The Falkirk FC Thread

[ilostmyself]

 

39 minutes ago, EdiBairn said:

I wish people would stop with this 'it's only been 2 games, you can't criticise Hartley'.

The results are beside the point and not what people are complaining about. The issue people have is with the performances which haven't improved since the first game of pre-season, since which point we've had about 12 or 13 games. And it's the same issues that we're still having.

It's only been 2 games, you can't criticise Hartley

[ShaggerG]

1 hour ago, Shodwall cat said:

Theres still no excuse if your signing players early in May even if they are second choice which i doubt and they still end up to be feckin useless. These players have still been scouted for months and are not last minute punts. 

None of them signed in early May.

Hartley had near enough a full squad to build and had to get on with it or we could have been struggling to field a team at the start of competitive action. Dallison, Sammut and Owen-Evans haven't looked great, but hardly 'feckin useless'. Harrison has looked very steady, quite dominant at times in fact IMO. Lewis I also think could offer something if played in the correct position. 

The issue, I think, is more to do with the apparent fact that the team aren't gelling for some reason rather than individual players being bad. Hartley tinkering with the formation and seemingly being a bit too cautious has certainly something to do with that. I think he needs to fix a formation and stick to it. IMO that should be 3-5-2 because I think it's most suited to the players that we have.

Just to be clear also, I'm not in anyway defending what Hartley has done so far this season, I've been as disappointed as anyone else and would obviously have preferred us to hit the ground running. I don't think he particularly endears himself to folk either, the way he answers wee Lewis's questions when interviewed being an example. Reacts like he's asking him personal questions!

I'm not about to give up on us just yet though although, I admit, the signs don't look great.

[Shodwall cat]

1 hour ago, ShaggerG said:

None of them signed in early May.

Hartley had near enough a full squad to build and had to get on with it or we could have been struggling to field a team at the start of competitive action. Dallison, Sammut and Owen-Evans haven't looked great, but hardly 'feckin useless'. Harrison has looked very steady, quite dominant at times in fact IMO. Lewis I also think could offer something if played in the correct position. 

The issue, I think, is more to do with the apparent fact that the team aren't gelling for some reason rather than individual players being bad. Hartley tinkering with the formation and seemingly being a bit too cautious has certainly something to do with that. I think he needs to fix a formation and stick to it. IMO that should be 3-5-2 because I think it's most suited to the players that we have.

Just to be clear also, I'm not in anyway defending what Hartley has done so far this season, I've been as disappointed as anyone else and would obviously have preferred us to hit the ground running. I don't think he particularly endears himself to folk either, the way he answers wee Lewis's questions when interviewed being an example. Reacts like he's asking him personal questions!

I'm not about to give up on us just yet though although, I admit, the signs don't look great.

Ok not early May but May none the less. Dallison was announced on the 18th and brough not long after. He'd scouted the likes of him and brough for months so theres no excuse for not signing players that can do an excellent job at this level.  Jack Ross had to rebuild a team last season but they still managed to pump us day one and win 4 out of their first 5.  Having had a full pre season, 4 league cup games , 2 league games and a challenge cup we should have a settled formation and team by now but we're nowhere near that and there have been better players available up here than some of these guys we've brought up from down south with  much fanfare.

Edited August 22, 2018 by Shodwall cat

[bairney]

8 hours ago, DeeBairn said:

I think we got more for McGrandles than we did for Fulton. Should have been on a Par. We've lost players for a lot less than they were worth, either due to not selling early enough or not getting them on an extension. I know we all like seeing good players stay, but if they then leave for pennies then that's a loss. Sibbald being a great example. 

What did we get for Arfield, or did he walk?

[Grangemouth Bairn]

9 minutes ago, bairney said:

What did we get for Arfield, or did he walk?

From memory it was 400k up front with add ons mate.

[Russ]

I wish people would stop with this 'it's only been 2 games, you can't criticise Hartley'.
The results are beside the point and not what people are complaining about. The issue people have is with the performances which haven't improved since the first game of pre-season, since which point we've had about 12 or 13 games. And it's the same issues that we're still having.

Except that’s not what anyone’s is saying is it?

Nobody has been happy with the level of performance so far. But with a brand new squad of players we’re going to need more than just 2 league games (I’ll get to the rest later) for everything to click and start working. Hartley has absolutely made mistakes with his line-ups so far but going by the Rangers Colts game he’s acknowledged it wasn’t working and changed the shape of the team. This might not be the greatest example and it’s clearly a whole different level of the sport but look at Pep Guardiola at Man City it took him a full season to properly get his style of play and management across to the players and play the way he wants. There’s no quick fix or magic wand in football everything takes time.

Now like I’ve said the standard of performance has not been good enough, you are absolutely correct. But since pre-season? If that implies you actually care about the performance in friendlies then you really need to get in the fucking sea. As for the cup games it’s already been pointed out here many times and Hartley even said himself during the roadshows that he was solely using the competition as glorified friendlies to get players fitness levels up. Now if you think that wasn’t the right idea then fair enough. Again whilst performances in the comparison was fairly shite we still finished second in the group and it was only really the Montrose result that saw us being eliminated.

[Russ]

 Jack Ross had to rebuild a team last season but they still managed to pump us day one and win 4 out of their first 5.

In the first game against us last season only 2 of St. Mirrens starting 11 had never played a league game for them before (Ian McShane and Gavin Reilly).

Our first game against ICT this season our starting 11 only 2 players had played a league game for us before (Jordan McGhee and Aaron Muirhead).

Not knocking Jack Ross at all but it’s hardly the same kind of re-build going on with the amount of players we’ve brought in.

[Guest Back Post Misses]

Ayr certainly look way better than almost everyone expected. Alloa look to be considerably better than Brechin.
Probably ICT and QotS are seen as the two clubs who have gone significantly on the slide. One of them has already beaten us on our patch, and if the other repeats the act on Saturday, then I don’t think we have big enough alarm bells to sound out just how bad it’s about to get.
in recent years, the word “unravelling” is justified on a few occasions. Those moments when what looked like a reasonable stable situation from the outside simply falls to pieces in double quick time.
Rangers, Hearts, Dundee, Livingston, Fifers, Gretna, Motherwell are all examples of clubs unravelling financially (in some cases, more than once). It’s a rare thing to see a club completely unravel in a footballing sense. Doing it financially gets you into the top flight (see above, and ignore the b*****it of how damaging it is to those poor wee souls).
Doing it in a football sense is probably much more damaging. That alienates supporters from the club. Doing it financially unites supporters to the club.
If we are beaten on Saturday, then this entire project is very much on course to unravel before September is done, and while Hartley will be the fall guy, there’s going to be plenty of others who played their part in it.
 

The plan is CC’s and ML’s.

If it goes wrong then they are as culpable as Hartley IMO. Their plan and their choice of manager.

Would you trust them to pick a Hartley replacement if it comes to that?

[RC55 FFC]

[Bairney The Dinosaur]

Praying the Chairwoman and CEO are not as knee-jerk as some on here.

[Sgt Bilko]

We all know that the performances so far have been bad. 

Looking at the league and irn-bru Cup games, most people would agree that there has been 1 bad and 1 good half  in those games. 

Surely this means that the so called mess we have apparently signed are more than capable of listening to the managers instructions. 

Being realistic bringing in that amount of players was always going to be a risk and was never going to just click over night. Majority of whom have never even played mens football.  

I'm no different to anyone else on here, I want my team to win and I want to see some nice football (even some effort). But realistically this surely was always going to be a long term effort much to our disgruntlement. 

Problem is that we all bought into the "we're going to win the league" followed by all the signings but that's what sells season tickets, so at least the commercial side of the club knows how to perform. 

Edited August 22, 2018 by Sgt Bilko

[EdiBairn]

I think Saturday will tell us a lot. If we see an improved performance, there's every chance we can put the last 7 games behind us and have a good season.

No improvement however and it's unlikely we'll get anything at Ross County or Ayr either. That would leave us with 0 from 15 and the Board of Directors with a big decision to make. Personally, I'd make that decision on Saturday evening.

Edited August 22, 2018 by EdiBairn

[Falkirk_Bairn_1983]

30 minutes ago, Back Post Misses said:

 

The plan is CC’s and ML’s.

If it goes wrong then they are as culpable as Hartley IMO. Their plan and their choice of manager.

Would you trust them to pick a Hartley replacement if it comes to that?

 

 

The thing is they appointed someone that 99% of the support were very happy with. They have supported him very well in January and in the summer signing numerous players and getting rid of the deadwood that Hartley deemed surplus to requirements. 

Obviously they need to take responsibility for appointing Hartley but he was the obvious choice at the time that the supporters were very happy with. 

I bet they wish they gave it to McIntyre now or Kerr and miller.

Edited August 22, 2018 by Falkirk_Bairn_1983

[Guest Back Post Misses]

 
The thing is they appointed someone that 99% of the support were very happy with. They have supported him very well in January and in the summer signing numerous players and getting rid of the deadwood that Hartley deemed surplus to requirements. 
Obviously they need to take responsibility for appointing Hartley but he was the obvious choice at the time that the supporters were very happy with. 
I bet they wish they gave it to McIntyre now or Kerr and miller.

Hindsight is easy now but maybe leaving the Smith/McCardle/Kerr in charge for more than just two games was the way to go. I didn’t think so at the time but now maybe we should have.

[Guest Back Post Misses]

We all know that the performances so far have been bad. 
Looking at the league and irn-bru Cup games, most people would agree that there has been 1 bad and 1 good half  in those games. 
Surely this means that the so called mess we have apparently signed are more than capable of listening to the managers instructions. 
Being realistic bringing in that amount of players was always going to be a risk and was never going to just click over night. Majority of whom have never even played mens football.  
I'm no different to anyone else on here, I want my team to win and I want to see some nice football (even some effort). But realistically this surely was always going to be a long term effort much to our disgruntlement. 
Problem is that we all bought into the "we're going to win the league" followed by all the signings but that's what sells season tickets, so at least the commercial side of the club knows how to perform. 

I don’t see this good half bad half. I think we have been awful for most of the time.

[Russ]

This thread btw.

Just when you think you’ve read everything someone comes up with a belter. Aye bet the board are fucking gutted they didn’t give the job to Miller and Kerr last year.

Absolute mentalist.

[Falkirk_Bairn_1983]

Just now, Back Post Misses said:

 

Hindsight is easy now but maybe leaving the Smith/McCardle/Kerr in charge for more than just two games was the way to go. I didn’t think so at the time but now maybe we should have.

 

Yes hindsight is a wonderful thing. If Houston coukd go back he wouldn't have signed Loy on at least double the wages of most of the squad which destroyed the dressing room I was told.

 

 

 

[Falkirk_Bairn_1983]

4 minutes ago, Russ said:

This thread btw.

Just when you think you’ve read everything someone comes up with a belter. Aye bet the board are fucking gutted they didn’t give the job to Miller and Kerr last year.

Absolute mentalist.

They were on the shortlist along with Hartley and McIntyre.

Edited August 22, 2018 by Falkirk_Bairn_1983

[ShaggerG]

6 minutes ago, Russ said:

This thread btw.

Just when you think you’ve read everything someone comes up with a belter. Aye bet the board are fucking gutted they didn’t give the job to Miller and Kerr last year.

Absolute mentalist.

Can you imagine the seethe if we'd gone with Miller & Kerr and it went tits up? (which it likely would have) 'f**k's sake, there was an experienced ambitious guy like Paul Hartley available and we give the job to two rookies'!!  

[ShaggerG]

1 hour ago, Grangemouth Bairn said:

From memory it was 400k up front with add ons mate.

I think it was £375k up front as I seem to remember that it matched the fee that Celtic paid for Yogi, which was our previous highest. There were add-on's as well though.