Group C 🇸🇮🇩🇰🇷🇸🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿

[vikingTON]

Turgid as they are, there are still two issues that might make England go far in the tournament:

1) They'll likely be better once Shaw returns at left back - not because he's actually good, but because simply having a live, actual left back will stop them from being so ridiculously lop-sided when attacking. It's much easier to mark Saka etc. out the game when there's absolutely no threat on the opposite wing. 

2) Bellingham could be moved to central midfielder, instead of their joke 'Trent'/''Connor Gallagher' options. He was only pushed further up the park at Real Madrid to solve a major weakness in their squad at the start of the season; England have a parade of attacking midfielders who can do that job instead. 

A competent manager and country that hadn't already anointed Bellingham as the best player on the continent would recognise that and make the change to be a more effective team. In 'Gareth' and the English media we trust. 

[Fuctifano]

As shite as England have been, they're almost certainly still going to win the group and end up on the soft side of the draw (bottom half) yet-a-fucking-gain.

Spain definitely in top half and Germany will be as well unless they lose to Switzerland. You can probably book France making an arse of it vs Netherlands and ending up in the top half too. 

 

[Claudia Gentile]

[DiegoDiego]

Gareth Southgate always reads the terms and conditions.

[Red Kite]

16 minutes ago, PauloPerth said:

Na, there’s only one manager Gazza should have signed for, and that’s Fergie.  Would have gone on to be one of the best in the world going on how good he was in his early twenties under Alex.  And I’m no Man Utd fan. 

The history books prove you are correct, in terms of how Fergie built his sides and proved he could develop players.  Plus, we got knocked off our perch.  At the time though, we had Peter Beardsley who Gazza knew and was a great pro and were not doing badly.  I may sound over the top, but I never doubted that if you came to Liverpool with the right attitude that you would develop as a player.

[Alert Mongoose]

2 hours ago, Florentine_Pogen said:

We know it is an experiment, and we know we don’t have a natural replacement for a Kalvin Phillips.

 

[Pocketman]

was driving back and listening to Radio 5 Live.

Whilst acknowledging the poor performance and the fans reaction with loud booing at the end, there is always this reluctance amongst the pundits to fully describe performances and the team as to how they are - there is a compulsion for spin in that, they consider that this is after all England we are talking about.

So inevitably the grinding out of a draw when playing badly is projected as an outcome synonymous with league/trophy winning teams. And there is general consensus with that point. Utterly bewildering delusional stuff. 

[Zetterlund]

5 minutes ago, Pocketman said:

was driving back and listening to Radio 5 Live.

Whilst acknowledging the poor performance and the fans reaction with loud booing at the end, there is always this reluctance amongst the pundits to fully describe performances and the team as to how they are - there is a compulsion for spin in that, they consider that this is after all England we are talking about.

So inevitably the grinding out of a draw when playing badly is projected as an outcome synonymous with league/trophy winning teams. And there is general consensus with that point. Utterly bewildering delusional stuff. 

I was also driving, in the middle of nowhere and the only station I could pick up for the game was TalkSport. No such concerns there with calling out poor performances - the commentators were absolutely scathing throughout, which was rather entertaining.

[Chripper]

Shaw is s very good left back and will bring balance, but last I heard he'll only be fit to play after the group stage.

Bellingham Is a fantastic player, but he reminds me a lot of Steven Gerrard and Lampard, he always empties the midfield and want to roam forward.

Gerrard and Lampard weren't playmakers.

About a year of so ago (Before Bellingham joined Real Madrid) Gareth Southgate said that Bellingham is a floating 10.

He isn't a playmaker. He's the type of player who will be on the end of passes/crosses rather than create.

Gary Neville tonight reiterated my point. England simply don't have a playmaker. Dropping Bellingham deep won't solve that. Mainoo isn't ready to play for England, and even when he is ready, he isn's in that mould. Wharton looks like a younger Rice.

I remember Gary Neville, after Scotland drew with England, saying that McGregor, Hanley, McGinn, Tierney, McTominay and Gilmour were better on the ball than Rice, Phillips, Stones, etc.

He also said that England don't have a Gilmour. Three years on and it's still true.

Watch from 2:30 for the aforementioned quote:

 

 

 

Edited June 20 by SlayerX

[blackislekillie]

1 hour ago, DiegoDiego said:

Gareth Southgate always reads the terms and conditions.

Gareth Southgate never boils or overheats soup.

[throbber]

 

[throbber]

 

both of these made me lol

[Richey Edwards]

8 hours ago, SlayerX said:

Shaw is s very good left back and will bring balance

 

 

That was Anakin and not Luke.

[KirkieRR]

Poor England fans.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/28610752/england-fans-zombieland-frankfurt-drug-addicts-euros/

As it happens I've changed trains in the main Frankfurt bahnhof. It was clean, bright and unthreatening. And I brought a smashin' bratwurst roll.

[Lex]

8 hours ago, Pocketman said:

 

So inevitably the grinding out of a draw when playing badly is projected as an outcome synonymous with league/trophy winning teams. And there is general consensus with that point. Utterly bewildering delusional stuff. 

Well this is all true. England are through after two games with minimum fuss and no injuries or suspensions. They’re clearly amongst the favourites for the tournament.
They also had a turgid draw in their second match at the last euros - against Scotland - and went on to make the final. 
How you get through the group stage has no relevance on how you’ll do later on. Portugal famously got through their group in 2016 in 3rd place with 3 turgid draws and 3 points, they finished below Iceland Hungary, and they then went on to win the whole thing. 

[Jambomo]

59 minutes ago, KirkieRR said:

Poor England fans.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/28610752/england-fans-zombieland-frankfurt-drug-addicts-euros/

As it happens I've changed trains in the main Frankfurt bahnhof. It was clean, bright and unthreatening. And I brought a smashin' bratwurst roll.

Tbf we were on holiday back in 2012 and stayed in Frankfurt near the train station and it was something else.

It was every bit as bad as they say, even back then. We walked to the hotel and some guy walked towards us and he was pissing himself as he walked. The place next door to the hotel got raided at 3am one morning of our trip and we had to put the table up against our hotel door as there were folk going around all night. Sadly back then we didn’t have the money to change hotels. 

Then there was the legendary rubber man, whom we named because he was doing drugs in the doorway opposite and he’d sway bend backwards, forwards, sideways when he stood but we never saw him fall over. It might be the only place I’ve felt genuinely scared and I’ve lived in some right shitholes.

[Chripper]

Gareth Southgate just cannot win in some quarters.

If Palmer plays instead of Foden (and the performance is the same) fans and the media will lambast him for leaving out Foden.

If Mainoo plays instead of Trent (and the performance is the same) fans and the media will lambast him for leaving out Trent.

Etc.

If the Media and fans think someone like Potter is going to going to alter things, they're in for a rude awakening.

Gareth Southgate has overachieved.

Edited June 21 by SlayerX

[kennie makevin]

9 hours ago, Pocketman said:

was driving back and listening to Radio 5 Live.

Whilst acknowledging the poor performance and the fans reaction with loud booing at the end, there is always this reluctance amongst the pundits to fully describe performances and the team as to how they are - there is a compulsion for spin in that, they consider that this is after all England we are talking about.

 

 

So inevitably the grinding out of a draw when playing badly is projected as an outcome synonymous with league/trophy winning teams. And there is general consensus with that point. Utterly bewildering delusional stuff. 

 

 Obviously you have your sources but I haven't come across any projection of yesterday's turgid draw 'as an outcome synonymous with league/trophy winning teams' from England fans or media. Quite the opposite. Even the beeb are having a go at St Harry of Kane. I'd say this is the most worryingly level headed English fanbase/media I can remember at an international tournament. 

Edited June 21 by kennie makevin

[Chripper]

13 hours ago, Melanius Mullarkey said:

Oh no. Gary Linwoker has criticised Harry Kane for being a useless lazy c**t.

Hell be getting pelters.

I'd be careful with that.

The only people who weaponize the term "woke" is people like Nigel Farage, Tommy Robinson and people who like political, racial and social injustice.

Edited June 21 by SlayerX

[Red Kite]

44 minutes ago, Lex said:

Well this is all true. England are through after two games with minimum fuss and no injuries or suspensions. They’re clearly amongst the favourites for the tournament.
They also had a turgid draw in their second match at the last euros - against Scotland - and went on to make the final. 
How you get through the group stage has no relevance on how you’ll do later on. Portugal famously got through their group in 2016 in 3rd place with 3 turgid draws and 3 points, they finished below Iceland Hungary, and they then went on to win the whole thing. 

I have given this a greenie because it is correct and you can say that is all matters.  However, we just seem to create our own problems and bring pressure on the manager and team.  I can greenie opposing opinions as to how good Luke Shaw is, because recognising there should be a specialist left-back playing now is the issue.  If you want to quell criticism that the players are over-hyped, looking like you are half-arseing it does not help.  I just see the same issues, with players being shoehorned in which makes it look like the manager can't make unpopular decisions.  The usual scapegoat role -currently TAA, who plays at club level with players who give him options.   Folk feeling the manager can't recognise which subs to bring on etc.