gannonball Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Leith Green said: This is true - however I think that part of the reason clubs didnt want strict liability is that (under some definitions) they would be held entirely responsible for the behaviour of all fans in the stadium. Sorry but this is nonsense. Even now if fans trash seats/toilets their club foots the bill usually. Under corporate law yes they will have some sort of liability for safety but no one would be expecting another club to be responsible for the actions of fans they sometimes don't even sell tickets directly to. Edited March 18, 2023 by gannonball 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJF Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Leith Green said: This is true - however I think that part of the reason clubs didnt want strict liability is that (under some definitions) they would be held entirely responsible for the behaviour of all fans in the stadium. At ER, everything is fine for Killie, Dundee Utd, Aberdeen, St Mirren (as examples) but there are 2 clubs who create what amounts to a fucking warzone inside and out every time they visit. I usually arrive at ER from Meadowbank Retail Park direction, and the behaviour of Celtic and Rangers fans is appalling (and I am broad minded). The police basically let them away with behaviour that, for fans of other clubs, would mean horses, truncheons and arrests. While the police start by checking all tickets in an orderly way, when it gets close to ko time they just cave, let them all push in and double up at turnstyles, leading to dangerous overcapacity. They act like a mini army arriving in towns and cities all over Scotland and creating chaos and the police just shite it. I know the act is a complete crock of crap, but the the number of Rangers and Celtic fans dealt with under the Offensive Behaviour at Football nonsense was laughable in comparison with other clubs. I love the atmos of having opposition fans in the ground, but its really horrible when they come to town - there are people who simply dont take their kids on those matches. That cant be right. A lot of this is complete hyperbole. After attending the recent match at ER, there was absolutely no issue with the fans arriving (other than the bottle neck at the ticket checkpoint). No fighting in the streets, no riots, no arrest worthy offences (unless you deem pissing down alley ways as an offence worthy of arrest). The vast, vast majority of fans are just interested in getting inside the stadium mate. Clubs don’t want strict liability as it would mean instances of vodka bottles being thrown at players from the stand would result in sanctions for the club. Edited March 18, 2023 by AJF 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molotov Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 (edited) 48 minutes ago, gannonball said: Sorry but this is nonsense. Even now if fans trash seats/toilets their club foots the bill usually. Under corporate law yes they will have some sort of liability for safety but no one would be expecting another club to be responsible for the actions of fans they sometimes don't even sell tickets directly to. It’s a well known fact that when both sets of your scummy fans go to away games the police supervisors have different instructions over stewarding/policing than when diddy clubs play each other. Most of us have witnessed the treatment of the “highland hordes” of Inverness or Ross County fans being ejected from our grounds for the audacity to stand up and cheer their team on while the following week we are subjected to disgusting and immoral chanting about killing Catholics or Protestants. I’d rather you told the truth and called me an atheist b*****d rather than the typical arse cheek references. I can safely say I could go into any away city or town and have a pint and a chat with “diddy” club opposition supporters win, lose or draw. Very little chance of doing that near Ibrox or Parkhead without verbal or physical abuse. FTOF Edited March 18, 2023 by Molotov 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gannonball Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 20 minutes ago, Molotov said: It’s a well known fact that when both sets of your scummy fans go to away games the police supervisors have different instructions over stewarding/policing than when diddy clubs play each other. Most of us have witnessed the treatment of the “highland hordes” of Inverness or Ross County fans being ejected from our grounds for the audacity to stand up and cheer their team on while the following week we are subjected to disgusting and immoral chanting about killing Catholics or Protestants. I’d rather you told the truth and called me an atheist b*****d rather than the typical arse cheek references. I can safely say I could go into any away city or town and have a pint and a chat with “diddy” club opposition supporters win, lose or draw. Very little chance of doing that near Ibrox or Parkhead without verbal or physical abuse. FTOF This is quite a victim complex you are portraying, are you sure you aren't one of us brother? As for the religious stuff it's fortunately becoming less relevant in society year on year now, I'm an atheist myself like dare I say most of the people I go to the football with. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salvo Montalbano Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 Loving the idea that pishing in someone's close is somehow perfectly fine behaviour. Of course that's not even the case, since back gardens, front gardens, sheds, house walls etc are also fair game. As is open public drinking (despite local by-laws), openly touting tickets, fighting amongst themselves, singing sectarian songs and the like. That's outside the ground, once they're in then the singing, the flags with sectarian slogans and logos, the persistent standing, the smoking and vaping, and just the general atmosphere can be pretty poisonous, especially if they are losing. The Police do nothing and the clubs do nothing. To suggest otherwise is wild. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molotov Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 (edited) 9 minutes ago, gannonball said: This is quite a victim complex you are portraying, are you sure you aren't one of us brother? As for the religious stuff it's fortunately becoming less relevant in society year on year now, I'm an atheist myself like dare I say most of the people I go to the football with. I’d argue that the vast majority of your supporters and your arse cheek brethren are atheists but it doesn’t seem to stop you indulging in sectarian and bigotry songs and chants every week. Weirdos Edited March 18, 2023 by Molotov 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leith Green Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 1 hour ago, gannonball said: Sorry but this is nonsense. Even now if fans trash seats/toilets their club foots the bill usually. Under corporate law yes they will have some sort of liability for safety but no one would be expecting another club to be responsible for the actions of fans they sometimes don't even sell tickets directly to. 38 minutes ago, AJF said: A lot of this is complete hyperbole. After attending the recent match at ER, there was absolutely no issue with the fans arriving (other than the bottle neck at the ticket checkpoint). No fighting in the streets, no riots, no arrest worthy offences (unless you deem pissing down alley ways as an offence worthy of arrest). The vast, vast majority of fans are just interested in getting inside the stadium mate. Clubs don’t want strict liability as it would mean instances of vodka bottles being thrown at players from the stand would result in sanctions for the club. I am not having a pop at you two directly, but on Rangers and Celtic away fan behaviour, its absolutely true that - (1) Rangers and Celtic are "let away" with behaviour that the police deem unacceptable from fans of all other clubs. (2) Overcrowding absolutely happens, not just Easter Road. (3) Criminal and anti social behaviour from the away support of both clubs is off the scale compared to other clubs. Hearts bring a full away end to Easter Road and while there are obvious derby "tensions" its not even in the same universe as Rangers and Celtic. To bring it back to strict liability for a minute, I know that Hibs have (more than) our fair share of coked up arseholes who chuck stuff at players etc so I am not absolving us........but its unlikely that fans of other clubs wont take their kids to the match "because Hibs or Hearts or Aberdeen are in town". 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aim Here Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 2 minutes ago, Leith Green said: To bring it back to strict liability for a minute, I know that Hibs have (more than) our fair share of coked up arseholes who chuck stuff at players etc so I am not absolving us........but its unlikely that fans of other clubs wont take their kids to the match "because Hibs or Hearts or Aberdeen are in town". I suspect the Edinburgh Derby has a high enough coked-up-arsehole quotient that it's an exception to this. Certainly there are some Hibees who don't take their kids along to ER when Hearts are playing, and I imagine it works the other way. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bairnardo Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 Iv never been to a worse atmosphere than Ibrox, and that's a game against a Diddy side. Iv also never seen worse around out Stadium than when the cheeks are in town. I have no idea why Old Firms fans opt to remain blind and deaf to what is to my eyes, a total consensus among other fans in Scotland. It has recently extended to clubs taking action to lower the numbers of them due to home fan complaints, even as they know it might come at financial expense. If "but its my team...." high school logic is for you, then fair enough. Continue to tell the rest of us that we are all just as bad. But I bet in survey of perceptions of being at and away ground, and having away fans at your own, the arse cheeks would receive some pretty damming feedback from all, and I be Hibs/Hearts, Dundee/United, Ayr/Killie, Falkirk/Pars games would all be noted as way less intimidating and nasty than having the uglies round, or visiting them in their bins. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leith Green Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 1 minute ago, Aim Here said: I suspect the Edinburgh Derby has a high enough coked-up-arsehole quotient that it's an exception to this. Certainly there are some Hibees who don't take their kids along to ER when Hearts are playing, and I imagine it works the other way. Maybe, but perhaps I should have been clearer that I was describing away trips "out of town" if you know what I mean? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dons_1988 Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 Old firm fans probably watch England fans behaviour abroad and think it’s disgraceful. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eez-eh Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 20 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said: Old firm fans probably watch England fans behaviour abroad and think it’s disgraceful. The Rangers fans won’t need to watch as they’ll be in amongst them. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Khaki Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Bairnardo said: Iv never been to a worse atmosphere than Ibrox, and that's a game against a Diddy side. Iv also never seen worse around out Stadium than when the cheeks are in town. Last time I was at Ibrox it was just to pal my Forfar supporting mate to their match v's the home side. Stood there absolutely perplexed by the torrent of sectarian hate we were subjected to, including repeatedly being accused of being 'f****n b*****ds'. Utterly bizarre. It's part of the reason why I just laugh when their defenders protest that sectarian hate isn't part of the fabric of that club and one of the main underlying reasons for their continued existence. The 'only a minority' thing seems plausible enough, but then I lived most of my life in Abbeyhill and remember having to check the fixture calendar for meetings between three teams that I have no interest in, purely so I could warn my missus not to be out and about in the locale on those afternoons/evenings. The things I've seen happen to locals and local businesses who were naive enough not to close or stay indoors are some of the worst examples I've ever witnessed of people acting like complete and utter scum, and the most infuriating thing about it is that it invariably occurred in full view of police who just stood by and watched it happen. Edited March 18, 2023 by Boo Khaki 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Stiles Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 I expect the diddy clubs were told they vote for strict liability at their peril. The bigots used to be allowed to use their own stewards at away games to make sure their mates could do what they want. I'd be surprised if this still wasn't the case. I don't see home fans only for the bigots as tinpot at all. That it pisses both sets of fans off at the same time makes it worthwhile itself. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eaststandee Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crawford Bridge Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 The fanny in the maroon jacket is my "cousin". He grew up in a staunch household full of royal tat and is a total pretend casual. His Dad is the biggest racist, bigot I've ever known. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnydun Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 3 hours ago, Eaststandee said: I have always wondered why these c***s don't get battered by their fellow supporters. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leith Green Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 3 hours ago, Eaststandee said: Surely that's a Photoshop job? Spoiler There's no way there are that many ugly kunts in one place? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leith Green Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 28 minutes ago, Crawford Bridge said: His Dad is the biggest racist, bigot I've ever known Cannae be, that particular honour goes to the masons up the road from me. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molotov Posted March 18, 2023 Share Posted March 18, 2023 15 minutes ago, johnnydun said: I have always wondered why these c***s don't get battered by their fellow supporters. Or nicked by polis for bevvying in the street. Surely that has been done as a joke. Surely? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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