Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[capt_oats]

Honestly, this season has been so fucking weird.

That's now clean sheets in 6 of Kettlewell's 12 games in charge. Which is more than Hammell managed (5) in his 24 league games.

I mean, just look at it...

[Swello]

Most often finishing the Bottom 6, especially when you're not in immediate danger, can be garbage - and when we've got a good team, I want to see us in the Top 6 every time but I'd argue that ending up in the bottom six was just what we needed this season.

After a truly terrible calendar year in 2022 and the utter mess at the start of this year, it's more important that we were able to carry on our good form, keep the momentum going and keep the restored atmosphere around the club running into the summer break (and the season ticket buying period). If our form went off a cliff as we played the better teams in the Top 6 - I don't think it would really help us at this point.

A lot of this season was soul destroyingly bad but immediately from when Ketts came in, it's been back to being enjoyable and we're all actually looking forward to going to games again and watch other teams shite themselves in the relegation battle.

So, much like the Young Motherwell season showed - Bottom 6 isn't always a bad thing.

[Archie McSquackle]

23 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

Honestly, this season has been so fucking weird.

That's now clean sheets in 6 of Kettlewell's 12 games in charge. Which is more than Hammell managed (5) in his 24 league games.

I mean, just look at it...

And you've got to remember Kettlewell hasn't actually signed anyone, he's done it with Hammell's team (albeit Hammell didn't get the chance to bed in some of his latest signings).

[capt_oats]

37 minutes ago, Archie McSquackle said:

And you've got to remember Kettlewell hasn't actually signed anyone, he's done it with Hammell's team (albeit Hammell didn't get the chance to bed in some of his latest signings).

I think the thing that has my head genuinely spinning is that it's not like he's done that thing interim managers often do and just tried to be "difficult to beat" and ask the players to go out and play the percentages.

Instead he's stuck a bunch of our players in the positions that best suit them and said "off you go".

Even SODs seems to be having A Nice Time now that he's being asked to do the things he's actually fucking good at rather than continue the trauma of his 3 previous managers choosing to completely ignore the role he had in a Scotland jersey when he was terroring Jack Grealish.

Don't get me wrong, we're clearly better organised and *whisper it* better coached but we're actually playing with a bit of style and confidence which isn't usually the case when someone takes over a team with 2 league wins in 20. The fitba' bit usually takes a back seat - I don't think that's really been the case with Ketts and Frail.

There was a line in that Moult piece that McGarry did which caught my eye:

Quote

“He seems to have got them playing in a very similar way to what we used to [under Stephen Robinson] to be honest, with the 3-5-2 and the two strikers, and Kev is obviously capitalising on that because they are getting the ball forward quicker to him."

Link

I mean, yeah...sort of but I'd probably argue that Kettleball is probably landing somewhere in that sweet spot between Robinson's Thunderdome and his sexy #YoungMotherwell eras. Which is nice.

Which to speak to @Swello's post above - makes all the difference when you're actually trying to sell the product to punters and - I'd guess - prospective players you're trying to recruit.

Edited May 21, 2023 by capt_oats

['WellDel]

5 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

Which to speak to @Swello's post above - makes all the difference when you're actually trying to sell the product to punters and - I'd guess - prospective players you're trying to recruit.

The current product and run, and Kettlewell's vision for going forward and ability to sell the club to prospective signings is night and day to where we could have been had Hammell been allowed to stay in post any longer.

KVV getting a decent move, along with a top end League One/Lower Championship side taking a punt on the likes of Slattery or Goss, and some of the puff pieces currently in the media by Moult etc blowing smoke up our arse too could also maybe help in swaying players to take their chances with us. The potential pool, although small, will still be considerably more worth fishing in than it could/would have been if Hammell was still here having us embroiled in what would almost certainly have been a losing relegation battle. The importance of The Ketts Effect cannot be understated. 

[Kapowzer]

3 hours ago, Archie McSquackle said:

He's done it with Hammell's team (albeit Hammell didn't get the chance to bed in some of his latest signings).

Hammell however did have the chance to improve the defence before the summer window closed and he didn’t.

We should all be big advocates against a future winter World Cup based on that season breakdown.

Edited May 21, 2023 by Kapowzer

[DeadStar]

4 hours ago, capt_oats said:

Honestly, this season has been so fucking weird.

That's now clean sheets in 6 of Kettlewell's 12 games in charge. Which is more than Hammell managed (5) in his 24 league games.

I mean, just look at it...

How the f**k we put 5 past County in the middle of "the spell" astounds me.

[well fan for life]

4 hours ago, capt_oats said:

Honestly, this season has been so fucking weird.

That's now clean sheets in 6 of Kettlewell's 12 games in charge. Which is more than Hammell managed (5) in his 24 league games.

I mean, just look at it...

Large up Birighitti for at least giving me something to smile about in that godforesaken run.

[Cloontang]

1 hour ago, well fan for life said:

Large up Birighitti for at least giving me something to smile about in that godforesaken run.

It's funny to think that they had Trevor Carson on the books at the start of the season and let him leave to go to a rival. 

[well fan for life]

8 minutes ago, Cloontang said:

It's funny to think that they had Trevor Carson on the books at the start of the season and let him leave to go to a rival. 

I know we've had some questionable transfers in recent times but Dundee United's record is hysterically shit.

[capt_oats]

Just chucking this out there, there was a comment from Ketts in his pre-match about squad/recruitment:

Quote

"As far as we sit just now almost with deals that are offered and deals that are out there to players that are under contract - some have played, some haven't played since I've come in then you almost max out what you've got.

So, again, this is where I have to be really clear - Yeah you look at players, yeah you want to go and try to improve your squad, yeah you want to try and freshen things up and put your own stamp on it. The ability to do that can be limited sometimes. So the more I can try and bring in potentially by a league placing or a cup run be it next year or whatever then that starts to help those scenarios."

There's a chance I'm misinterpreting him but there's an implication there that a decent number of those who are OOC will be offered new deals. We already know that Johnston, Cornelius and Casey have contracts on the table and it wouldn't be a surprise to add McGinn and Goss to that list.

Besides that, the reason I mention it is it's been interesting to me that Shane Blaney seems to have been our go to to replace Casey while Ricki Lamie has been parked on the bench. Which is fine - we've invested in him and it's giving a chance to see how he fits in.

For avoidance of doubt that's not me advocating for Lamie to get on the park but it feels like a choice and it seems kind of relevant given not getting a game was one of Lamie's cited reasons for taking the PCA with Dundee (alongside the fact they were chucking daft money at him to sign).

As it stands the Bathgate Maldini has played a total of 39 minutes for Ketts compared with 2,159 for Hammell.

Broadly, it feels like there's definitely a conversation to be had about players who are under contract for next season who haven't really kicked a baw for SK (when they've been fit) as much as there are questions about players who are OOC being offered new deals.

Edited May 22, 2023 by capt_oats

[thisGRAEME]

Tell you what, on Blaney; he's a really big laddie, really big.

As such, I shall back him to the hilt.

[joewarkfanclub]

48 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

Just chucking this out there, there was a comment from Ketts in his pre-match about squad/recruitment:

There's a chance I'm misinterpreting him but there's an implication there that a decent number of those who are OOC will be offered new deals. We already know that Johnston, Cornelius and Casey have contracts on the table and it wouldn't be a surprise to add McGinn and Goss to that list.

Besides that, the reason I mention it is that it's been interesting to me that Shane Blaney seems to have been our go to to replace Casey while Ricki Lamie has been parked on the bench. Which is fine - we've invested in him and it's giving a chance to see how he fits in.

For avoidance of doubt that's not me advocating for Lamie to get on the park but it feels like a choice and it seems kind of relevant given not getting a game was one of Lamie's cited reasons for taking the PCA with Dundee (alongside the fact they were chucking daft money at him to sign).

As it stands the Bathgate Maldini has played a total of 39 minutes for Ketts compared with 2,159 for Hammell.

Broadly, it feels like there's definitely a conversation to be had about players who are under contract for next season who haven't really kicked a baw for SK (when they've been fit) as much as there are questions about players who are OOC being offered new deals.

Yup. Interesting to read between the lines there.

Clearly looking to keep some who are out of contract, move on some who are still under contract and make sure we finish 7th so he has as much wriggle room as possible to wheel and deal in the summer. 

Lamie is an interesting one. We are undoubtedly more secure at the back with Butcher and Casey and it seems clear Blaney is ahead of Lamie in the pecking order. I think Lamies future and potentially that of Bevis will depend on what Casey does. If he goes then Blaney steps up and maybe Lamie or Bevis have a place as squad players, but if Casey stays, there surely isnt space for all of them and we need to look to offload at least one. Will either of them be happy being squad players or look to get out somewhere else for first team football?

Add in that McGinn has looked secure in a 3. If that is our shape going forward I guess SK would be looking to keep him.

I guess similar converstions will be happening all over the pitch. Looks like being an interesting summer, and in a good way for a change!

Edited May 22, 2023 by joewarkfanclub

[Swello]

40 minutes ago, thisGRAEME said:

Tell you what, on Blaney; he's a really big laddie, really big.

As such, I shall back him to the hilt.

Was thinking the same on Saturday -he was knocking Jordon White about easily.

[well fan for life]

43 minutes ago, thisGRAEME said:

Tell you what, on Blaney; he's a really big laddie, really big.

As such, I shall back him to the hilt.

He's build like the side of a block of flats and when he put in that absolutely storming tackle on the halfway line I was up out my seat. 

Huge, huge fan. 

[Handsome_Devil]

Re Lamie and Mugabi, keeping one as cover is fine. Keeping both - potentially on decent wages given how they re-signed - is not.

I think one of the things that gets forgotten with three at the back is while it might make defending easier for Lamie, say, he's not really the guy you want striding out. Bevis even less so. And if we assume most sides play 4-3-3/4-5-1, the maths means you can't have three boys at the back scared to go forward.

Butcher can obviously do it, having played in midfield, but you see the massive difference between our right hand side with McGinn (former full back, comfortable on the ball) getting up to support in contrast with Casey, who as the team hard man looks like he'd rather stab the ball than have it at his feet.

Ending up in a scenario where we're using Lamie/Mugabi regularly in. 3-5-2 probably won't hurt us as much defensively as this season but it'll still end up screwing us...getting at least one to buggery is a major priority.

[well fan for life]

2 minutes ago, Handsome_Devil said:

Re Lamie and Mugabi, keeping one as cover is fine. Keeping both - potentially on decent wages given how they re-signed - is not.

 

Mugabi seems like a lovely guy but I'd be more than alright with both of them getting emptied in the summer. Lamie's Jedi mind trick done us right in for half of this season and I can't face a scenario where we have to rely on him. 

[Handsome_Devil]

15 minutes ago, well fan for life said:

Mugabi seems like a lovely guy but I'd be more than alright with both of them getting emptied in the summer. Lamie's Jedi mind trick done us right in for half of this season and I can't face a scenario where we have to rely on him. 

Aye, fair point.

It comes back to the usual tricky balancing act of playing three at the back so needing two as cover - so how good will Motherwell's fifth choice centre back ever be?

[MurrayWell]

We should have thanked Ricki Lamie at the end of last season and let him go, especially after the whole Dundee PCA. Was all a very short-sighted and strange situation, much like the rest of the summer business.

When Lamie first came into the team under Robinson, he was atrocious and, while I think he has improved and been steady at times, I reckon he's probably had more poor games than good games for us. We're bizarrely now a bit over-stocked in terms of CBs (especially if we can keep Casey), so if Lamie can find a club then we should just let him leave. Bevis? I like Bevis. 

Blaney has impressed me every time he's played so far too. 

[joewarkfanclub]

5 minutes ago, MurrayWell said:

We should have thanked Ricki Lamie at the end of last season and let him go, especially after the whole Dundee PCA. Was all a very short-sighted and strange situation, much like the rest of the summer business.

When Lamie first came into the team under Robinson, he was atrocious and, while I think he has improved and been steady at times, I reckon he's probably had more poor games than good games for us. We're bizarrely now a bit over-stocked in terms of CBs (especially if we can keep Casey), so if Lamie can find a club then we should just let him leave. Bevis? I like Bevis. 

Blaney has impressed me every time he's played so far too. 

I think the problem with both Lamie and Bevis is that they can look like good players a lot of the time, but bith seem to have at least one mistake a game in them.

Thats what was hurting us under Hammell. We werent shipping goals but the ones we did lose were self inflicted and more often than not cost us valuable points. 

They were undoubtedly more exposed playing in a flat 4 and Hammells refusal to identify and change that is one of the things that ultimately did for him.

Edited May 22, 2023 by joewarkfanclub