The Wildcat Douglas Ross Experiment

[tamthebam]

"My instant response is he's in Elgin and the national Tory leader is in London".- Michael Gove

"Boris Johnson sacked key ministers in a dramatic reshaping of the Tory government, but kept Michael Gove in charge of strengthening the union."- Oct 2021. 

You only had one job.... 

[Ric]

That's because Gove knows where the bodies are buried. Why else was Gove rewarded with cabinet positions when he quite clearly scuppered Johnsons previous leadership bid.

 

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, Ric said:

Scotland won't vote for independence. I mean don't get me wrong, with every fibre of my body I wish that not be to the case, but you can take us (as a country) to the edge any number of times but we will refuse to jump. Traditionally that has a lot to do with generational change, there were a lot of boomers, and generations before, kicking around that were wedded to the union psychologically. It's true that that is a dwindling number for all the reasons you'd expect, I still see Westminster not just "pulling a fast one"* but literally carpet bombing the media and online with endless F.U.D. and the re-mergence of Project Fear (it was dusted for IndyRef then Brexit but has been lying low of late) to the point that they saturate the discourse and pushing enough "maybe"s onto the union side.

The tories have devastated Scotland, politically, culturally and ethically, and the worst part is that for enough people that's fine and they just keep on sucking up to the union. It's our own fault we are not independent and that is the most damning problem.

 

* edit: when I say "pull a fast one", there is absolutely no chance the next referendum will be fought on the same grounds as either the last one or Brexit. Gove, the person responsible for leading any vote should A30 be triggered, has already hinted at this. It will not be "a simple majority" it will have criteria that a % of people need to vote, or that a % greater than a simple majority must be reached. People will point out how it's different to Brexit but Westminster won't care because they gatekeep A30 and it's effectively "their way or the highway".

This is interesting as many of the hordes who turn up at Ibrox on a Saturday and blindly vote Tory and hate "that wee nippy" etc probably don't consider themselves as "us" meaning that they are "British not Scottish" as such I don't think you can blame the rest of the nation who are capable of thinking for themselves but are being snookered as a result of decades / centuries of religious bigotry / indoctrination of a large proportion of our population.

As you say, it's pretty much 50/50 and being honest we need to be sure that we'll win if having another one anytime soon, however their arrogance might be what ultimately destroys them and of course Brexit is the Ace card which may just sway that extra 2% or 3% that is needed to swing it. I'm sure they would try and stop us by any means necessary but if there's a will then I'm sure the people of Scotland will ultimately decide the rules, irrespective of what they try and do to stop us.

My own thoughts are that late 2022 through 2023 will see the Chickens come home to roost as regards serious inflation, mass unemployment and the associated deprivation and whether people choose to blame the Pandemic, Brexit, The Tories or a mixture of the lot should only be good for the independence argument.

But what do I know ??

[Clown Job]

1 hour ago, GAD said:

This is some message coming from Westminster here, basically the Scottish Tories, and that entire branch of the party are irrelevant, and hold no sway or influence whatsoever, except the one that was appointed by London. That's out there now, it's everywhere and if there is another indyref it's going to be played on repeat. It's going to be very difficult to talk about nations of equals and leading, not leaving when that is there, especially if the same mob are still in power at Westminster.

Not only Scotland

 

[betting competition]

In the last few days I've been surprised by Douglas Ross. He actually asked a decent question in the Covid update and now he said Boris should resign. Douglas Ross knows that Scotland doesn't like Boris so he doesn't have much to lose.

I hope Boris stays on as Prime Minister as it will only make independence support stronger. 

Edited January 13, 2022 by betting competition

[Ric]

7 minutes ago, WATTOO said:

This is interesting as many of the hordes who turn up at Ibrox on a Saturday and blindly vote Tory and hate "that wee nippy" etc probably don't consider themselves as "us" meaning that they are "British not Scottish" as such I don't think you can blame the rest of the nation who are capable of thinking for themselves but are being snookered as a result of decades / centuries of religious bigotry / indoctrination of a large proportion of our population.

Yes, when you abstract it away from the emotion, and trust me seeing mindless hordes promoting the unionist stance because of some narrow political or religious myopia certainly raises my emotions, we have to get our own house in order. I'd love to say "Scotland is a more progressive caring society" but simply from living in Glasgow I encounter right-wing bigots in Rangers shirts on a far too common a basis - and I am happy to detail each and every case should people wish to push back on that.

The bottom line is we are all Jock Tamson's bairns and sadly that includes those within the unionist camp. How do we convince them to join "the other side"? We can't, we may be able to chip away at the edges but it's deeply entrenched in a paranoid and arrogant culture which in turn is enforced by religious sectarianism and loyalty to a football club.. In the same way racism is indoctrinated in the home, it's not learnt "naturally", so is religious fundamentalism and political intolerance.

Edited January 13, 2022 by Ric

[Benjamin_Nevis]

Whatever the arguments are over whether or not The Blurt could be PM whilst in the Lords is pretty irrelevant. She'd never entertain it in a million years. She can sit in Ermine, absolutely coin it in, tweet the occasional outright lie and there will be absolutely nothing for her to worry about. As PM (although one could argue those points also apply to BoJo) she certainly won't be free from examination by the media on all sides. You'd have the likes of the Express slyly questioning the merits of having a one of them as a Conservative Prime Minister and she'd obviously get a regular shredding from the left leaning press on her total lack of principles and general hopelessness when even remotely challenged.

Let's not forget of course that this is someone who when her beloved Conservative party eagerly partnered up with the homophobes-ridden DUP, couldn't being herself to say anything publicly about it. She's an incompetent coward (although so is BoJo tbf). 

[velo army]

10 minutes ago, Day of the Lords said:

Whatever the arguments are over whether or not The Blurt could be PM whilst in the Lords is pretty irrelevant. She'd never entertain it in a million years. She can sit in Ermine, absolutely coin it in, tweet the occasional outright lie and there will be absolutely nothing for her to worry about. As PM (although one could argue those points also apply to BoJo) she certainly won't be free from examination by the media on all sides. You'd have the likes of the Express slyly questioning the merits of having a one of them as a Conservative Prime Minister and she'd obviously get a regular shredding from the left leaning press on her total lack of principles and general hopelessness when even remotely challenged.

Let's not forget of course that this is someone who when her beloved Conservative party eagerly partnered up with the homophobes-ridden DUP, couldn't being herself to say anything publicly about it. She's an incompetent coward (although so is BoJo tbf). 

I distinctly remember her saying she was willing to give it support so long as gay rights in the rest of the UK were unaffected. I remember going fucking tits about this at the time as folk used to use her homosexuality as evidence that she was somehow progressive.

 

[Benjamin_Nevis]

2 minutes ago, velo army said:

I distinctly remember her saying she was willing to give it support so long as gay rights in the rest of the UK were unaffected. I remember going fucking tits about this at the time as folk used to use her homosexuality as evidence that she was somehow progressive.

 

I remember her being interviewed about it and basically running away 

[velo army]

5 minutes ago, Day of the Lords said:

I remember her being interviewed about it and basically running away 

Then it was maybe a shitehawk statement/tweet that one of her staffers released after said evasion.

Still not as toe curling as her defence of the rape clause though. Ooft.

 

[Ric]

31 minutes ago, Day of the Lords said:

Let's not forget of course that this is someone who when her beloved Conservative party eagerly partnered up with the homophobes-ridden DUP, couldn't being herself to say anything publicly about it. She's an incompetent coward (although so is BoJo tbf). 

Davidson stood up at Holyrood and defended the rape clause because it was based on powers reserved at Westminster. Do you really think her conscience will bother her now any agreement or support for the DUP is irrelevant to the tories?

Edited January 13, 2022 by Ric

[Clown Job]

1 hour ago, velo army said:

I distinctly remember her saying she was willing to give it support so long as gay rights in the rest of the UK were unaffected. I remember going fucking tits about this at the time as folk used to use her homosexuality as evidence that she was somehow progressive.

 

Did she not say she would back a proposal to reform the HOL but wouldn’t be making any effort to push for changes?

Basically I’ll support it if someone else does it 

[Theyellowbox]

It's funny as either BoJo goes (which is good for all of UK) or he stays and DROSS and the entire Scottish Tories are cut off by Westminster tories.

The status quo (as much as it is terrible for UK) is clearly a massive boost for the independence movement. 

[btb]

3 hours ago, Zern said:

Who will replaced first, Boris or Douglas?

This might be race that Douglas can win.

I see the Grauniad is reporting BJ is not being invited to the Scottish Tories spring conference - ouch!

Quote

The civil war between the Scottish Tories and Downing Street has deepened after it emerged that Boris Johnson will not be invited to address this spring’s Scottish Conservative conference – an unprecedented snub for a UK leader of the party.

 

[Ric]

Has he attended before? He was elected mid 2019 and there's been a pandemic for two years.

Has he been banned in the way I've banned <insert some random celebrity> from coming over for dinner at my house?

 

[Antlion]

50 minutes ago, Theyellowbox said:

It's funny as either BoJo goes (which is good for all of UK) or he stays and DROSS and the entire Scottish Tories are cut off by Westminster tories.

The status quo (as much as it is terrible for UK) is clearly a massive boost for the independence movement. 

Re the bit in bold, I’m not sure that follows. I mean, in a sane world it would, but in this world, he’d just get replaced by an equally witless waste of skin (but potentially a more dangerous one, because it would be one who is presented with a fresh veneer of authority).

[Antlion]

39 minutes ago, btb said:

I see the Grauniad is reporting BJ is not being invited to the Scottish Tories spring conference - ouch!

 

Well that’s just silly. Who are they going to perform after-dinner tricks for if the dear leader isn’t present? Annie Wells has been practising balancing a spoon on her nose and Ross has just had his jester’s hat re-belled.

Anyway, aren’t they better together? For that matter, can they even organise a conference - aren’t they too wee, too poor, and too stupid to do so without help from the leader?

Edited January 13, 2022 by Antlion

[btb]

3 minutes ago, Antlion said:

Well that’s just silly. Who are they going to perform after-dinner tricks for if the dear leader isn’t present? Annie Wells has been practising balancing a spoon on her nose and Ross has just had his jester’s hat re-belled.

Anyway, aren’t they better together? For that matter, can they even organise a conference - aren’t they too wee, too poor, and too stupid to do so without help from the leader?

For me it's a smart move - who in Scotchland is not gonna vote Tory over this little spat and it makes them look less of a "branch office" than Scottish Labour or Lib-Dems.

[Antlion]

16 minutes ago, btb said:

For me it's a smart move - who in Scotchland is not gonna vote Tory over this little spat and it makes them look less of a "branch office" than Scottish Labour or Lib-Dems.

If Labour and the Lib Dems north of the border were smart (and they’re not) they would play this kind of thing up as the northern Tories not being the good, loyal, better-together Britons that they give out (and the reputation of which won them the staunch vote). What they’ll do instead is nothing, because, basically, they are nothing.

[sophia]

6 hours ago, dirty dingus said:

Did he not make a documentary trying to say the borders were their own country.  Also pretty sure he was working for MI5 when he was wandering about the middle east and the architect of 77th Brigade when he was at the MOD office.

If you search rory stewart middleland you might find the two episodes.

From memory I think his general pitch was that the border is more of lazy merge from one area to another rather than a mandated line.