The Terrible Journalism & Tom English Thread

[Charles Stiles]

2 hours ago, KirkieRR said:

You think a dramatic cup semi like that would get noticed? Think again.

Just watched the sports bulletin in BBC Breakfast. Practically wetting themselves over extended coverage of a one-goal English Cup semi. Then more gushing over the Moneybags Premiership with interviews etc. Then a brisk mention of the Scottish semi where we saw the winning penalty  and nothing else, moving swiftly on to extended, lovingly-described coverage of England's women's rugby mismatch v Ireland.

They really don't care any more, do they?

Any more? 

1 hour ago, VincentGuerin said:

Not sure why you think anyone would or should be interested.

We've got BBC Scotland for our stuff. Nobody down south gives a f**k about the Scottish Cup, and very few people could even tell you who is playing in the semis.

No point pretending it's news.

Yep. There are no Scots living in England of course. Sounds like you work for the BBC.

[Charles Stiles]

I see when you go into the tables and fixtures sections on the BBC website only Dundee United are given a club badge outside of the Premiership clubs. All other clubs have a grey shield while in England every club as far down as National league has their's shown. It's only National League North /South where they're not shown. 

Not sure if it's a Glasgow or London/Salford issue but it's just another example of the 'couldn't give a f*ck' attitude by the lot of them.

 

Edited April 21 by Charles Stiles

[jakedee]

2 hours ago, VincentGuerin said:

Not sure why you think anyone would or should be interested.

We've got BBC Scotland for our stuff. Nobody down south gives a f**k about the Scottish Cup, and very few people could even tell you who is playing in the semis.

No point pretending it's news.

As "down south" have their own regional BBC channels for "their stuff"

[eez-eh]

4 hours ago, VincentGuerin said:

Not sure why you think anyone would or should be interested.

We've got BBC Scotland for our stuff. Nobody down south gives a f**k about the Scottish Cup, and very few people could even tell you who is playing in the semis.

No point pretending it's news.

And similarly they have their own regional channels down south.

They’re a broadcaster for the whole of the U.K. You’d think that a national cup semi final with 6 goals and 50,000 people at it might get more than a two second mention on the sports bulletin.

[Salvo Montalbano]

That's the thing isn't it. Radio Five is good in that Chappers yesterday went through the results and mentioned what had been settled (he said Dundee Utd had all but confirmed promotion but officially still needed a point, and that Spartans had clinched the play off spot in League Two - do our sports reports even mention that kind of stuff?) because it's a national (UK) broadcast. Same for network news broadcasts etc. We aren't expecting a full run down (that should be done - but often isn't - on Reporting Scotland etc) but they wouldn't in England either, where the lower league and non league results in each region will go to Look North or whatever. A Scottish Cup semi final, especially one that had so much happen in it, is clearly a national story and not just a regional one.

[tamthebam]

Radio Scotland.. great.. 

Edinburgh City played Montrose last Tuesday- not particularly important or interesting but the Mo are going for a play off place. 

Radio Scotland reported the results of the Champions League games that weren't even involving English teams, let alone Scottish ones and were silent on City's glorious win... 

[VincentGuerin]

7 hours ago, jakedee said:

As "down south" have their own regional BBC channels for "their stuff"

 

5 hours ago, eez-eh said:

And similarly they have their own regional channels down south.

They’re a broadcaster for the whole of the U.K. You’d think that a national cup semi final with 6 goals and 50,000 people at it might get more than a two second mention on the sports bulletin.

Aye, but teams that get reported on on Five Live or BBC Breakfast aren't playing in regional competitions. They're playing in English national competitions, so it makes English news.

BBC Scotland reports on the Scottish stuff. It's of absolutely no interest to the vast majority of Five Live's audience. Scottish people living in England have access to BBC Scotland. It cannot be expressed enough that Scottish football is not of interest to a general UK audience.

Edited April 21 by VincentGuerin

[jakedee]

1 hour ago, VincentGuerin said:

 

Aye, but teams that get reported on on Five Live or BBC Breakfast aren't playing in regional competitions. They're playing in English national competitions, so it makes English news.

BBC Scotland reports on the Scottish stuff. It's of absolutely no interest to the vast majority of Five Live's audience. Scottish people living in England have access to BBC Scotland. It cannot be expressed enough that Scottish football is not of interest to a general UK audience.

Whether it is or not, of any interest to to a general UK audience, or is a national English competition is irrelevant.  The BBC is not an English channel (no laughing at the back) and should report on all UK interests.

[VincentGuerin]

1 minute ago, jakedee said:

Whether it is or not, of any interest to to a general UK audience, or is a national English competition is irrelevant.  The BBC is not an English channel (no laughing at the back) and should report on all UK interests.

That's the thing, though. It's not really a national channel. BBC Scotland is for our stuff.

I'm amazed a lot of people still don't get this.

They don't report Welsh Cup results either. The general population make no distinction.

[stu2910]

I don’t necessarily mind that Scottish cup games are only covered on BBC Scotland while FA cup games are covered across the board as there is absolutely more interest in English football in Scotland than vice versa.

The bit that annoys me is that an FA cup first round match between Chesterfield and Havant & Waterlooville will be shown in all BBC regions while a semi final between 2 of our top 5 clubs is exclusively shown in Scotland.  English football didn’t become “the best in the world” because England is supposedly the home of football or because they play particularly exciting football.  It happened because England learned very early on in the modern era that the best form of marketing was to ram it down our throats relentlessly until we can imagine no world where everyone isn’t utterly obsessed with English football.

It’s another area where Scottish football continually shoots itself in the foot trying to make sure 100 people don’t watch a match from home instead of going, when we should be ensuring Scottish games are shown live as much as physically possible.  Why would anybody new become interested in Dundee for example when we’ve been on the tv twice this season and in most seasons that would have resulted in 2 batterings rather than just 1.

[sophia]

 

Tom English and his semi final report... 

 

That was down the Rangers end and they let him have it. Not fury, but a lot of angst. A plaintive cry of the masses.

 

Silva didn't score, though. In collapsing to the floor, Silva looked like an octopus falling out of a tree. Somewhere out there, Peter van Vossen was celebrating. No longer the holder of the greatest missed sitter award.

 

[VincentGuerin]

19 minutes ago, stu2910 said:

I don’t necessarily mind that Scottish cup games are only covered on BBC Scotland while FA cup games are covered across the board as there is absolutely more interest in English football in Scotland than vice versa.

The bit that annoys me is that an FA cup first round match between Chesterfield and Havant & Waterlooville will be shown in all BBC regions while a semi final between 2 of our top 5 clubs is exclusively shown in Scotland.  English football didn’t become “the best in the world” because England is supposedly the home of football or because they play particularly exciting football.  It happened because England learned very early on in the modern era that the best form of marketing was to ram it down our throats relentlessly until we can imagine no world where everyone isn’t utterly obsessed with English football.

It’s another area where Scottish football continually shoots itself in the foot trying to make sure 100 people don’t watch a match from home instead of going, when we should be ensuring Scottish games are shown live as much as physically possible.  Why would anybody new become interested in Dundee for example when we’ve been on the tv twice this season and in most seasons that would have resulted in 2 batterings rather than just 1.

That kind of thing is just an issue with default channels and opt-ins and opt-outs for regions. It's not a grand conspiracy.

Say what you like, but a lot of viewers in Scotland like having access to the FA Cup. No c**t in England is arsed about seeing Falkirk v Queen of the South, but plenty of viewers in Scotland will watch Stockport v Tranmere if they put it on as an FA Cup first round game. That's just the way it is.

We're not a consideration for them. We're the same as Welsh football.

[stu2910]

39 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

That kind of thing is just an issue with default channels and opt-ins and opt-outs for regions. It's not a grand conspiracy.

Say what you like, but a lot of viewers in Scotland like having access to the FA Cup. No c**t in England is arsed about seeing Falkirk v Queen of the South, but plenty of viewers in Scotland will watch Stockport v Tranmere if they put it on as an FA Cup first round game. That's just the way it is.

We're not a consideration for them. We're the same as Welsh football.

Didn’t say it was a conspiracy.  I don’t think the BBC and others are actively trying to suppress Scottish football.  Just that it’s a symptom of where we’ve found ourselves.

The same goes for the rest of what you say.  The only reason people in Scotland would care more about that English game is because they’ve been conditioned to believe they should.  It’s certainly not for the quality or the relevance to their life.

[VincentGuerin]

1 minute ago, stu2910 said:

Didn’t say it was a conspiracy.  I don’t think the BBC and others are actively trying to suppress Scottish football.  Just that it’s a symptom of where we’ve found ourselves.

The same goes for the rest of what you say.  The only reason people in Scotland would care more about that English game is because they’ve been conditioned to believe they should.  It’s certainly not for the quality or the relevance to their life.

Are you saying the quality in England is not much better?

Do you want a minute to think about that?

[eez-eh]

1 hour ago, VincentGuerin said:

That's the thing, though. It's not really a national channel. BBC Scotland is for our stuff.

I'm amazed a lot of people still don't get this.

They don't report Welsh Cup results either. The general population make no distinction.

It is a national channel. England has at about a dozen regional channels of its own.

I’m amazed that you still don’t get this.

[VincentGuerin]

1 minute ago, eez-eh said:

It is a national channel. England has at about a dozen regional channels of its own.

I’m amazed that you still don’t get this.

Do you expect coverage of national English fitba to be on regional channels?

Fair play to you.

[stu2910]

1 minute ago, VincentGuerin said:

Are you saying the quality in England is not much better?

Do you want a minute to think about that?

Not at all, the third tier in England is better than the third tier in Scotland, only an idiot would dispute that.  The point is that the third tier in England is not better than the best clubs in this country.  There also comes a point where quality is far less important than relevance.  Why someone sitting in a house in Falkirk would rather watch a conference league match between West Ham and Ferencvaros than their local team is completely lost on me.

[eez-eh]

2 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

Do you expect coverage of national English fitba to be on regional channels?

Fair play to you.

No. When did I say that?

[VincentGuerin]

1 minute ago, stu2910 said:

Not at all, the third tier in England is better than the third tier in Scotland, only an idiot would dispute that.  The point is that the third tier in England is not better than the best clubs in this country.  There also comes a point where quality is far less important than relevance.  Why someone sitting in a house in Falkirk would rather watch a conference league match between West Ham and Ferencvaros than their local team is completely lost on me.

It might be lost on you, but it's not lost on the wider population.

I love Scottish football. I watch a lot of it.

But I also understand that it's a niche interest. In the UK, hardly any c**t fucking cares about Scottish football. Expecting it to be front and centre in UK-wide news broadcasts is wild.

[VincentGuerin]

Just now, eez-eh said:

No. When did I say that?

So what's your fucking point?

BBC One and Five Live are defacto English stations. If you haven't grasped this, then I can'thelp you.

Scotland has its own BBC media. They cover Scottish football. Absolutely nobody who isn;t accessing BBC Scotland's Scottish football coverage in the UK gives a flying f**k about Scottish football, so it is not widely covered elsewhere.

What part of this is difficult for you?

The BBC's regional English output is irrelevant in all of this. English people find English football interesting. They do not find Scottish football interesting.

Do. You. Get. It?