The Partick Thistle thread

[oneteaminglasgow]

29 minutes ago, Fuctifano said:

Assume the offers to players under contract are loan offers rather than openly admitting to tapping players up. 

Doolan is perhaps a bit naive and optimistic but strikes a balance between McCall's bullshit and bluster and Archibald's "well we've made offers but people don't want to sign for us" wrist slitting interviews. 

There’ll also be guys under contract places who’ve been told they can go if they find another club. Like Connor Shields for example - I can’t imagine Motherwell are that arsed about keeping him, but don’t want to pay him off in full either.

[JagsCG]

Thought Doolan’s interview was really good, and quite upbeat. Seems to know what he wants in and hopefully he can get the required players. Definitely feel like despite the re-signings of some older pros, we will have a fairly young team this season. I hope he’s right about the other players seeing Graham commit to the club and doing so themselves, he sounded a bit disappointed regarding the talent we’ve let leave on a free this summer (of course he’s not at fault for any of that). 

4 hours ago, El Gringo Jag said:

Personally would love to poach someone like Dom thomas.

Not sure what money & terms he’s on at QP, but we couldn’t match it last summer when McCall wanted to sign him. 

53 minutes ago, Fuctifano said:

Noticed the pink badge on Doolan's top, think that gives some credence to the black and pink or grey and pink away top.

Saw this too the other day on Greaves website, all the training gear seems to have a pink tint to it, so suspect the previous suggestions about pink being involved in the away shirt will be true. 

[capt_oats]

9 hours ago, oneteaminglasgow said:

There’ll also be guys under contract places who’ve been told they can go if they find another club. Like Connor Shields for example - I can’t imagine Motherwell are that arsed about keeping him, but don’t want to pay him off in full either.

There are probably about half a dozen in our squad who fall into that category - Shields being an obvious one given he was bounced out on loan to QP last season and has generally had a fairly shite time at Fir Park.

Barry Maguire and Robbie Mahon were also loaned out but are still under contract while you also have guys like Bevis Mugabi and Ricki Lamie who went from regular first team starters under previous managers to bench players when Kettlewell came in.

Kettlewell’s inherited a fairly large squad with an amount of budget tied up in contracted players who didn’t get minutes for whatever reason.

There are a few of our squad who’d be a good fit for Thistle tbh.

Edited June 24, 2023 by capt_oats

[Don Kneelcaster]

The Jags Foundation (TJF) was brought into being for a specific purpose. This was to be the democratically-run, accountable PTFC supporters organisation, which would be the repository for the 55% majority shareholding (given by the late Colin Weir) to allow fan ownership of the club. Since it was first instituted, a lot of water has gone under the bridge but the model which we currently have does not (to me) conform to the genuine models of fan ownership seen at eg St Mirren FC or Motherwell FC or other fan owned clubs.
 

Yet, we know (because they’ve told us) that TJF has earmarked large amounts of TJF subscription funds to be given to PTFC now and in the future. Why was this money, promised by TJF/given to the club-supporters’ money-not offered conditionally on the club becoming a genuinely fan-owned club on the lines of those other fan-owned clubs? After all, previously, when J Low turned down TJF as a repository for the shareholding, she said, “The club neither wants or needs your money.” (And the subtext was , ‘Neither do we want you!’) Now we know that the part of her statement about “need” was false, but surely the supporters still seek what was wanted at the very start of the process, ie genuine fan ownership. And, having this money to offer, surely provides the way to achieve this. Yet, no changes are being made (as far as I’m aware) to the current fan ownership model (if you can call it a ‘model’).

Edited June 24, 2023 by Don Kneelcaster

[Mediocre Pundit]

I’m not sure what this Don chap is going for, but I’m a wee bit intrigued…

[Reid]

3 hours ago, capt_oats said:

There are probably about half a dozen in our squad who fall into that category - Shields being an obvious one given he was bounced out on loan to QP last season and has generally had a fairly shite time at Fir Park.

Barry Maguire and Robbie Mahon were also loaned out but are still under contract while you also have guys like Bevis Mugabi and Ricki Lamie who went from regular first team starters under previous managers to bench players when Kettlewell came in.

Kettlewell’s inherited a fairly large squad with an amount of budget tied up in contracted players who didn’t get minutes for whatever reason.

There are a few of our squad who’d be a good fit for Thistle tbh.

Would absolutely take Lamie and/or Mugabi but reckon they would be outwith our budget.

 

Looking at Premiership clubs who have players under contract but didn’t play much last season, there’s some decent players: Kerr McInroy, Jay Henderson, Cammy McPherson, Cammy Ballantyne. 

[D'Jaffo]

46 minutes ago, Reid said:

Would absolutely take Lamie and/or Mugabi but reckon they would be outwith our budget.

 

Looking at Premiership clubs who have players under contract but didn’t play much last season, there’s some decent players: Kerr McInroy, Jay Henderson, Cammy McPherson, Cammy Ballantyne. 

Henderson has left St Mirren but they are due hefty compensation I believe which is probably why he hasn’t signed anywhere yet. He did well so you’d imagine there will be interest but some negotiation will be required with St Mirren to get him. 

[jagsfan57]

3 hours ago, Don Kneelcaster said:

The Jags Foundation (TJF) was brought into being for a specific purpose. This was to be the democratically-run, accountable PTFC supporters organisation, which would be the repository for the 55% majority shareholding (given by the late Colin Weir) to allow fan ownership of the club. Since it was first instituted, a lot of water has gone under the bridge but the model which we currently have does not (to me) conform to the genuine models of fan ownership seen at eg St Mirren FC or Motherwell FC or other fan owned clubs.
 

Yet, we know (because they’ve told us) that TJF has earmarked large amounts of TJF subscription funds to be given to PTFC now and in the future. Why was this money, promised by TJF/given to the club-supporters’ money-not offered conditionally on the club becoming a genuinely fan-owned club on the lines of those other fan-owned clubs? After all, previously, when J Low turned down TJF as a repository for the shareholding, she said, “The club neither wants or needs your money.” (And the subtext was , ‘Neither do we want you!’) Now we know that the part of her statement about “need” was false, but surely the supporters still seek what was wanted at the very start of the process, ie genuine fan ownership. And, having this money to offer, surely provides the way to achieve this. Yet, no changes are being made (as far as I’m aware) to the current fan ownership model (if you can call it a ‘model’).

I think there are changes. There is a change to the Trust Deed which names the TJF as a member and TJF has a presence on the club board. So perhaps not the fan ownership model that was envisioned, but certainly much more influence and acknowledgment 

[Ad Lib]

10 hours ago, Don Kneelcaster said:

The Jags Foundation (TJF) was brought into being for a specific purpose. This was to be the democratically-run, accountable PTFC supporters organisation, which would be the repository for the 55% majority shareholding (given by the late Colin Weir) to allow fan ownership of the club. Since it was first instituted, a lot of water has gone under the bridge but the model which we currently have does not (to me) conform to the genuine models of fan ownership seen at eg St Mirren FC or Motherwell FC or other fan owned clubs.
 

Yet, we know (because they’ve told us) that TJF has earmarked large amounts of TJF subscription funds to be given to PTFC now and in the future. Why was this money, promised by TJF/given to the club-supporters’ money-not offered conditionally on the club becoming a genuinely fan-owned club on the lines of those other fan-owned clubs? After all, previously, when J Low turned down TJF as a repository for the shareholding, she said, “The club neither wants or needs your money.” (And the subtext was , ‘Neither do we want you!’) Now we know that the part of her statement about “need” was false, but surely the supporters still seek what was wanted at the very start of the process, ie genuine fan ownership. And, having this money to offer, surely provides the way to achieve this. Yet, no changes are being made (as far as I’m aware) to the current fan ownership model (if you can call it a ‘model’).

You must be living under a rock then.

In the last fortnight:

(a) TJF AGM unanimously approves the corporate trustee model

(b) PTFC Trust conducts an indicative ballot of ST holders on the corporate trustee model

(c) TJF representation appointed to the Club Board

(d) the last Club Director from the "old board" stepped down

This model is far from at maturity, and it isn't as tidy as it should have been. But the fundamentals have changed drastically since the PTFC Trust received the majority shareholding. There is a genuine collaborative process in place, a clear commitment to move towards more permanent arrangements for fan representation and skills-based board appointments, and for the remaining three PTFC Trust trustees to step away from their roles when the new legal and working arrangement is in place.

TJF would not be making major financial commitments if its leadership group was not convinced that those on the interim board of the Club are serious about delivering on the fan ownership promise. We are now an indispensable partner that all with influence at Firhill want at the heart of things.

[oneteaminglasgow]

Twitter rumour that we’re signing Wasiri Williams - an ex Swansea youth centre half, who’s had spells with a load of English non-league clubs and, most recently, Dundalk in Ireland.

Boy that’s posted it is the same one that posted about Harry Milne months before anyone else, so maybe. 

Edited June 24, 2023 by oneteaminglasgow

[ptfc. 22]

1 hour ago, oneteaminglasgow said:

Twitter rumour that we’re signing Wasiri Williams - an ex Swansea youth centre half, who’s had spells with a load of English non-league clubs and, most recently, Dundalk in Ireland.

Boy that’s posted it is the same one that posted about Harry Milne months before anyone else, so maybe. 

He liked a tweet about him moving to thistle if that means anything. 

[Don Kneelcaster]

2 hours ago, Ad Lib said:

You must be living under a rock then.

In the last fortnight:

(a) TJF AGM unanimously approves the corporate trustee model

(b) PTFC Trust conducts an indicative ballot of ST holders on the corporate trustee model

(c) TJF representation appointed to the Club Board

(d) the last Club Director from the "old board" stepped down

This model is far from at maturity, and it isn't as tidy as it should have been. But the fundamentals have changed drastically since the PTFC Trust received the majority shareholding. There is a genuine collaborative process in place, a clear commitment to move towards more permanent arrangements for fan representation and skills-based board appointments, and for the remaining three PTFC Trust trustees to step away from their roles when the new legal and working arrangement is in place.

TJF would not be making major financial commitments if its leadership group was not convinced that those on the interim board of the Club are serious about delivering on the fan ownership promise. We are now an indispensable partner that all with influence at Firhill want at the heart of things.

“This model is far from maturity and it isn’t (as) tidy…..…fan ownership promise……..we are…a(n) partner”

Yes, I understand you are “convinced” that those on the….board are serious about delivering on the fan ownership promise, but didn’t you previously at one time think the same about J Low and that previous board? And that came as quite a shock at the time. Of course, the present board want the JFL subscription money, but they haven’t delivered true fan ownership of PTFC yet, which is my point. You believe they will. We will see in due course. In the meantime…..

[Ad Lib]

10 minutes ago, Don Kneelcaster said:

“This model is far from maturity and it isn’t (as) tidy…..…fan ownership promise……..we are…a(n) partner”

Yes, I understand you are “convinced” that those on the….board are serious about delivering on the fan ownership promise, but didn’t you previously at one time think the same about J Low and that previous board? And that came as quite a shock at the time. Of course, the present board want the JFL subscription money, but they haven’t delivered true fan ownership of PTFC yet, which is my point. You believe they will. We will see in due course. In the meantime…..

No, I never thought the same about Jacqui Low.

Happy to clarify.

[R&Y99]

2 hours ago, oneteaminglasgow said:

Twitter rumour that we’re signing Wasiri Williams - an ex Swansea youth centre half, who’s had spells with a load of English non-league clubs and, most recently, Dundalk in Ireland.

Boy that’s posted it is the same one that posted about Harry Milne months before anyone else, so maybe. 

Aye Wasiri Williams and Kerr McInroy are the first names I have seen banded about as potential signings.

[JagsCG]

53 minutes ago, R&Y99 said:

Aye Wasiri Williams and Kerr McInroy are the first names I have seen banded about as potential signings.

Would take both. We’re definitely light on defenders, and McInroy impressed when he was at Ayr the season before last. 

Edited June 24, 2023 by JagsCG

[oneteaminglasgow]

3 minutes ago, JagsCG said:

Would take both. We’re definitely light on defenders, and McInroy impressed when he was at Ayr the season before he last. 

McInroy would be a great signing if we could pull it off. I was surprised he never got much of a look in at Killie last season. 

Earlier today was literally the first time I’d ever heard of Williams, and this would be the highest level of football he’s played at, but at least it’s something different. 

[Nightmare]

8 hours ago, Don Kneelcaster said:

“This model is far from maturity and it isn’t (as) tidy…..…fan ownership promise……..we are…a(n) partner”

Yes, I understand you are “convinced” that those on the….board are serious about delivering on the fan ownership promise, but didn’t you previously at one time think the same about J Low and that previous board? And that came as quite a shock at the time. Of course, the present board want the JFL subscription money, but they haven’t delivered true fan ownership of PTFC yet, which is my point. You believe they will. We will see in due course. In the meantime…..

I don’t think the fact Jacqui Low turned out to be a charlatan and a liar came as a shock to many people, tbh.

[Don Kneelcaster]

22 minutes ago, Nightmare said:

I don’t think the fact Jacqui Low turned out to be a charlatan and a liar came as a shock to many people, tbh.

Yes, but the key words are “turned out to be.” For a long time, Thistle fans and just about everybody else who knew something about it, expected JLow, 3BCs, The Thistle board to give the shares to TJF. Then later after further negotiations with a new TJF board there was hope rather than expectation. But, finally they were given to another group which popped up out of nowhere which had never even been mentioned. Then, there was shock combined with anger, a sense of betrayal and yes, a profound belief amongst the fans, TJF etc we had been lied to. My feeling overall surrounding raising  this issue here, is how can we stop what ultimately happened previously, happening again?

TJF have a lot of money which is being paid as subscriptions by PT fans who are members of TJF. The club and individuals who are not necessarily members of TJF want that money, which has been offered by TJF at a time when PTFC is in a financial pickle. But, when money is available and desperately needed, sometimes people will say or/and agree to anything easily to get it. My point is, how can we be certain we aren’t having ‘the wool pulled over our eyes’ a second time?

Edited June 25, 2023 by Don Kneelcaster

[Ad Lib]

15 minutes ago, Don Kneelcaster said:

Yes, but the key words are “turned out to be.” For a long time, Thistle fans and just about everybody else who knew something about it, expected JLow, 3BCs, The Thistle board to give the shares to TJF.

Not true. There were those of us who were extremely sceptical from the outset.

15 minutes ago, Don Kneelcaster said:

Then later after further negotiations with a new TJF board there was hope rather than expectation. But, finally they were given to another group which popped up out of nowhere which had never even been mentioned.

Another group that, it turns out, had been given certain assurances about the Club’s financial prudence that turned out to be at variance with the actualité.

15 minutes ago, Don Kneelcaster said:

Then, there was shock combined with anger, a sense of betrayal and yes, a profound belief amongst the fans, TJF etc we had been lied to. My feeling overall surrounding raising  this issue here, is how can we stop what ultimately happened previously, happening again?

Well the parcel of rogues aren’t on the Club Board anymore, for starters.

And for second, we now have proper Jags folk at the table, like Dougie McCrea, and a TJF representative, to oversee phase two of the corporate trustee model.

A model whose legal changes, giving TJF a seat at the fan ownership table, will be happening imminently.

15 minutes ago, Don Kneelcaster said:

TJF have a lot of money which is being paid as subscriptions by PT fans who are members of TJF. The club and individuals who are not necessarily members of TJF want that money, which has been offered by TJF at a time when PTFC is in a financial pickle.

Has it occurred to you to ask why TJF didn’t simply give this money in February, when the scale of the challenge became apparent to the new Club Board?

This hasn’t been done flippantly. It is the fruit of about six months of joint working and an extensive financial exercise to provide a more realistic and deliverable baseline budget for the football club. It has also been timed, very deliberately, to coincide with other progress in the model.

15 minutes ago, Don Kneelcaster said:

But, when money is available and desperately needed, sometimes people will say or/and agree to anything easily to get it. My point is, how can we be certain we aren’t having ‘the wool pulled over our eyes’ a second time?

Because it’s a completely different set of people in charge of the Club now.

[Don Kneelcaster]

17 minutes ago, Ad Lib said:

Not true. There were those of us who were extremely sceptical from the outset.

Another group that, it turns out, had been given certain assurances about the Club’s financial prudence that turned out to be at variance with the actualité.

Well the parcel of rogues aren’t on the Club Board anymore, for starters.

And for second, we now have proper Jags folk at the table, like Dougie McCrea, and a TJF representative, to oversee phase two of the corporate trustee model.

A model whose legal changes, giving TJF a seat at the fan ownership table, will be happening imminently.

Has it occurred to you to ask why TJF didn’t simply give this money in February, when the scale of the challenge became apparent to the new Club Board?

This hasn’t been done flippantly. It is the fruit of about six months of joint working and an extensive financial exercise to provide a more realistic and deliverable baseline budget for the football club. It has also been timed, very deliberately, to coincide with other progress in the model.

Because it’s a completely different set of people in charge of the Club now.

We have to hope then-you say you are “convinced” -that this “completely different set of people” ultimately do things differently than the previous set of people. But, at the moment, we are NOT a fan-owned club in line with St Mirren or Motherwell so until or unless that’s achieved, we have to … wait and see. You seem to have a lot of ‘certainty’. Any, thoughts about ‘when’ genuine fan ownership (on a par with St Mirren or Motherwell etc) might be finally achieved?

Edited June 25, 2023 by Don Kneelcaster