edinabear Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 Were they not going to put the amateur leagues beneath West of Scotland at some point? Far easier just to do that 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basile Boli Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 17 hours ago, Burnieman said: Correct, all it serves is the SAFA. You have no idea how long you would need to exist as an amateur club before you got the chance to apply which even then may not be successful. Crackpot idea. You haven’t answered my question over 2 threads - surely it is preferable for a team to at least have a mens side playing at amateur level for a given period of time before a WOS space opens up rather than having no mens side at all? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 11 minutes ago, Basile Boli said: You haven’t answered my question over 2 threads - surely it is preferable for a team to at least have a mens side playing at amateur level for a given period of time before a WOS space opens up rather than having no mens side at all? I've not avoided anything. It makes no difference, so the answer is no. Using the example of a well run community club who run mens teams upto say U19/20/21 level and have facilities that tick WoSFL boxes, really don't need to enter an adult team at a very low level in the amateurs (if the ammy league they join has multiple divisions) - and for an indeterminate amount of time - to prove that they will be any better an addition to the lowest level of the WoSFL than anyone else. They are probably better run than a stand alone ammy team. It's not as if it makes any difference to the process, which will still be one of application in front of a committee. This is more about the SAFA probably moaning about clubs leaving to go senior, and wanting to try and remain relevant. It's of little benefit to senior leagues. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 15 minutes ago, Burnieman said: Using the example of a well run community club who run mens teams upto say U19/20/21 level and have facilities that tick WoSFL boxes, really don't need to enter an adult team at a very low level in the amateurs (if the ammy league they join has multiple divisions) - and for an indeterminate amount of time - to prove that they will be any better an addition to the lowest level of the WoSFL than anyone else. They are probably better run than a stand alone ammy team. Pyramid Development Leagues swallowed up a lot of youth football. and the SAFA Leagues already incorporate u19-21s divisions in there structure. u19-21s teams can even compete in the Amateur Cup now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basile Boli Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 2 hours ago, Burnieman said: I've not avoided anything. It makes no difference, so the answer is no. Using the example of a well run community club who run mens teams upto say U19/20/21 level and have facilities that tick WoSFL boxes, really don't need to enter an adult team at a very low level in the amateurs (if the ammy league they join has multiple divisions) - and for an indeterminate amount of time - to prove that they will be any better an addition to the lowest level of the WoSFL than anyone else. They are probably better run than a stand alone ammy team. It's not as if it makes any difference to the process, which will still be one of application in front of a committee. This is more about the SAFA probably moaning about clubs leaving to go senior, and wanting to try and remain relevant. It's of little benefit to senior leagues. How many clubs have left the SAFA to go Senior in the last 3 seasons? A handful at most. Off the top of my head, Thorn Athletic, Linlithgow Thistle, Rothie Rovers, West Park United? I’d say the SAFA have more pressing matters to worry about than losing teams to Senior leagues. I think it’s entirely fair for the WOSFL to expect prospective applicant clubs to have at least shown some determination to run an adult mens team instead of just deciding one day to bypass existing amateur leagues because a better option has come up. After all, these boys clubs-turned-senior clubs who’ve joined the pyramid in recent years all preach about a “pathway”. If they’re that serious about having a pathway then already having a functioning mens team should be a non-negotiable. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 What's any of this got to do with EOSL? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 1 hour ago, Basile Boli said: How many clubs have left the SAFA to go Senior in the last 3 seasons? A handful at most. Off the top of my head, Thorn Athletic, Linlithgow Thistle, Rothie Rovers, West Park United? I’d say the SAFA have more pressing matters to worry about than losing teams to Senior leagues. I think it’s entirely fair for the WOSFL to expect prospective applicant clubs to have at least shown some determination to run an adult mens team instead of just deciding one day to bypass existing amateur leagues because a better option has come up. After all, these boys clubs-turned-senior clubs who’ve joined the pyramid in recent years all preach about a “pathway”. If they’re that serious about having a pathway then already having a functioning mens team should be a non-negotiable. Nobody is bypassing anything, since when was it normal to have to join amateur football before becoming a senior club? If there are vacancies, you accept applications and judge them on merit, whether the club have kicked a ball in anger or not. A player pathway ideally doesn't involved amateur football, otherwise it's kinda failed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 46 minutes ago, HibeeJibee said: What's any of this got to do with EOSL? Hee and haw thankfully. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stag Nation Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 16 minutes ago, Burnieman said: Nobody is bypassing anything, since when was it normal to have to join amateur football before becoming a senior club? If there are vacancies, you accept applications and judge them on merit, whether the club have kicked a ball in anger or not. Indeed. It's not so long since the SPFL admitted a new club which had never kicked a ball at all. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginaro Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 (edited) 3 hours ago, HibeeJibee said: What's any of this got to do with EOSL? Indeed, unlike the WOS the EOS isn't at capacity in the bottom division and there's a nice regional amateur system below - compared to the mess of four dwindling leagues covering the same west central belt area. Edited March 6 by Ginaro 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 23 minutes ago, Ginaro said: Indeed, unlike the WOS the EOS isn't at capacity in the bottom division and there's a nice regional amateur system below - compared to the mess of four dwindling leagues covering the same west central belt area. Chances are Inverkeithing wouldn't have got in based on their original application these days. Same with Edinburgh South. Letham couldn't get in based on their ground. Rosyth just folded chasing a ground good enough. Peebles Rovers are meant to be moving. As entry standards rise and the Third Division shrivels. What sort of links are being fostered to interested clubs other than better luck next year? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamthebam Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 What other clubs would have grounds that meet the standard? Apart from Duns and Eyemouth United I can't think of any. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 2 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said: As entry standards rise and the Third Division shrivels. What sort of links are being fostered to interested clubs other than better luck next year? Not sure the Third Division will shrivel longer term. The EoS are probably looking at the next wee while of accepting clubs from the LL without many clubs going the other way. At some point soon the WoS clubs are going to get their turn at dominating the play-off. Edinburgh Uni will drop perhaps this season, Gala and Civil Service may not survive in the LL beyond the next few years and you may also see a former SPFL club drop again. I don't think the EoSFL need to pro-actively recruit clubs, the door is always open. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Patterson Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 The obvious solution for the EoS is to put LEAFA, Borders League and Kingdom Leagues officially underneath the Third Division, and allow clubs that win those leagues into the Third Division should they meet basic requirements and are willing to come up, with a view to eventually introducing relegation if/when the Third Division reaches capacity. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 13 hours ago, Ray Patterson said: The obvious solution for the EoS is to put LEAFA, Borders League and Kingdom Leagues officially underneath the Third Division, and allow clubs that win those leagues into the Third Division should they meet basic requirements and are willing to come up, with a view to eventually introducing relegation if/when the Third Division reaches capacity. I don't think there's any solution required, as there is no problem to solve. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basile Boli Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 1 hour ago, Burnieman said: I don't think there's any solution required, as there is no problem to solve. Do you want a full pyramid or not? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 15 minutes ago, Basile Boli said: Do you want a full pyramid or not? We have a full Pyramid. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 If there are clubs wanting to join but unable to get in. Then its not full. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 (edited) 8 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said: If there are clubs wanting to join but unable to get in. Then its not full. EoSFL isn't full, which is the point under discussion. Therefore there is no "solution" required as mentioned above. Edited March 12 by Burnieman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 53 minutes ago, Burnieman said: EoSFL isn't full, which is the point under discussion. Therefore there is no "solution" required as mentioned above. Nobody has said anything about the EoS being full. The suggestions above have been about finding a means to extend beyond it. There are clubs that would want to be part of the pyramid that can't access due to ever increasing ground criteria. Clubs that are currently in it that wouldn't be today if they were an applicant. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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