DeeTillEhDeh Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 I think you are all forgetting that Alba aren't there to oppose the SNP but to help by delivering a supermajority. That's the line isnt it? The supermajority delivered by the Greens surely? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J_Stewart Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 Would a third (or even fourth) electable Independence based party be a good thing? Yes Are Alba that Party? No Are Alba actually a net-deterrent to the cause of Independence through their constant berating of other Independence Parties, 'disgraced' (in the eyes of the public as a whole) leader, questionable representatives, and somewhat toxic online presence? For me, Absolutely yes. Whilst I vote for both, I can wholly understand people being frustrated with the SNP (I certainly don't agree with them on everything), and I can understand that the Greens might not be to everyone's taste, but IMO, they're the only viable options towards Independence and questioning that is madness. I've posted this before, but Sturgeon - as the highest profile example - has been a proponent of Scottish Independence for over 30 years, entering at a point where they were essentially a joke party, and when the idea of them being even a notion in politics on this isle was fanciful. To suggest that she's not actually interested in Scottish Independence - a literal lifelong ambition - is insanity, and the constant accusations of such by Alba supporters will only continue to add doubt in the minds of undecideds / soft yes or no voters. This is a detriment to Independence. That's before you even get in to the multiple examples of varying bigotry associated with Party members, which, whether you like it or not, will cast aspersions on Independence as a whole. There's already far too much baggage and bad press around Alba, even with their short existence. They're never going to be anything other than a joke Party at best, and an actual negative towards Scottish Independence at worst. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
invergowrie arab Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 58 minutes ago, Ayrshire Analytica said: It was. However, the SNP rejected the concept of Scotland electing as many independence supporting MSPs as possible and the decision benefited no-one except unionists. The Gaelic and Scots pronunciations are both acceptable. So what's the Alba strategy now then? Also all ears for what the Scots pronunciation of Alba is given the word doesn't appear anywhere in the Dictionary of the Scots Language. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 hour ago, AsimButtHitsASix said: Why do Alba supporters always just refer to SNP/Alba as the pro-indy options whilst ignoring The Green Party? The Greens have 7 MSPs to Alba's 0, 17 councillors to Alba's 13, 8.1% of the vote to Alba's 1.7% in the last election, two MSP's in ministerial posts and, perhaps most importantly, can pronounce their own party name. Alec Salmond isn't in the Green Party. That really does seem to be what it comes down to. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 (edited) 22 minutes ago, invergowrie arab said: Also all ears for what the Scots pronunciation of Alba is given the word doesn't appear anywhere in the Dictionary of the Scots Language. Dunno if you recall the details but when he announced the party he spent a good day or two pronouncing it "Alba" before Channel 4 News pulled him up on it. He said he WAS pronouncing it correctly as the name wasn't based on the Gaelic word for Scotland but based on the old Pictish kingdom (how he could be sure how Picts pronounced it is anyone's guess). Obviously nonsense but whatever mate. The very next day he started pronouncing it properly and this pish about Pictish kingdoms was never brought up again. Edited January 7, 2022 by AsimButtHitsASix 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottsdad Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 minute ago, AsimButtHitsASix said: Dunno if you recall the details but when he announced the party he spent a good day or two pronouncing it "Alba" before Channel 4 News pulled him up on it. He said he WAS pronouncing it correctly as the name wasn't based on the Gaelic word for Scotland but based on the old Pictish kingdom (how he could be sure how Picts pronounced it is anyone's guess). Obviously nonsense but whatever mate. The very next day he started pronouncing it properly and this pish about Pictish kingdoms was never brought up again. He should have phoned Neil Oliver for advice on that front. Or better yet, did it live on air. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
invergowrie arab Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 2 minutes ago, AsimButtHitsASix said: Dunno if you recall the details but when he announced the party he spent a good day or two pronouncing it "Alba" before Channel 4 News pulled him up on it. He said he WAS pronouncing it correctly as the name wasn't based on the Gaelic word for Scotland but based on the old Pictish kingdom (how he could be sure how Picts pronounced it is anyone's guess). Obviously nonsense but whatever mate. The very next day he started pronouncing it properly and this pish about Pictish kingdoms was never brought up again. It's a bold move to name it after a Gaelo-Pictish kingdom whose southern borders were the Forth and Clyde and didn't include any of the islands or Caithness but good luck to him. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 Personally I think the Gaelic pronunciation sounds daft from somebody speaking English, a bit like somebody saying Mathreeth instead of Madrid. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 8 minutes ago, welshbairn said: Personally I think the Gaelic pronunciation sounds daft from somebody speaking English, a bit like somebody saying Mathreeth instead of Madrid. It's not even close to the stupidest pronunciation in Gaelic. Where the f**k does the 's' in 'àrd' come from? And where do all that consonants in 'fhathast' hide? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
invergowrie arab Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 Madrid is a word adopted into English for the capital city of Spain and therefore English speakers can pronounce it anyway they please. Similarly Mallaig is the English for Malaig and if English speakers want to stress the second syllable that's up to them. Alba is a Gaelic word. The English is Scotland. So if you want to appropriate it for your weird ethnocentric project pronounce it properly. If some asked you of you had watched Dootchland 83 on the telly you would rightly assume they were completely ignorant 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
invergowrie arab Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 28 minutes ago, AsimButtHitsASix said: It's not even close to the stupidest pronunciation in Gaelic. Where the f**k does the 's' in 'àrd' come from? And where do all that consonants in 'fhathast' hide? If you look through the window thoroughly enough though you ought to see a chough coughing on the bough of the tree in the ploughed field 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrshire Analytica Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 2 hours ago, J_Stewart said: Would a third (or even fourth) electable Independence based party be a good thing? Yes Are Alba that Party? No Are Alba actually a net-deterrent to the cause of Independence through their constant berating of other Independence Parties, 'disgraced' (in the eyes of the public as a whole) leader, questionable representatives, and somewhat toxic online presence? For me, Absolutely yes. Whilst I vote for both, I can wholly understand people being frustrated with the SNP (I certainly don't agree with them on everything), and I can understand that the Greens might not be to everyone's taste, but IMO, they're the only viable options towards Independence and questioning that is madness. I've posted this before, but Sturgeon - as the highest profile example - has been a proponent of Scottish Independence for over 30 years, entering at a point where they were essentially a joke party, and when the idea of them being even a notion in politics on this isle was fanciful. To suggest that she's not actually interested in Scottish Independence - a literal lifelong ambition - is insanity, and the constant accusations of such by Alba supporters will only continue to add doubt in the minds of undecideds / soft yes or no voters. This is a detriment to Independence. That's before you even get in to the multiple examples of varying bigotry associated with Party members, which, whether you like it or not, will cast aspersions on Independence as a whole. There's already far too much baggage and bad press around Alba, even with their short existence. They're never going to be anything other than a joke Party at best, and an actual negative towards Scottish Independence at worst. So, other independence parties are okay, as long as they are, essentially, vassals of the SNP, with no differing opinions or strategy. The notion that because 6,000 people, most of whom I'd guess were previously part of the SNP, decided to form a new party, which supports independence, they are now a "deterrent" to others supporting independence is elitist, hive mind, nonsense. The accusation of bigotry is also baseless and is simply used by cultists to attempt to immediately discredit anyone who disagrees with them. I think coming up on eight years after the indyref, with a consistent lead for Yes in the polls before any campaign has even started, folk who were part of the 45% have a right to question the strategy at this point, if they even have one, in relation to gaining independence. Obviously, you're content to continue hanging on in quiet desperation, others aren't. What has she achieved to inspire such loyalty? Will you back her for five more years of colonial administration at Holyrood, if we are not independent by 2026? -2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 8 minutes ago, Ayrshire Analytica said: I think coming up on eight years after the indyref, with a consistent lead for Yes in the polls before any campaign has even started, folk who were part of the 45% have a right to question the strategy at this point, if they even have one, in relation to gaining independence. Obviously, you're content to continue hanging on in quiet desperation, others aren't. There's a consistent lead in the polls? Where? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 hour ago, invergowrie arab said: If you look through the window thoroughly enough though you ought to see a chough coughing on the bough of the tree in the ploughed field I never said English wasn't weird to be fair. I like Gaelic spelling for the most part. In general it follows some simple rules so even if someone says a word I've never heard before I can have a decent stab at it. Even getting used to knowing where a strac should go. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint in exile Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 Let me tell you after a lifetime of voting SNP I wouldn't even be bothering to vote fullstop as none of the politicial parties are worthy of a vote. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 8 minutes ago, saint in exile said: Let me tell you after a lifetime of voting SNP I wouldn't even be bothering to vote fullstop as none of the politicial parties are worthy of a vote. I’m assuming that you won’t be complaining about anything the next government does then. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oneteaminglasgow Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 19 minutes ago, Ayrshire Analytica said: The accusation of bigotry is also baseless and is simply used by cultists to attempt to immediately discredit anyone who disagrees with them. No, it isn’t. It’s because Alba have quite a lot of bigots in them who make bigoted comments and think bigoted things. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorongil Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 3 hours ago, Genuine Hibs Fan said: How incredibly thin-skinned lol. While distasteful (and very unwise to do so on twitter where the ghouls of Scottish political discourse can pretend to be desperately offended about it) it's pretty understandable why activists from a party he left and then publicly attempted to throw under the bus would be a bit smug about his career not progressing as he'd have liked. Given a senior figure in the party of which you recently stated you are a member deliberately misinterpreted (tbf he is also extremely thick so could be that) an opposing party's representative to portray them as a paedophile sympathiser in the past few days, I'd suggest you get your own house in order first before worrying about other parties being insufficiently kind online. I’m highly critical of McEleny, he is a liability. Come on Greens, #bekind. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint in exile Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 1 minute ago, Granny Danger said: I’m assuming that you won’t be complaining about anything the next government does then. They are all shite and incompetent mate.I will be complaining about the lot of them. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 I really don’t see another serious pro-Independence party being former prior to Independence. After Independence there will be a natural reversion to other left/right options with the Greens probably playing a bigger role than they do in rUK. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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