Queen’s Park 21/22

[Bring Your Own Socks]

13 hours ago, Northsea80 said:

With there only being the four rows of seats, and with it just being quite a small stand in general, wouldn’t it be better from a spectator point of view for the stand to be raised slightly for improved sight lines/visibility for fans?

There's four with seats plus two at the back for standing. The height of the roof and the extensions either side make it look impressive but the actual seating layout won't be much better than the gazebo at Alloa.

[an86]

Assume many folk on here will follow Queen’s Park In the Community. It’s great to see the stuff getting up and running, but I was wondering if anyone shared the same recollection that I did, that everyone from community to first team would be receiving a similar experience in terms of coaching offered?

Now, I’m not expecting UEFA Pro Licence coaches to be down coaching the under 9s community coaching, but my expectations would be that the coaches would be a level of parity of esteem. For me, it’s not right that we’re asking for people to use their qualifications on a voluntary basis. We are a professional football club. We can’t just pick and choose when we are and aren’t.

Anyone coaching on behalf of our club at any level, or indeed working in any capacity for the club or outsourced staff, should be receiving a living wage. Community isn’t just teaching kids to kick a ball. It’s how we operate and conduct ourselves at every level as coaches, players, employers and supporters. Plenty of people, particularly young men and women, need all the help they can get at the moment in a difficult financial environment. Pay them for their skills and help them develop in a way that is mutually beneficial.

[Ben Reilly]

4 hours ago, an86 said:

Assume many folk on here will follow Queen’s Park In the Community. It’s great to see the stuff getting up and running, but I was wondering if anyone shared the same recollection that I did, that everyone from community to first team would be receiving a similar experience in terms of coaching offered?

Now, I’m not expecting UEFA Pro Licence coaches to be down coaching the under 9s community coaching, but my expectations would be that the coaches would be a level of parity of esteem. For me, it’s not right that we’re asking for people to use their qualifications on a voluntary basis. We are a professional football club. We can’t just pick and choose when we are and aren’t.

Anyone coaching on behalf of our club at any level, or indeed working in any capacity for the club or outsourced staff, should be receiving a living wage. Community isn’t just teaching kids to kick a ball. It’s how we operate and conduct ourselves at every level as coaches, players, employers and supporters. Plenty of people, particularly young men and women, need all the help they can get at the moment in a difficult financial environment. Pay them for their skills and help them develop in a way that is mutually beneficial.

Agree with this, especially as the cost for kids to take part has rocketed recently.

[an86]

To clarify. There’s nothing wrong with the club asking for fans to volunteer for fundraising, community events, other assorted club stuff. When you’re asking for qualifications, it becomes something else entirely. It really does not sit right with me at all.

[LeodhasXD]

23 minutes ago, an86 said:

To clarify. There’s nothing wrong with the club asking for fans to volunteer for fundraising, community events, other assorted club stuff. When you’re asking for qualifications, it becomes something else entirely. It really does not sit right with me at all.

There's a honking culture in Scottish football for this. When Ross County in the Premiership offered to take a volunteer videographer on you know the system absolutely cracked and needs to change. I get a wage but there's the reality that needs to be addressed is that it'll never allow me to buy a house.

If a community club is just starting up though I'd imagine it's a training will be offered gig - to get up and running you'll need qualified coaches to start and then it'll sustain itself

Edited February 15, 2022 by LeodhasXD

[an86]

20 minutes ago, LeodhasXD said:

If a community club is just starting up though I'd imagine it's a training will be offered gig - to get up and running you'll need qualified coaches to start and then it'll sustain itself

Minimum requirement is an SFA 1.1 coaching badge with previous experience preferable.

For me, that’s a bit of a leap from asking people who love the club to contribute in various ways. You’re asking actual qualified coaches to work for free. Is our Executive Director working for free? Or is it just to be the people being delegated to from the top?

I’m sure we’ve all experienced or witnessed “it’ll look good on your CV” and “it’ll maybe lead to something.” Get the coaches paid for their expertise. If we can piss money on full-time players, we can certainly pay those who are contributing to our club within the community.

If we’re going to pretend we can’t afford to pay these people £9.50 per hour, then we should probably roll back on the ambitions.

[LeodhasXD]

6 minutes ago, an86 said:

Minimum requirement is an SFA 1.1 coaching badge with previous experience preferable.

For me, that’s a bit of a leap from asking people who love the club to contribute in various ways. You’re asking actual qualified coaches to work for free. Is our Executive Director working for free? Or is it just to be the people being delegated to from the top?

I’m sure we’ve all experienced or witnessed “it’ll look good on your CV” and “it’ll maybe lead to something.” Get the coaches paid for their expertise. If we can piss money on full-time players, we can certainly pay those who are contributing to our club within the community.

If we’re going to pretend we can’t afford to pay these people £9.50 per hour, then we should probably roll back on the ambitions.

£45 to start volunteering is a fair whack.
How's your moral stance if you give them a pass for the home games?

[an86]

13 minutes ago, LeodhasXD said:

£45 to start volunteering is a fair whack.
How's your moral stance if you give them a pass for the home games?

That’s the point. It shouldn’t be volunteering. We’re a full-time professional club and community coaches should be being paid. There are certain things it’s reasonable to ask fans to volunteer for. When you’re asking for qualifications, it’s a different ball game.

Getting people into work, even for a few hours, is a contribution to the community and a well-being issue as well. All very well talking the talk. We’ve got to walk the walk as well.

[QP145]

11 hours ago, an86 said:

That’s the point. It shouldn’t be volunteering. We’re a full-time professional club and community coaches should be being paid. There are certain things it’s reasonable to ask fans to volunteer for. When you’re asking for qualifications, it’s a different ball game.

Getting people into work, even for a few hours, is a contribution to the community and a well-being issue as well. All very well talking the talk. We’ve got to walk the walk as well.

All academy coaches from under 11s through to under 18s are still all voluntary also from what I understand 

[an86]

1 hour ago, QP145 said:

All academy coaches from under 11s through to under 18s are still all voluntary also from what I understand 

They shouldn’t be. A case can be made for that as an amateur club. I struggle to see how it can be with a bells and whistles professional club. We either want to operate as one or we don’t. 
 

Same goes for the women’s team tbh. The pathways are clearly not the same for young men and young women. The latter can’t even reach semi-pro at the club, whereas the ultimate destination for a young guy is full-time football. The model for the top level of the women’s game in Scotland is clearly at a point of relative infancy, but why aren’t we trying to be pioneering on that front? It’s all very well talking about opportunities, but again it’s easy to talk the talk.

Edited February 16, 2022 by an86

[spiders4ever]

5 hours ago, an86 said:

They shouldn’t be. A case can be made for that as an amateur club. I struggle to see how it can be with a bells and whistles professional club. We either want to operate as one or we don’t. 
 

Same goes for the women’s team tbh. The pathways are clearly not the same for young men and young women. The latter can’t even reach semi-pro at the club, whereas the ultimate destination for a young guy is full-time football. The model for the top level of the women’s game in Scotland is clearly at a point of relative infancy, but why aren’t we trying to be pioneering on that front? It’s all very well talking about opportunities, but again it’s easy to talk the talk.

Perhaps you would like to fund this this extra expenditure? A direct debit of £10,000pm would be a good start. If fans want something they should be willing to pay for it.

[an86]

58 minutes ago, spiders4ever said:

Perhaps you would like to fund this this extra expenditure? A direct debit of £10,000pm would be a good start. If fans want something they should be willing to pay for it.

How are we paying the new management structure? I’m not asking that they volunteer their services, incidentally. I’m saying that if we can pay players and executives full-time wages, we can surely pay community and academy coaches at a living wage level for a few hours of their skills? If we can’t do that, then there’s a fundamental problem with our operating model. 

[spiders4ever]

48 minutes ago, an86 said:

How are we paying the new management structure? I’m not asking that they volunteer their services, incidentally. I’m saying that if we can pay players and executives full-time wages, we can surely pay community and academy coaches at a living wage level for a few hours of their skills? If we can’t do that, then there’s a fundamental problem with our operating model. 

Isn't that exactly the problem. We aren't paying for all the excessive spending. It's our sugar daddy. We the fans can't support the current expenditure never mind what you have proposed.

[an86]

12 minutes ago, spiders4ever said:

Isn't that exactly the problem. We aren't paying for all the excessive spending. It's our sugar daddy. We the fans can't support the current expenditure never mind what you have proposed.

Well, you can decide what you support and others can what they feel. There is no “the fans” as a homogeneous group.

Currently:

Full-time players

Full-time coaching/back room staff

A Chief Executive

Director of Football

Executive Director

Commercial Director

Full-time office staff

I have no problem with any of the above. None. Each and every one of these people should be valued and treated well by the club.

My problem comes when you look at all those ticks and contrast it with the people we’re proposing deliver the thing that we want to become best known for. Community football and producing young players.

[Arachnophile]

47 minutes ago, an86 said:

Well, you can decide what you support and others can what they feel. There is no “the fans” as a homogeneous group.

Currently:

Full-time players

Full-time coaching/back room staff

A Chief Executive

Director of Football

Executive Director

Commercial Director

Full-time office staff

I have no problem with any of the above. None. Each and every one of these people should be valued and treated well by the club.

My problem comes when you look at all those ticks and contrast it with the people we’re proposing deliver the thing that we want to become best known for. Community football and producing young players.

What do other full time clubs do?

I'm not talking about the likes of Rangers & Celtic - more clubs like Morton, Raith Rovers, Ayr United etc.

[an86]

12 minutes ago, Arachnophile said:

What do other full time clubs do?

I'm not talking about the likes of Rangers & Celtic - more clubs like Morton, Raith Rovers, Ayr United etc.

I’m genuinely not sure and it’s not relevant to us. Morton, Ayr and Raith aren’t flinging money at guys from AZ Alkmaar, although perhaps not the best time to be talking about Raith and flinging money!

I’m not beating the club with a big stick here and it’s not how I want it to come across. I’d like them to look at it, how it might be perceived and see it as an option to turn it into an employment opportunity for coaches. It shouldn’t just be players we’re looking to develop here. For example, think of the articles you read about people being released and falling out of the game, mental health etc. Sure, it might not be full-time, but it could keep more people in the game and maybe act as a springboard for them.

It actually ties in with the well-being and local community ethos stuff. Creating employment is good for that. 

[Anonymous Spider]

Is that us up at 5/6 other SPFL teams that have bagged their manager and got someone new in the door since Ellis boarded the good ship do one..? 
 

This is a bit nuts, non? 

[Zanetti]

28 minutes ago, Anonymous Spider said:

Is that us up at 5/6 other SPFL teams that have bagged their manager and got someone new in the door since Ellis boarded the good ship do one..? 
 

This is a bit nuts, non? 

6 - Killie, Ayr, Queen of the South, Aberdeen, Alloa and now Dundee as well.

Ellis was relieved of his duties 47 days ago now. The situation is definitely a bit unusual, at the very least.

Edit - this isn't quite right, actually. Killie and Ayr both gave their previous manager the boot before us, but hired a replacement in the period of time after Ellis left.

Edited February 16, 2022 by Zanetti

[Sergeant Wilson]

2 hours ago, Arachnophile said:

What do other full time clubs do?

I'm not talking about the likes of Rangers & Celtic - more clubs like Morton, Raith Rovers, Ayr United etc.

Very few out side the Academy type clubs will have paid staff looking after youth teams. Even then I think there'll be a couple of professionals overseeing qualified volunteers.

It is a bit of a liberty but it's the way it is.

[QP145]

1 hour ago, Sergeant Wilson said:

Very few out side the Academy type clubs will have paid staff looking after youth teams. Even then I think there'll be a couple of professionals overseeing qualified volunteers.

It is a bit of a liberty but it's the way it is.

That’s not true