Chilli D (Saints) vs Mika B (Sinners) - Sat 16th Dec 2023

['WellDel]

35 minutes ago, pozbaird said:

Only if he fancies backing up Ayunga, Nahmani, Olyusanya, Greive, Mandron, and Jamieson. Obika was a popular player with us. Did us a turn, etc. Was never going to be Earling Haaland, but wasn’t a waste of a wage or anything.

7th choice striker? That would be about right in my book.

[Molotov]

12 minutes ago, Arch Stanton said:

Or Shaughnessy's v Dundee at SMP.

Yeah. Difference with big Joe’s was he didn’t meant it. Let’s believe that Kyle had a brain fart and thought he was still playing for Saints!  

[djchapsticks]

2 hours ago, 'WellDel said:

As for Obika, Saints can have him back  if they want him, he's been absolutely ganting. After his contribution yesterday I'd say big Thelonius deserves the place up top alongside Mika.

I don't think there's many Saints fans who would ask for or want him back to be fair. Certainly not now.

He did a job for us with 20 goals over two seasons but his second season was nowhere near as good as the first and he ran into a couple of bad injuries after leaving us which made it a strange one that Motherwell signed him but even stranger that they kept him on permanently.

['WellDel]

9 hours ago, djchapsticks said:

I don't think there's many Saints fans who would ask for or want him back to be fair. Certainly not now.

He did a job for us with 20 goals over two seasons but his second season was nowhere near as good as the first and he ran into a couple of bad injuries after leaving us which made it a strange one that Motherwell signed him but even stranger that they kept him on permanently.

Aye, I was only joking as we're playing each other next and he was a kinda cult hero type figure with you more than an outstanding player, who I'd be happy to leave in Paisley (or anywhere else for that matter). Don't think his numbers have ever been great at any point, and he has more appearances to his name on the treatment table than he has in the 'goals for' column. 

Mental that we took him on permanently after a very average, and mostly injured loan spell. Who'd have seen just more of the same coming?. He's done, and for all he doesn't score much either (i.e. at all) at least playing Bair would give us a bit more energy, and your defence a better run around. 

[flyingscot]

43 minutes ago, 'WellDel said:

Don't think his numbers have ever been great at any point, and he has more appearances to his name on the treatment table than he has in the 'goals for' column. 

He had 8 league goals in about 26 starts in the Covid season and was probably on for a couple more if it had run to conclusion, but only 5 for the next season. When he left a few fans were unsure but think that is because Main (and Brophy to an extent) struggled under Goodwin.

Biereth looks to be a cracking player - particularly cause it seems like he's playing injured right now.  

[capt_oats]

11 hours ago, djchapsticks said:

I don't think there's many Saints fans who would ask for or want him back to be fair. Certainly not now.

He did a job for us with 20 goals over two seasons but his second season was nowhere near as good as the first and he ran into a couple of bad injuries after leaving us which made it a strange one that Motherwell signed him but even stranger that they kept him on permanently.

Tbh, it's not really strange that we signed him.

We picked him up because Mandron had lasted 1 (ONE) game before immediately getting injured and missing the next couple of months. We were into the closing stages of the window and it was a case of taking what we could get who vaguely fitted the profile for that role. Like, the deal was done that late that we announced him after the window had "slammed shut".

In short, in this particular window Jon Obika was the equivalent of it being 3am at The Garage for us.

It wouldn't have been everyone's choice but him sticking around still had a reasonable degree of logic - Kettlewell was sticking with the same shape that had worked for him last season so we needed someone to play the role of the foil to our main striker (KVV last season, Biereth this season) which both Obika and Mandron filled and in their respective time on the park Obika had shown himself to be the better all round option. It was a Devil you know sort of situation.

It was mentioned in a Kettlewell interview that we had a conversation with Mandron about sticking around but the implication was that he either wanted more money or minutes on the park (or both) than we were willing to offer.

Presumably Obika was more willing to accept the pitch we made and I'd imagine that the injury issues meant he was in less of a position to make demands that weren't a good fit for the fact that we were significantly cutting our budget this season.

Edited December 11, 2023 by capt_oats

[djchapsticks]

47 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

Tbh, it's not really strange that we signed him.

We picked him up because Mandron had lasted 1 (ONE) game before immediately getting injured and missing the next couple of months. We were into the closing stages of the window and it was a case of taking what we could get who vaguely fitted the profile for that role. Like, the deal was done that late that we announced him after the window had "slammed shut".

In short, in this particular window Jon Obika was the equivalent of it being 3am at The Garage for us.

It wouldn't have been everyone's choice but him sticking around still had a reasonable degree of logic - Kettlewell was sticking with the same shape that had worked for him last season so we needed someone to play the role of the foil to our main striker (KVV last season, Biereth this season) which both Obika and Mandron filled and in their respective time on the park Obika had shown himself to be the better all round option. It was a Devil you know sort of situation.

It was mentioned in a Kettlewell interview that we had a conversation with Mandron about sticking around but the implication was that he either wanted more money or minutes on the park (or both) than we were willing to offer.

Presumably Obika was more willing to accept the pitch we made and I'd imagine that the injury issues meant he was in less of a position to make demands that weren't a good fit for the fact that we were significantly cutting our budget this season.

Fair play, forgot that Motherwell made a pretty last minute scattergun effort in the January window.

[well fan for life]

57 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

Fair play, forgot that Motherwell made a pretty last minute scattergun effort in the January window.

The January deadline day smash & grab is always a good laugh. Will they be good (Marvin Johnson), bad (Riku Danzaki) or imaginary (Eddie Nolan)? 

As far as this fixture goes we'll concede at least one complete howler as our Scotland International goal keeper continues to play like he's been on the hallucinogens in the changing room and our defence are leaking like a fucked fridge. 

And we'll throw 6 forwards on at some point. 

[Busta Nut]

Going to this. Expect to be in the pub at 3.30pm

[Molotov]

Looking forward to this game. It’s usually an entertaining game and the match thread invariably gets banterific! 

[Bobby_F]

19 hours ago, wellboy1991 said:

He really is a top class player. Which is why his injury screwed us so much. Alongside the injury to Lennon Miller and the subsequent requirement to fanny about with the team so much hasn’t helped us in this horrendous run. 

Cant see us getting a win this weekend but also fancy us to maybe get a draw. Aslong as Kettlewell sticks with Gent and Davor in the starting 11 and drops Obika. 

I don't think many Saints realised how much we'd missed Ayunga when he was out for 9 months.

Maybe because Main was getting most of the plaudits last season.

Still getting back up to speed, but Saturday showed what a big miss he was, and hard not to think if we'd not lost him for the last 3-4 months of the season that we wouldn't have picked up a few more points and pipped Hibs for Europe (Having said that, looking at what happened to Hibs...)

[Handsome_Devil]

I actually think we'll be broadly competitive here but St Mirren are more than competent enough to benefit from our usual howlers...surely this'll be the final nail for SK.

[Muzz1886]

I fully expect us to get our arses handed back to us in a cloche on Saturday.  Get the popcorn ready, the resultant fan implosion could be an entertaining watch.

[well fan for life]

49 minutes ago, Muzz1886 said:

I fully expect us to get our arses handed back to us in a cloche on Saturday.  Get the popcorn ready, the resultant fan implosion could be an entertaining watch.

I'm not even sure there will be tbh. It's a weird apathetic atmosphere round Fir Park right now. Compare going 1-0 on Saturday to losing to Sligo/Raith Rovers or McGhee getting pummelled for a month solid before he got hunted and it's very different. 

[capt_oats]

13 minutes ago, well fan for life said:

I'm not even sure there will be tbh. It's a weird apathetic atmosphere round Fir Park right now. Compare going 1-0 on Saturday to losing to Sligo/Raith Rovers or McGhee getting pummelled for a month solid before he got hunted and it's very different. 

Aye. As I said in our thread both Alexander and McGhee were managers a section of the support actively disliked from the outset so they didn't need much of an invitation to kick off. Similarly it was the players who got the Apostrophe Monster treatment for ruining Club Legend Steven Hammell's legacy.

With Kettlewell there were probably pretty low expectations when he got the job which he subsequently outperformed and with the fact his contract is up in the summer I think there's a kind of acceptance he's done. It's just a case of waiting for an announcement he's been binned rather than anyone needing to get the spray paint out.

Edited December 11, 2023 by capt_oats

[djchapsticks]

Out of interest, if Kettlewell does get binned before Saturday, who steps in?

We're fast approaching that point we hit last season where any replacements aren't full blown managerial changes but 'interim' appointments and it's interesting to see of all interim appointments last season in the top flight (Kettlewell, Naismith, Robson, Goodwin) that Goodwin is the only one you could genuinely say has been a success despite having the worst interim spell of all of them - albeit now in a lower league.

Also I mentioned it elsewhere but not 100% sure...am I right in saying both of Motherwell's previous managers have come in after their predecessors were pumped right before they played us and both stand-ins, later permanent gaffers, opened their accounts with wins over us?

[well fan for life]

7 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

Out of interest, if Kettlewell does get binned before Saturday, who steps in?

David Clarkson.

Only because he's the current youth academy guy and that's about as far as any of our searches for a new manager go.

[capt_oats]

10 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

Out of interest, if Kettlewell does get binned before Saturday, who steps in?

We're fast approaching that point we hit last season where any replacements aren't full blown managerial changes but 'interim' appointments and it's interesting to see of all interim appointments last season in the top flight (Kettlewell, Naismith, Robson, Goodwin) that Goodwin is the only one you could genuinely say has been a success despite having the worst interim spell of all of them - albeit now in a lower league.

Also I mentioned it elsewhere but not 100% sure...am I right in saying both of Motherwell's previous managers have come in after their predecessors were pumped right before they played us and both stand-ins, later permanent gaffers, opened their accounts with wins over us?

He won't be binned before Saturday but hypothetically, if he was as @well fan for life says I'd imagine it'd be David Clarkson.

Not to be contrary but I don't think you could say that Kettlewell hasn't been a success. I mean, he still has a win % of 41.67 - he's still won more than he's lost in fact he's only lost 11 of 36 - 8 of which have been on this run.

I mentioned this in our thread but Kettlewell's time at the club has had a very heavy "supply teacher" energy in so much as he's permanent manager in name but he's never really felt like an actual Motherwell manager to me (Hammell had a similar sort of thing - he just never really felt credibly like our manager).

Deciding whether or not he's been a success really depends on what the objectives he was given were. His priority would have been to keep us up, which he did - comfortably.

Edited December 11, 2023 by capt_oats

[Handsome_Devil]

8 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

Out of interest, if Kettlewell does get binned before Saturday, who steps in?

We're fast approaching that point we hit last season where any replacements aren't full blown managerial changes but 'interim' appointments and it's interesting to see of all interim appointments last season in the top flight (Kettlewell, Naismith, Robson, Goodwin) that Goodwin is the only one you could genuinely say has been a success despite having the worst interim spell of all of them - albeit now in a lower league.

Also I mentioned it elsewhere but not 100% sure...am I right in saying both of Motherwell's previous managers have come in after their predecessors were pumped right before they played us and both stand-ins, later permanent gaffers, opened their accounts with wins over us?

I would assume Clarkson as youth chief but surely we will look beyond our own backyard this time.

Hammell came in with about 48 hours notice to win 1-0 at St Mirren, Kettlewell started 2-1 at home and Alexander iirc started 1-1 at St Mirren with a late penalty cancelling Cole's opener.

[Al B]

Hammell wasn't even being considered for the job until after the St Mirren win. It was literally a "holy shit, that was unexpected! Do you want it?" scenario.