.

You've just ignored all my other points. Cove are a good team but I would expect Falkirk to beat them at home. Rankins tactics and subs are dreadful we've gotten away with it at times this season due to our players being miles better than our opponents. Again Rankin got us relegated last season and he will most likely bottle it again this year. As a previous poster said we are behind the players and believe in them however I think the majority of us either know Rankin isn't the man or have serious doubts. I don't want Rankin sacked based on a draw at Alloa I want him sacked due to his dreadful 18 months in charge where his poor management and rank rotten tactics have cost us far too many times last season wasn't all his fault he was given a very hard job due to our past board but even then he should have still done better and a good manager would have kept us up. This season he's been strongly backed by the new board however there's been too many times he's shown he's not the man for the job. If we lose next week and again go basically 6 points behind Falkirk that would be the final straw for me he needs to win or at worst get a point next week or a change is required.

[Beckford]

Not exactly been Rankins biggest fan and he got a lot wrong today, but there is no way a (relatively) rookie manager is getting sacked sitting joint top of the league. The board have backed him and think they will contine to do so. The board changes have been the big positive for me this season. We have the right guys running the club now, but we need the manager to find his best team, stop tinkering with it and stop making crazy subs.

He seems a decent guy and can't question his commitment. Any time i have spoken to board members at the ground, they always talk about how good the dressing room is and the bond the squad has. Players egos are fragile though and constantly changing  the team can have a negative effect if the man management is not bang on. Players usually look as confused or pi%@÷d off as the rest of us when subbed.

Oh and as raised on Accies World, can we please work on corners as ours have zero threat. Saw one in the first half were we tried something that looked like it came from the training ground, but when it didn't come off we went straight back to the usual 

 

 

Edited December 9, 2023 by Beckford

[AGPar]

1 hour ago, Ian Mcleod said:

This season he's been strongly backed by the new board however there's been too many times he's shown he's not the man for the job. If we lose next week and again go basically 6 points behind Falkirk that would be the final straw for me he needs to win or at worst get a point next week or a change is required.

Backing that he’s used to have you currently joint top of the league and in with an excellent chance of promotion at the first time of asking. He’s more than meeting his objectives. That’s the bigger picture, that’s what whoever makes the decisions at Hamilton these days will be looking at, that’s why his job is not remotely under threat and won’t be for some time to come. Even if you contrive to lose next Saturday there is not a chance he’s getting sacked. 

There is not a fan base anywhere who could not, if pushed, pinpoint perceived errors or weaknesses on the part of their manager as the reason for dropped points. If they pile up, and the club is fighting relegation or miles off the pace at the top as a result, he invariably gets emptied. That’s not remotely the scenario for your club at the moment. Last season is irrelevant, if that had any bearing on Rankin’s employment he’d have been booted in the summer. I could make a very similar argument in respect of McGlynn, got to a Scottish Cup S/F then fell off a cliff in the final two months culminating in one of the most disgraceful surrenders in the clubs history, most of the away support at Airdrie that night would have hunted him at half-time. But its long gone. Both are as safe as houses this season barring a complete implosion.

[Ye Olde Hamiltonian]

56 minutes ago, Beckford said:

Not exactly been Rankins biggest fan and he got a lot wrong today, but there is no way a (relatively) rookie manager is getting sacked sitting joint top of the league. The board have backed him and think they will contine to do so. The board changes have been the big positive for me this season. We have the right guys running the club now, but we need the manager to find his best team, stop tinkering with it and stop making crazy subs.

He seems a decent guy and can't question his commitment. Any time i have spoken to board members at the ground, they always talk about how good the dressing room is and the bond the squad has. Players egos are fragile though and constantly changing  the team can have a negative effect if the man management is not bang on. Players usually look as confused or pi%@÷d off as the rest of us when subbed.

Oh and as raised on Accies World, can we please work on corners as ours have zero threat. Saw one in the first half were we tried something that looked like it came from the training ground, but when it didn't come off we went straight back to the usual 

 

 

I was walking past the ground not that  long ago walking the dogs and watched a bit of the training as they were practising corners and bar a couple, they were all dreadful.

Alloa and St.Johnstone have been our bogey teams since I started going in the 76-77 season,so today was no surprise.

I was impressed by Alloa who know how to play against us nullifying our threats and they could have been ahead as had good chances-but so did we especially O'Hara through in the last 10 minutes with the Keeper to beat.

I said about a month ago not to rule Cove Rangers out and I stand by that.A draw next week suits them as it would potentially allow them to gain further ground on Accies and Falkirk.

We invariably produce a big result after dropping points,so here's hoping for next week. 

 

[Rory]

11 hours ago, Ian Mcleod said:

Again today for the second time in a couple of months a section of Alloa fans showed their lack of class and smashed 2 windows of the accies supporters bus luckily it was only the outside window so nobody was injured still embarrassing from those Alloa fans.

Probably the same "fans" who were hiding behind a security guard when the Falkirk "fans" were waiting outside for them. Would be a nice gesture from the club to pay for the repairs but don't see it happening.

Thought we played well yesterday and for a 0-0 it was a pretty entertaining game.

Thought our defence coped well and was impressed with Cammy. McKay and Neill done well too. Got to praise Coulson for his efforts defensively as well, he done a lot of running up and down the wing and helped Cammy out when needed. Hadn't really seen that side from him before.

Wales really good all game but almost seems like a higher power doesn't want him to score for Alloa.

Thought Scougs should have been subbed about 10 minutes before he limped off, could see he was knackered but hopefully him and Cammy will be fit for next week.

Couple of decent saves from Morrison but he looks dodgy at other times. 

Edited December 10, 2023 by Rory

[BPM Again]

8 hours ago, AGPar said:

It would mean absolutely nothing of the sort. You're simply characterising it in that manner to somehow strengthen your argument that Rankin needs emptied. You'll be well aware that our game in hand is against a Cove Rangers side who (a) have won their last seven straight league games and 8 including the SC and (b) we have performed woefully against since we started playing them a few years ago - 6 points gained from an available 24.

You dropped a couple of points at a difficult venue today and we took advantage, just as we dropped a couple of points at a difficult venue 11/12 days ago and you took advantage. I've seen nothing whatsoever to suggest it won't be that sort of title race well into next year, and possibly all the way through to May. Dunfermline had already taken a firm stranglehold on the league by this time last year and never looked like relinquishing it. And yet, after 16 games they had gained 35 points - both clubs are currently ahead of that, and we've played a game less. I'd love us to be doing what they did last season, but have pretty much accepted that the consistency and form of Hamilton means that is almost certainly not going to happen. That's why every draw or defeat for either side - and we'll have them sooner or later - is being magnified. Apart from a period in January/February Dunfermline never had to contend with any sort of genuine threat, and from March the cigars were out.

At this stage I would not be hugely surprised by any scenario - Falkirk win it/Hamilton win it/both of us still flailing about at this level in 12 months time whilst Cove are back playing Championship football. Bugger all will be decided next week and we are under pressure too - any Falkirk fan who does not have their head in the clouds (and admittedly that excludes an ever-increasing percentage of our fanbase) will be  very, very wary of our tendency to shit the bed in the biggest way possible in any game that matters flaring up again next Saturday. It's simply happened too often. If we cannot eradicate that we will be going absolutely nowhere.

I always think fans who watch their team week in week out are the best to judge their manager. I agree it looks insane from our perspective to be wanting their manager dumped is they lose next week but as I say these people have watched this manager for 18 months. We haven’t. 
Although they are top we have been more consistent over the last 4 - 6 weeks if you take cups into consideration so maybe some of the frustration comes from those results too. 

[accies1874]

7 hours ago, Beckford said:

Not exactly been Rankins biggest fan and he got a lot wrong today, but there is no way a (relatively) rookie manager is getting sacked sitting joint top of the league. The board have backed him and think they will contine to do so. The board changes have been the big positive for me this season. We have the right guys running the club now, but we need the manager to find his best team, stop tinkering with it and stop making crazy subs.

He seems a decent guy and can't question his commitment. Any time i have spoken to board members at the ground, they always talk about how good the dressing room is and the bond the squad has. Players egos are fragile though and constantly changing  the team can have a negative effect if the man management is not bang on. Players usually look as confused or pi%@÷d off as the rest of us when subbed.

 

Based on speaking to players after the cup final and being on their flight home from Coleraine, I definitely get the impression that Rankin keeps a happy dressing room. He seems to value the team-building and morale boost of them, for example, going on a bender after the cup final, even if it results in us getting pumped 7-0 the next week. That's not enough to avoid relegation or win a title, but I do think he's shown enough so far this season to suggest that he can get us promoted. 

Quote

Oh and as raised on Accies World, can we please work on corners as ours have zero threat. Saw one in the first half were we tried something that looked like it came from the training ground, but when it didn't come off we went straight back to the usual 

The one in the first half was the exact same routine we scored from against Annan, so it seems that we only pose a threat when going short. I find it hard to believe that our routines have suddenly gone to shit after scoring from so many set-pieces last season, so it's got to be a combination of having shite takers and missing O'Reilly. 

[Beckford]

O'Reilly leaving was a strange one for me for the exact reason highlighted. He had his flaws that are still evident and i cant comment on the reasons for him leaving, but without him we would have scored even fewer goals last season. He was the only player we had that could attack a corner and the goals he scored showed that. We don't have a player like that now so the corners need to change to suit the players we have. 

[Magic Hat]

14 hours ago, Ian Mcleod said:

Again today for the second time in a couple of months a section of Alloa fans showed their lack of class and smashed 2 windows of the accies supporters bus luckily it was only the outside window so nobody was injured still embarrassing from those Alloa fans.

That is embarrassing, stupid little idiots. Quite why they would attack a Hamilton supporters bus is beyond me and from decent Alloa fans you have our apologies.

Since COVID, every team seems to have them unfortunately and the lack of police action makes them think they can do what they want.

If the police don't start taking action against these idiots it is only going to get worse. Things like this become tit for tat, which does nobody any good.

Edited December 10, 2023 by Magic Hat

[Bert Raccoon]

Really was just one of those days and I don't think we could complain if Alloa got the points. Frustrating watching us play high balls when we clearly weren't winning them and we looked decent when we had the ball on the deck. 

Think the players could sense our frustration with Scott Martin coming over to the fans at full time so hopefully he can motivate the players for a huge game next week 

[FuzzyBear]

1 hour ago, accies1874 said:

Based on speaking to players after the cup final and being on their flight home from Coleraine, I definitely get the impression that Rankin keeps a happy dressing room. He seems to value the team-building and morale boost of them, for example, going on a bender after the cup final, even if it results in us getting pumped 7-0 the next week. That's not enough to avoid relegation or win a title, but I do think he's shown enough so far this season to suggest that he can get us promoted. 

The one in the first half was the exact same routine we scored from against Annan, so it seems that we only pose a threat when going short. I find it hard to believe that our routines have suddenly gone to shit after scoring from so many set-pieces last season, so it's got to be a combination of having shite takers and missing O'Reilly. 

A bit wierd that folk are saying on WAH facebook page that they thought O'Brien did ok. He was awful and could easily have cost us 3 goals.

[accies1874]

1 hour ago, Magic Hat said:

That is embarrassing, stupid little idiots. Quite why they would attack a Hamilton supporters bus is beyond me and from decent Alloa fans you have our apologies.

Since COVID, every team seems to have them unfortunately and the lack of police action makes them think they can do what they want.

If the police don't start taking action against these idiots it is only going to get worse. Things like this become tit for tat, which does nobody any good.

The sole policeman told the Alloa fannies that they'll "just all shite yourselves and run away when they (Accies fans) get off the bus." Thought that was actually quite funny. 

7 minutes ago, FuzzyBear said:

A bit wierd that folk are saying on WAH facebook page that they thought O'Brien did ok. He was awful and could easily have cost us 3 goals.

It was the most predictable half-time sub of all time. 

[Owsley 2]

2 hours ago, Beckford said:

O'Reilly leaving was a strange one for me for the exact reason highlighted. He had his flaws that are still evident and i cant comment on the reasons for him leaving, but without him we would have scored even fewer goals last season. He was the only player we had that could attack a corner and the goals he scored showed that. We don't have a player like that now so the corners need to change to suit the players we have. 

How difficult is it to attack a corner? I don't understand why our taller players like Kilday and McGowan never seem to make runs to attack it or flick it on. Of course it doesn't help when they are woefully overhit like happened twice yesterday. I wasn't at Annan but the only other goal I can remember from a corner was Tumilty's shot in the home game against Annan. 

As we all knew at the time, that was a stonewall penalty when O'Hara was felled by the keeper. Didn't see anything in the handball claim on half time. 

Edited December 10, 2023 by Owsley 2

[Todd_is_God]

23 minutes ago, Owsley 2 said:

How difficult is it to attack a corner?

Very when the ball is an inswinger and still about 6 yards in the air as it goes out of play beyond the far post.