Brexit slowly becoming a Farce.

[WILLIEA]

43 minutes ago, Wee Willie said:

But surely they're too wee tae be a nation?

Of course they are a nation! Just not an ideal trading partner for Scotland or UK given the transport costs involved, threat to the environment etc.

Not to mention the threat to the livelihood of lots of our countryside people.

[Bishop Briggs]

17 minutes ago, topcat(The most tip top) said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/exporting-to-new-zealand/exporting-to-new-zealand

New Zealand’s top 5 imports from the UK are:

vehicles
machinery and mechanical parts
electrical machinery and goods
print products, such as books
pharmaceutical products

 

As far as I can see from

http://www.customs.govt.nz/incommercial/importcharges/dutiesandcharges/Pages/default.aspx

Tariffs are either low or nonexistent on these. I was checking on a phone so I may have missed something
 

 

So British sectors that are not subject to NZ tariffs are successful in exporting to that country? Are you surprised?

The big issue is NZ exports to the EU, including the UK. The EU/EEA agricultural markets are heavily regulated (EU CAP) and protected (EEA customs union).

[John Lambies Doos]

SNP should really put the NZ remote 5 million population to play here

[topcat(The most tip top)]

So British sectors that are not subject to NZ tariffs are successful in exporting to that country? Are you surprised?
The big issue is NZ exports to the EU, including the UK. The EU/EEA agricultural markets are heavily regulated (EU CAP) and protected (EEA customs union).

If you've got a bigger screen and some time you could try and find something that the UK can produce that has high NZ imports tariffs.

As it stands the NZ prime minister expects a free trade deal with the EU to be reached before one with the UK

[Bishop Briggs]

11 minutes ago, WILLIEA said:

Of course they are a nation! Just not an ideal trading partner for Scotland or UK given the transport costs involved, threat to the environment etc.

Not to mention the threat to the livelihood of lots of our countryside people.

That's utter nonsense. Even with EU tariffs, Scotland imports a significant amount of goods and products from New Zealand.

Have you spotted "Anchor" butter, a leading brand in the UK, in your local supermarkets? Guess where it's from? New Zealand lamb sells well here too. 

New Zealand, in contrast to the EU, benefits from having a very efficient agricultural sector. It abolished its subsidies many years ago.

[Wee Willie]

1 hour ago, Wee Willie said:

But surely they're too wee tae be a nation?

 

24 minutes ago, WILLIEA said:

Of course they are a nation! Just not an ideal trading partner for Scotland or UK given the transport costs involved, threat to the environment etc.

Not to mention the threat to the livelihood of lots of our countryside people.

At the time of our referendum in 2014 the ex-premier of Australia, Bud Abbot said that Scotland was too wee tae go it alone.

My cousin in the Antipodes said that went down well in New Zealand.

7 minutes ago, John Lambies Doos said:

SNP should really put the NZ remote 5 million population to play here

6 minutes ago, Bishop Briggs said:

That's utter nonsense. Even with EU tariffs, Scotland imports a significant amount of goods and products from New Zealand.

Have you spotted "Anchor" butter, a leading brand in the UK, in your local supermarkets? Guess where it's from? New Zealand lamb sells well here too. 

New Zealand, in contrast to the EU, benefits from having a very efficient agricultural sector. It abolished its subsidies many years ago.

And we sell tae them Nairn Oatcakes and sundry other biscuits.

[mjw]

Have you spotted "Anchor".

Every time you post.

[Bishop Briggs]

1 minute ago, topcat(The most tip top) said:

 

If you've got a bigger screen and some time you could try and find something that the UK can produce that has high NZ imports tariffs.

As it stands the NZ prime minister expects a free trade deal with the EU to be reached before one with the UK
 

 

Typical moronic nonsense from you.

 

Fonterra is New Zealand’s largest exporter - https://www.mfat.govt.nz/assets/_securedfiles/FTAs-in-negotiations/EU-FTA/5.-Fonterra.pdf

"In contrast, the EU’s tariffs on dairy imports are in most instances very high and prohibitive to trade.

New Zealand butter and cheese may enter the EU through WTO country specific tariff rate quotas. The New Zealand country specific butter quota has an annual volume of 74,693 metric tonnes and an in-quota tariff of €70.00 per 100kg. Two New Zealand country specific tariff rate quotas exist for cheese, with a combined volume of 11,000 metric tonnes per annum and an in quota tariff rate of €17.06 per 100kg. These quotas are often not filled because of the high in quota tariffs."

 

All EU trade deals have to be signed by each Member State. Pre-Brexit, any deal with the EU would have to be signed by Britain. When Britain leaves the EU, it will be still a signatory to its trade deals, including Canada's, unless it passes laws to abolish or replace them. 

Britain cannot sign deal with any country country pre-Brexit. A post-Brexit deal will enable both countries to negotiate better terms than the EU deal.

[Bishop Briggs]

2 minutes ago, mjw said:

Every time you post.

You're the w****r. 

"My Team : Motherwell"

Says it all.

 

[mjw]

You're the w****r. 
"My Team : Motherwell"
Says it all.
 

[emoji23]

[WILLIEA]

21 minutes ago, Bishop Briggs said:

That's utter nonsense. Even with EU tariffs, Scotland imports a significant amount of goods and products from New Zealand.

Have you spotted "Anchor" butter, a leading brand in the UK, in your local supermarkets? Guess where it's from? New Zealand lamb sells well here too. 

New Zealand, in contrast to the EU, benefits from having a very efficient agricultural sector. It abolished its subsidies many years ago.

We still import some stuff from them because of old empire/commonweath sentiment. We don't actually need any of it.

There are many more costs/benefits involved in any transaction , not simply monetary ones.

WUM or deluded simpleton? it's a tough call to decide which you are!

In any case over & out!

[Bishop Briggs]

24 minutes ago, WILLIEA said:

We still import some stuff from them because of old empire/commonweath sentiment. We don't actually need any of it.

There are many more costs/benefits involved in any transaction , not simply monetary ones.

WUM or deluded simpleton? it's a tough call to decide which you are!

In any case over & out!

Oh really? So you would close down our Indian restaurants because their old empire/commonwealth sentiment? Presumably we don't need any of their stuff too. No lamb, especially from NZ, curry for you!

Do we really need Irish, German or Italian beers? How about Parma ham, mozzarella cheese or chorizo sausages? Who needs them we have our own equivalents?

Or South African, Australian, New Zealand wine? Just stick to wine from the EU?

It's you who is deluded.

Edited January 15, 2017 by Bishop Briggs

[Wee Willie]

I dinnae want tae upset BB but I think WILLIEA has a point.

These are snippets from the link BB provided:

 

NZ-EU FTA: Fonterra Submission to MFAT February 2016

The EU and New Zealand are both competitive producers of dairy products and both

are net exporters of dairy. In 2015 New Zealand produced around 21.5 billion litres of

milk. In comparison, the EU produces more than 150 billion litres annually with

Production growing rapidly following the abolition of the milk production quota

system. Germany and France each produce more milk than New Zealand does

.

The EU produces around 7.5 times as much milk as New Zealand and the EU’s

milk supply is growing faster than New Zealand in percentage and absolute volume terms.

 

The total EU butter market size is over 2 million tonnes and the cheese market size is

over 9 million tonnes – the cheese market alone is far larger than New Zealand’s total production of all dairy products.

_________________________

 Apart from assisting a wee independent nation do we really need tae import stuff from New Zealand?

[hehawhehaw]

43 minutes ago, mjw said:

lets face it tinneck you are a w****r. heres the proof

[Bishop Briggs]

16 minutes ago, Wee Willie said:

I dinnae want tae upset BB but I think WILLIEA has a point.

These are snippets from the link BB provided:

 

 

NZ-EU FTA: Fonterra Submission to MFAT February 2016

 

The EU and New Zealand are both competitive producers of dairy products and both

are net exporters of dairy. In 2015 New Zealand produced around 21.5 billion litres of

milk. In comparison, the EU produces more than 150 billion litres annually with

Production growing rapidly following the abolition of the milk production quota

system. Germany and France each produce more milk than New Zealand does

.

The EU produces around 7.5 times as much milk as New Zealand and the EU’s

milk supply is growing faster than New Zealand in percentage and absolute volume terms.

 

 

 

The total EU butter market size is over 2 million tonnes and the cheese market size is

over 9 million tonnes – the cheese market alone is far larger than New Zealand’s total production of all dairy products.

_________________________

 

 Apart from assisting a wee independent nation do we really need tae import stuff from New Zealand?

The key point is that we, as consumers, should decide what we buy in a free and open market. The EU's market is distorted by quotas and subsidies. Those subsidies are, in effect, making the EU exports cheaper, i.e. distorting the market to the detriment of more efficient producers.

Wallonia, in blocking the EU's trade deals with Canada, objected to free trade in agricultural and dairy products. There must have been a grubby deal to buy out Wallonia and get the deal through. In the meantime, Britain can still block deal (all Member States must sign and ratify it) as part of the Brexit negotiations.

[Wee Willie]

1 minute ago, Bishop Briggs said:

The key point is that we, as consumers, should decide what we buy in a free and open market. The EU's market is distorted by quotas and subsidies. Those subsidies are, in effect, making the EU exports cheaper, i.e. distorting the market to the detriment of more efficient producers.

Wallonia, in blocking the EU's trade deals with Canada, objected to free trade in agricultural and dairy products. There must have been a grubby deal to buy out Wallonia and get the deal through. In the meantime, Britain can still block deal (all Member States must sign and ratify it) as part of the Brexit negotiations.

I dinnae disagree wi' ye but using that logic there shouldnae be any trade agreements - everything should be free & open.

Going back tae whit I posted after seeing the evidence regarding dairy products in the EU & NZ -  

Apart from assisting a wee independent nation do we really need tae import stuff from New Zealand?

[Bishop Briggs]

1 minute ago, Wee Willie said:

I dinnae disagree wi' ye but using that logic there shouldnae be any trade agreements - everything should be free & open.

Going back tae whit I posted after seeing the evidence regarding dairy products in the EU & NZ -  

Apart from assisting a wee independent nation do we really need tae import stuff from New Zealand?

Spot on. Free trade agreements are, in practice, managed trade agreements. They negotiated by politicians and managed by bureaucrats. 

On importing from New Zealand, the same argument can be made for all imports and trade with other countries. Do we need to import butter from Denmark (Lurpak) or Ireland (Kerrygold)? We don't need to but we consumers want them. 

It's the same with beer, e.g. Beck's, Peroni, Kilkenny and Guinness. A significant number Scottish consumers prefer them to Tennant's and McEwan's. It's the same with whiskey (e.g. Bushmills and Jack Daniels), cars, electrical goods etc. 

The alternative is economic nationalism - trade restrictions through tariffs, quotas or bans. It has a big price - major restrictions on freedom of choice. You have to but what the politicians tell you to buy, even if it's rubbish.

Do you only buy Scottish, British or European products? If not, what would you be willing to give up? Would you vote for politicians who would force you to give them up or raise their prices through tariffs?

[Cyclizine]

Britain imports wool, lamb, meet and dairy products from New Zealand despite the EU's tariffs. A free trade deal would make those products cheaper. 

Are you dismissing the opportunities for an independent country with 5 million inhabitants to gain from bilateral free trade deals? An independent Scotland would need one with rUK which already has plenty of wool, lamb, meat and dairy.

Are you advocating Scottish economic nationalism, i.e. protectionism with tariffs? Very Donald Trump!

 

Did you just say that the UK imports wool, lamb, meat and dairy from NZ (an independent country of ~5m people); but rUK would not import from an independent Scotland (a country of ~5m people) because it has enough wool, lamb, meat and dairy?

[AUFC90]

1 minute ago, Cyclizine said:

 

Did you just say that the UK imports wool, lamb, meat and dairy from NZ (an independent country of ~5m people); but rUK would not unit from an independent Scotland (a country of ~5m people) because it has enough wool, lamb, meat and dairy?

 

An independent Scotland wont export anything to the UK because.....well, just because.

[Bishop Briggs]

Just now, Cyclizine said:

 

Did you just say that the UK imports wool, lamb, meat and dairy from NZ (an independent country of ~5m people); but rUK would not unit from an independent Scotland (a country of ~5m people) because it has enough wool, lamb, meat and dairy?

 

No. The exact opposite. I was saying that an independent Scotland should have free trade agreement with rUK. It should have as many FTAs as possible.