Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[vikingTON]

And now we have the WHO furiously backpedaling on their face mask idiocy, just about the UK alone staying out there like a spare tit now:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/health-52945210&ved=0ahUKEwi3mbKqg-3pAhX-SxUIHTgvAZsQyM8BCCcwAA&usg=AOvVaw0rh6e3Ld80RZQCIwx1bpfc&ampcf=1

[Todd_is_God]

I guess the problem the Government have is that they choose to cherry pick whatever statistic is trending best to highlight how positive their (belated) efforts have been, which then draws attention when the trend changes.

If R has been slowly rising over the last month, and this is a bad thing in isolation, this should surely have lead to an increased number of detected infections, hospital admissions, ICU beds in use and deaths, when the opposite has been true.

The easier it becomes to get a test, the more mild cases will be detected. That this is a possibility and overall infections continue to fall suggests it's something to keep an eye on, but not currently be alarmed about.

 

[Michael W]

The R number rising across the UK simply isn't reflected in the daily cases being recorded. So either it's wrong, regional data is being utilised further than it should be or the initial R estimates were an underestimate. The estimate is based on data from two weeks ago but the number of cases diagnosed continues on a downward trend. 

I think we all know that confirmed cases are an understatement, but if more people are catching it these should also be rising. Alternatively, maybe people are indeed being infected and are not bothering to get tested or are experiencing mild/symptomatic cases. 

[sjc]

22 hours ago, Shandon Par said:

That's good to hear. Though if you do start, make sure and post some pics to @sjc

 

[bendan]

1 hour ago, MixuFruit said:

 

 

As I said before: furlough.

 

Yes, obviously a WM decision. I don't agree that you needed furlough in place to shut the schools, or reduce time in school. Nor is it it relevant to things like PPE or care homes.

[Granny Danger]

43 minutes ago, pandarilla said:

57 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

I'll have a go Willie. Independence is probably the best way ahead for Scotland, but it doesn't mean nothing else matters.

Absolutely this.

Independence

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Everything else.

[Wee Willie]

57 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

If you have Nationalists on one side and unionists on the other side what is a 'reasoned middle ground'?

I'll have a go Willie. Independence is probably the best way ahead for Scotland, but it doesn't mean nothing else matters.

But that's no an answer.

The question was that there was a 'reasoned middle ground' and I asked what it was.

For example - SNP say no to Trident in Scottish waters but unionists support it being in Scotland.

In your opinion what would be a 'reasonable middle ground' ?

Also the SNP are unhappy that Scotland has to pay a share of expensive English projects but unionists are happy for Scotland to pay.

In your opinion what would be a 'reasonable middle ground' ?

______________

I am hoping that alta-pete and NotThe Pars explain their reasonable middle ground.

[Paco]

There are several ways the R numbers being quoted are correct, while recorded cases still fall -

1. Smaller localised spikes, rather than mass national rises

2. People picking up a viral load which isn’t significant enough to cause serious/any illness

3. Falls in recorded cases from population centres outstripping recorded cases in newer and less populated areas.

There have been murmurs of smaller viral load being recorded in Italy, which effectively means social distancing/face masks/current restrictions working as they should. In itself people picking up weak versions of the virus isn’t an issue, if they’re not vulnerable. It might even be desirable if antibodies are produced.

On point three, the USA certainly saw mass falls in New York while the rest of the country edged up, meaning their overall data didn’t fall as quickly as expected. Do NHS England release which areas the new recorded cases are from?

You would hope SAGE/the UK Government have a handle on exactly what’s going on and if any of these scenarios apply, but I don’t think anyone could be surprised at this stage if they don’t. Easier to just hope the R is wrong.

[NotThePars]

6 minutes ago, Wee Willie said:

 

______________

I am hoping that alta-pete and NotThe Pars explain their reasonable middle ground.

I was taking the piss but since you're an honest fella I'll give you my best summary that I can come up with: independence is good but the forces leading it aren't.

[Thereisalight..]

3 hours ago, Steven W said:

Sky News running an article about the Qatar World Cup and how they're ready to comply with any health and safety changes relating to the pandemic.

First time I've seen something so far in advance mentioned in the same breath.

The only other thing I’ve heard of that far in advance is folk having to self isolate for 14 days, any time they come into contact with those with covid. This is happening for 2 years seemingly on that track and trace 

[welshbairn]

19 minutes ago, Wee Willie said:

But that's no an answer.

The question was that there was a 'reasoned middle ground' and I asked what it was.

For example - SNP say no to Trident in Scottish waters but unionists support it being in Scotland.

In your opinion what would be a 'reasonable middle ground' ?

Also the SNP are unhappy that Scotland has to pay a share of expensive English projects but unionists are happy for Scotland to pay.

In your opinion what would be a 'reasonable middle ground' ?

______________

I am hoping that alta-pete and NotThe Pars explain their reasonable middle ground.

I'd say you have 10 years to get your nukes out and we'll be charging £5 billion a year in rent in the meantime.

And you can have your HS2 if you start building a high speed rail service between Inverness and Edinburgh/Glasgow, and upgrade the Wick line, pronto.

[Wee Willie]

12 minutes ago, NotThePars said:

I was taking the piss but since you're an honest fella I'll give you my best summary that I can come up with: independence is good but the forces leading it aren't.

Fair do's.

That leaves alta-pete for his views unless he was taking the piss as well.

[Thereisalight..]

I think the SG and WM both did a lot wrong during this pandemic. Firstly flights into the uk should have had mandatory checking/quarantine since early March at the very latest. The whole lack of PPE was an embarrassing state of affairs. Oldies being punted from hospitals into care homes without being tested is mind boggling. The only thing I’ll give the Government credit for is the furlough scheme and grants to businesses. 

[Wee Willie]

1 minute ago, welshbairn said:

I'd say you have 10 years to get your nukes out and we'll be charging £5 billion a year in rent in the meantime.

And you can have your HS2 if you start building a high speed rail service between Inverness and Edinburgh/Glasgow, and upgrade the Wick line, pronto.

I would prefer that Trident was gone tomorrow but fair do's.

I spent 30 years on the railway and I would prefer all of Scotlands railway routes to be electrified.

Do we give England its HS2 as long as they pay a percentage of the HS service in Scotland?

Seems like they get a guid deal.

And would ye really consider that as a 'reasonable middle ground' ?

I wonder what alta-pete will say?

[Dan Steele]

14 minutes ago, Thereisalight.. said:

Oldies being punted from hospitals into care homes without being tested is mind boggling.

A lot has been done in a less than satisfactory way. The whole care home situation needs some serious looking at. HC-One, run by private equity, paid out £48.5 million in dividends over 2 years. They've posted a loss every year bar 1 since 2011. Their Skye home is being 'overseen' by the NHS. If the SNP want a radical idea to underpin the next elections they can put this at the heart of their manifesto. Get rid of privately run care homes (they get government money as there is a threshold on folks savings whereby Councils 'top up') and bring them under NHS control. Have a National Care Service running alongside the NHS and make it truly from cradle to grave. 

(This 'oldies being punted' stuff doesn't help discussion, imo)

 

[Wee Willie]

8 minutes ago, Thereisalight.. said:

I think the SG and WM both did a lot wrong during this pandemic. Firstly flights into the uk should have had mandatory checking/quarantine since early March at the very latest. The whole lack of PPE was an embarrassing state of affairs. Oldies being punted from hospitals into care homes without being tested is mind boggling. The only thing I’ll give the Government credit for is the furlough scheme and grants to businesses. 

I agree with what you have written but you and I and everyone else on this forum are just bit players.

There is eff-all we can do to change the circumstances therefore I leave that to the Scottish government to make the decisions.

Strange that some others in Scotland would rather listen to Westminster.

[HeartsOfficialMoaner]

1 hour ago, MixuFruit said:

 

 

As I said before: furlough.

 

That's fine but what was the opinion of the SG when Boris was giving it the herd chat. That was at the 3rd of March. I can't remember anything coming from them then, did they go missing in action? I can't remember Nicola saying Boris had got it all wrong when people from other countries did.

Is she now just protecting Calderwood and Leitch or what?

[pandarilla]

I agree with what you have written but you and I and everyone else on this forum are just bit players.
There is eff-all we can do to change the circumstances therefore I leave that to the Scottish government to make the decisions.
Strange that some others in Scotland would rather listen to Westminster.

There's a lot more you can do than simply rant in a virus thread on a football forum.

Join an organisation. Go to meetings (online ones for now, unfortunately). Volunteer. Get out there and promote whatever version of independence you believe in (the yes campaign is dominated by the snp but it's certainly not the only organisation looking for members).

[vikingTON]

1 minute ago, Wee Willie said:

I agree with what you have written but you and I and everyone else on this forum are just bit players.

There is eff-all we can do to change the circumstances therefore I leave that to the Scottish government to make the decisions.

Strange that some others in Scotland would rather listen to Westminster.

Why is your all-encompassing comparison point 'Westminster' or 'England'? Why shouldn't Scotland be compared to New Zealand, or Slovakia, or Norway or just about every other small and developed country that hasn't made a rip-roaring c**t of it? Why does political affiliation to the cause of independence - a goal that I support - lead you to this sort of braying, bovine deference to the government of the day?

This is the sort of small-timer thinking that Scotland needs to thoroughly purge itself of if it wants to be both treated and governed like a self-respecting sovereign nation.

[Jacksgranda]

26 minutes ago, The Skelpit Lug said:

A lot has been done in a less than satisfactory way. The whole care home situation needs some serious looking at. HC-One, run by private equity, paid out £48.5 million in dividends over 2 years. They've posted a loss every year bar 1 since 2011. Their Skye home is being 'overseen' by the NHS. If the SNP want a radical idea to underpin the next elections they can put this at the heart of their manifesto. Get rid of privately run care homes (they get government money as there is a threshold on folks savings whereby Councils 'top up') and bring them under NHS control. Have a National Care Service running alongside the NHS and make it truly from cradle to grave. 

(This 'oldies being punted' stuff doesn't help discussion, imo)

 

I agree with the rest of your post but re the bolded bit: Why not? That's exactly what happened, folk were discharged from hospital into care homes without being tested,covid-19 ran riot in many care homes, it was a disgrace what happened, a combination of private care homes (which I think is not the best way to go about care provision), lack of testing (in hopital/leaving hospital/in care home) and lack of PPE. And no lessons picked up from Exercise Cygnus or what happened elsewhere in the world/Europe. We had a two/three month advantage  over everyone else - imagine the catastrophe if we had have been first like Italy was.