When will indyref2 happen?

[oneteaminglasgow]

Can you show me where it says that in their manifesto?

[Donathan]

So not "AV" then?

[NotThePars]

Well I suppose if pedantry is the only victory you can take then go for it.

[Colkitto]

Alan Bissett nails it. I imagine the SNP just want to get to the Summer recess and recharge the batteries. I'm hoping they come out all guns blazing and take heed of Bissett's observations

 

[Baxter Parp]

2 hours ago, Donathan said:

So not "AV" then?

Fucksake.

[McSpreader]

30 minutes ago, Colkitto said:

Alan Bissett nails it. I imagine the SNP just want to get to the Summer recess and recharge the batteries. I'm hoping they come out all guns blazing and take heed of Bissett's observations

 

The reason they are saying indy ref 2  is dead is using the same logic that says May can't now go for a hard Brexit, despite having the largest number of MP's and gaining more votes than Labour and INCREASING their vote ( unlike the SNP who lost 30% of their vote )

Both yourself and Blissett is deliberately failing to accept that Sturgeon was wrong to equate a Westminster SNP vote with a desire for an indy vote at this moment in time and  the SNP/Green Msp's who voted for the bill in the Scottish Parliament were not representing the will of the Scottish people or even their own constituents.

It's attitudes like Blisset's that are a threat to Scottish Democracy by pushing through agendas that have no support from a majority of Scottish Citizens.

The majority of Scots have shown that they do NOT want an indy2 ref in a referendum and endorsed that in the 2017 GE  by voting 1.5-1 for anti-indyref2  supporting parties.

[ayrmad]

2 minutes ago, McSpreader said:

The reason they are saying indy ref 2  is dead is using the same logic that says May can't now go for a hard Brexit, despite having the largest number of MP's and gaining more votes than Labour and INCREASING their vote ( unlike the SNP who lost 30% of their vote )

Both yourself and Blissett is deliberately failing to accept that Sturgeon was wrong to equate a Westminster SNP vote with a desire for an indy vote at this moment in time and  the SNP/Green Msp's who voted for the bill in the Scottish Parliament were not representing the will of the Scottish people or even their own constituents.

It's attitudes like Blisset's that are a threat to Scottish Democracy by pushing through agendas that have no support from a majority of Scottish Citizens.

The majority of Scots have shown that they do NOT want an indy2 ref in a referendum and endorsed that in the 2017 GE  by voting 1.5-1 for anti-indyref2  supporting parties.

I've never wanted an indyref2 pre brexit but a majority of seats is what counts, The Gub told us relentlessly that a vote for her was a vote against indyref2, she didn't even get half of the seats she needed to prove her point.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

Aye, the settled will until it isn't ( by the way, those Angus Reid questions are abominably leading). Scottish nationalism was once the preserve of fringe tub thumpers. Not any more. There is a certain inevitability about a 2nd Indy Ref, partly because the first one did not answer the question with any degree of satisfaction (it's as much about winning the peace as winning the campaign) and partly because the current UK situation around Brexit is unstable. What happens beyond that is anyone's guess. Demographically we are moving towards a situation where the hardcore Unionist vote is dissipating in favour of a more skeptical and open populace, many of whom did vote Yes. On the other hand a 2nd Indyref loss would certainly finish it for a while.

Demographically the hardcore unionist vote will die before the independence vote.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

The reason they are saying indy ref 2  is dead is using the same logic that says May can't now go for a hard Brexit, despite having the largest number of MP's and gaining more votes than Labour and INCREASING their vote ( unlike the SNP who lost 30% of their vote ) Both yourself and Blissett is deliberately failing to accept that Sturgeon was wrong to equate a Westminster SNP vote with a desire for an indy vote at this moment in time and  the SNP/Green Msp's who voted for the bill in the Scottish Parliament were not representing the will of the Scottish people or even their own constituents.

It's attitudes like Blisset's that are a threat to Scottish Democracy by pushing through agendas that have no support from a majority of Scottish Citizens.

The majority of Scots have shown that they do NOT want an indy2 ref in a referendum and endorsed that in the 2017 GE  by voting 1.5-1 for anti-indyref2  supporting parties.

 

May is not going for hard Brexit because there is not a majority for hard Brexit in the Commons.

 

It's purely about maths and political expediency not any principle.

 

 

 

[Shades75]

2 hours ago, McSpreader said:

The reason they are saying indy ref 2  is dead is using the same logic that says May can't now go for a hard Brexit, despite having the largest number of MP's and gaining more votes than Labour and INCREASING their vote ( unlike the SNP who lost 30% of their vote )

Both yourself and Blissett is deliberately failing to accept that Sturgeon was wrong to equate a Westminster SNP vote with a desire for an indy vote at this moment in time and  the SNP/Green Msp's who voted for the bill in the Scottish Parliament were not representing the will of the Scottish people or even their own constituents.

It's attitudes like Blisset's that are a threat to Scottish Democracy by pushing through agendas that have no support from a majority of Scottish Citizens.

The majority of Scots have shown that they do NOT want an indy2 ref in a referendum and endorsed that in the 2017 GE  by voting 1.5-1 for anti-indyref2  supporting parties.

This "majority of Scottish citizens"....

...Did they vote for Brexit?

[git-intae-thum]

5 hours ago, McSpreader said:

The reason they are saying indy ref 2  is dead is using the same logic that says May can't now go for a hard Brexit, despite having the largest number of MP's and gaining more votes than Labour and INCREASING their vote ( unlike the SNP who lost 30% of their vote )

Both yourself and Blissett is deliberately failing to accept that Sturgeon was wrong to equate a Westminster SNP vote with a desire for an indy vote at this moment in time and  the SNP/Green Msp's who voted for the bill in the Scottish Parliament were not representing the will of the Scottish people or even their own constituents.

It's attitudes like Blisset's that are a threat to Scottish Democracy by pushing through agendas that have no support from a majority of Scottish Citizens.

The majority of Scots have shown that they do NOT want an indy2 ref in a referendum and endorsed that in the 2017 GE  by voting 1.5-1 for anti-indyref2  supporting parties.

Mmmm....we do not really know what the majority of Scottish citizens want.

 

But there is only one party willing to ask them.

[Fide]

State of Lex over the last few pages trying waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too hard.  You almost feel sorry for him, in a way.

[McSpreader]

8 hours ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

Demographically the hardcore unionist vote will die before the independence vote.

Most people become more cautious as they age and will not be so keen on Indy.

If Sturgeon et al continues to obsess with Indy over and above improving day to day life for Scotland .

 And If Brexit ( If!) doesn't cause any long term economic woes  then the appetite for Indy will diminish significantly.

The SNP's arrogance and misplaced confidence in the primacy of their political position is another of the main factors in their 30% drop in support that they need to address.....as personified in Sturgeon's overuse of that demeaning snigger she employs when explaining her ( self perceived) superior position on any given matter.

[McSpreader]

5 hours ago, git-intae-thum said:

Mmmm....we do not really know what the majority of Scottish citizens want.

 

But there is only one party willing to ask them.

Ask then press the  'block/ignore'  button.

Nationalists don't ask what people want, they tell them what they want!

[McSpreader]

8 hours ago, Shades75 said:

This "majority of Scottish citizens"....

...Did they vote for Brexit?

No, nor did they vote for Independence and the indications from the popular vote of GE2017 is overwhelmingly against an indyref 2.

[mjw]

No, nor did they vote for Independence and the indications from the popular vote of GE2017 is overwhelmingly against an indyref 2.

Indyref 2 wasn't on any ballot papers last week though so anyone claiming it was a decision one way or the other is guessing.

[git-intae-thum]

29 minutes ago, McSpreader said:

Ask then press the  'block/ignore'  button.

Nationalists don't ask what people want, they tell them what they want!

Yip. "now is not the time" and all that.

Britnats eh.

[AyrExile]

23 minutes ago, mjw said:

Indyref 2 wasn't on any ballot papers last week though so anyone claiming it was a decision one way or the other is guessing.

Nor was it on the brexit ballot paper but that didn't stop Sturgeon guessing that I and many others still wanted to remain in the eu if Scotland were an independent nation. 

[Loondave1]

Nor was it on the brexit ballot paper but that didn't stop Sturgeon guessing that I and many others still wanted to remain in the eu if Scotland were an independent nation. 

And guessing that as i voted Remain that was a proxy for demanding an Indy2 vote.

[mjw]

So we are agreed that everyone is guessing?
Makes you glad 'call me Dave' held his vanity EU referendum to clear everything up.