Scotland Vs Northern Ireland

[Lurkst]

23 minutes ago, Dunfermline Don said:

I was only there last night because I have bought the five match package and after that game am seriously considering whether to just go for the individual matches in future and avoid any friendlies (especially ones that see the Govan songbook brought out).  
It seemed the flattest atmosphere pre match that I have seen in a while and I feel that the SFA missed a trick in not reducing prices for this game to get a full house. The fans have spent plenty recently on tickets, travel & accommodation for the summer and it would have been a great gesture to give the supporters reduced admission. The best seats in the stadium (South Upper) were not even available for sale and that section was empty last night.

 

 

 

A few of my mates took out the 5 matcher (as I have previously) but when this fixture was announced I had a feeling it would be an awful experience on and off the pitch, so was happy to save 30 quid and sacrifice the SSC point.

 

[craigkillie]

29 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said:

Good post though I think certain aspects of it are a bit too much.

Last night was completely flat from the word go. Even before Patterson's aberration we were looking toothless and devoid of ideas and movement. It looked like a heavy legged end of season game and, in hindsight, maybe we needed to make a few more changes from the start. I don't see any particular reason to conclude it's a bridge too far for anyone. I'm not even sure who that's aimed at. I think the oldest player on the pitch was Cooper who didn't particularly do anything wrong. I appreciate the Irish aren't very good but actually we were pretty unbothered by them defensively apart from Patterson selling them a deflected goal.

Dykes isn't having a particularly good season, that's fair, players go in and out of form and he's not in great form but he got zero service last night and I'm not sure centre forward is the first problem I'd be looking at last night. Adams did no better when he came on (we actually watched to see how long it took him to get his first touch and it was about 10 minutes!). Shankland looked marginally more involved but by the time he came on we had two up and the whole game was being played in the final third, it's inevitable there will be more opportunities to show at that point.

Patterson had a holocaust of a game and I felt for him. Having defended his performance in Netherlands on Friday, there's no real defending it last night. He sold the goal (he's not the first or last to do that, Robertson sold one against England but he picked himself up and played well the rest of the game). Even before that though his positioning and use of the ball had been poor and he just seemed to collapse after that. I'll credit him for not hiding and continuing to make runs and look for the ball but cross after cross was straight out of play. It was crying out for a change and if Clarke was trying to support him by leaving him on, he maybe did the opposite.

The problem last night was the lack of movement in midfield particularly. The Christie, Gilmoour, McGinn, McTominay combination just didn't work like it normally does and personally I didn't think Ferguson improved it one bit to be honest. I know it's easy to give players too much credit when they aren't there but I thought we seriously missed McGregor's drive from midfield. You sometimes don't realise how good something is till it's not there. That said, we had plenty of energy and drive from midfield in Amsterdam on Friday and McGregor wasn't there either.

Fundamentally it was a bad night at the office but a worrying trend.

Assuming you mean "not a worrying trend" at the end, I agree with this. It was a terrible performance aside from 10 good minutes at the start of each half, and nobody really played that well - I include Tierney in that who some people seemed to be singling out for praise.

Ultimately it was a friendly, which we consistently have an awful record in, and I don't think it will have any long-term impact. It did show that we need Hickey and McGregor back in the team though.

[Gordopolis]

9 hours ago, Hendricks said:

Scotland have won 15 out of our last 21 competitive games and 2 out of our last 19 friendlies. 

No doubt tonight was extremely disappointing but you only need look at the evidence of our competitive record against our friendly record in recent years to understand where our focus lies. 

I don't disagree, but at the same time it's worrying how hard we tried in last night's game - tried and completely failed. It wasn't like we were passing it about with a 'who cares' attitude. That was largely our first XI, bursting a gut, and we came up well short.

[craigkillie]

34 minutes ago, BukyOHare said:

Getting a shot on target in the first half after having over 80% possession would be a huge start.

I find this focus on shots on target a bit weird. I'd rather create better quality chances that are put wide or hit the post than have someone trickle a 40 yarder straight at the keeper. Last night was a perfect example of this obsession, just after half-time McGinn had a shot from a wide angle on the right that trundled into their goalie's hands and a guy next to me said "that's better, at least a shot on target".

Why was that better though? It was never going to be a goal anyway, and was a much worse opportunity than, say the two opportunities we had from Christie and I want to say McTominay inside the first 5 minutes, one of which was blocked and the other went wide.

Edited March 27 by craigkillie

[2426255]

Just now, craigkillie said:

Last night was a perfect example of this obsession, just after half-time McGinn had a shot from a wide angle on the right that trundled into their goalie's hands and a guy next to me said "that's better, at least a shot on target".

The mind of a fan. 

[BB_Bino]

14 minutes ago, Jaggy McJagface said:

Most of the “Northern Ireland” fans last night were probably homegrown **** from Scotland

There was no probably about it where I was sitting

1 hour ago, BB_Bino said:

Do you know what, I didn't even give it a thought until I got there....sitting close to the away section, looking across at a "Larkhall Loyal" flag being hung by a Union Jack cladded bit of gammon. I instantly gave myself a kick and thought "here we go" and they didn't disappoint. Only in Scotland can we be so divided, only in Scotland will you find people born here supporting nations against us....madness.

As the night went on it became clear that there weren't a lot of Irish accents near the divide,  about half of the support probably weren't born in the 6 counties and when it became about sticking Independence and Referendums up our backsides before doing the bouncy and singing about Rule Britannia, my heart sank even further. I just don't get it, I really don't get this side of our game up here. I've tried over the years but can't and I suppose that's the reaction that these people want.....I'm just glad that I'm not associated with it in any way. I feel sorry for the genuine N.Irish fan that has to have their own experiences over taken by these knuckle draggers.

 

[O'Kelly Isley III]

1 hour ago, Dons_1988 said:

Seeing as ‘we don’t do friendlies’ is basically an exact quote from me, I’d be suggesting replacing ‘airily dismiss’ with putting in perspective. I’m not suggesting everything will be fine in Germany, because they may not be. But that is as true today as it was 6-12 months ago. 

What I basically said was that there’s no need to lose the rag over things we already knew about this squad, of which we learned nothing new last night. 
 

Well perhaps we learned nothing new because the Manager stuck too much to type in his team selection in what was after all a home friendly match.

Dykes was chosen over Shankland, despite him toiling in a struggling QPR team, whilst Shankland had shown enough in cameos and on Friday night to justify a start.  Similarly, John McGinn has recently gone off the boil at club level so here was a chance to start Lewis Ferguson who is having a great season with Bologna.  When he finally did get on he produced energy and forward runs which had hitherto been absent.

So an opportunity to 'learn something new' was virtually squandered when it was obvious from 25 minutes in that we were right off it.  In singling out these players above I don't think anyone emerged with credit and I hope Patterson doesn't become the lightning rod for criticism because it was shite from back to front.

[eez-eh]

Folk are putting an awful lot of faith in Hungary or Switzerland playing all guns blazing against us. There’s absolutely nothing to stop them seeing last night’s game and deciding that the best way to play against us is on the counter attack.

[craigkillie]

Just now, eez-eh said:

Folk are putting an awful lot of faith in Hungary or Switzerland playing all guns blazing against us. There’s absolutely nothing to stop them seeing last night’s game and deciding that the best way to play against us is on the counter attack.

I don't think they'll be basing their plans for the Euros around "let's hope their defender makes a calamitous error and that we can just shove everyone behind the ball and defend".

[2426255]

6 minutes ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

 When he finally did get on he produced energy and forward runs which had hitherto been absent.

"Finally did get on"  He came on for Robertson after 35 minutes. You're making it sound like he only got the last 10 minutes of the game. Shankland started against The Netherlands. I assume you didn't want Dykes or Adams to get any minutes or both just from the bench then?

Both Shankland and Ferguson's minutes for Scotland have increased recently. Not enough it seems.

Edited March 27 by 2426255

[Lurkst]

1 hour ago, BB_Bino said:

 only in Scotland will you find people born here supporting nations against us....madness.

I'm sure it happens in loads of countries, England for starters.

 

[Fletchers Saucy Manbun]

Mentality is all wrong when so many folk are satisfied with a 4-0 loss against Holland. "Glorious Failure but we're the best drunkest fans!" guaranteed again in June.

[TheScarf]

To be fair, every North Irish fan i heard in the pub or spoke to was a Missus Bunfield. I didnt see or hear any fat virgins from Lanarkshire wearing green. I've no doubt there was some there of course. 

[2426255]

9 minutes ago, Fletchers Saucy Manbun said:

Mentality is all wrong when so many folk are satisfied with a 4-0 loss against Holland. "Glorious Failure but we're the best drunkest fans!" guaranteed again in June.

The mentality of the fans won't make a difference to the team. You can choose to be happy and not let a bad performance affect you or read too much into it, choose to be miserable and be down in the dumps. Fans follow and react, they don't lead the team.

Edited March 27 by 2426255

[eez-eh]

Just now, craigkillie said:

I don't think they'll be basing their plans for the Euros around "let's hope their defender makes a calamitous error and that we can just shove everyone behind the ball and defend".

Our defender making a calamitous error probably encouraged Northern Ireland to sit deeper, but it isn’t directly responsible for our inability to create anything of note against a team parking the bus.

We might not play against a team like that at Euros, but you can’t put all your eggs in that basket. If you could resist the urge to be supercilious for a second - you’d maybe have understood better what I was saying.

[PSJ.84]

Just now, TheScarf said:

To be fair, every North Irish fan i heard in the pub or spoke to was a Missus Bunfield. I didnt see or hear any fat virgins from Lanarkshire wearing green. I've no doubt there was some there of course. 

Two boys I grew up with were there. Lived in Scotland their whole lives. Guess the club…   

[Dunfermline Don]

On the subject of booing GSTK and being disrespectful to visiting teams.

l would would take issue with that for the following; It is the UK National Anthem and doesn’t belong to any individual part of the UK ( please take note). As a result, like it or not, it is our Anthem for the whole UK, of which I am a passport holder.  I do however (as an atheist republican) feel that it says nothing to me about the nation that I live in. I strongly object to having an anthem that speaks nothing of the country and only a privileged family of adulterous males and ‘alleged’ sexual predators. I therefore take the opportunity to express my displeasure with such anthem at any opportunity.

I am sure most other countries anthems are given the appropriate respect at Hampden and if Scotland and England were both independent countries l would give it the proper respect if they still used it. 
 

Regarding some of the away fans last night, just remember some of them(especially those from Govan/Larkhall etc) would probably be happy supporting a UK team if it existed despite the fact it would no doubt be indistinguishable from the current England team.

[craigkillie]

Just now, eez-eh said:

Our defender making a calamitous error probably encouraged Northern Ireland to sit deeper, but it isn’t directly responsible for our inability to create anything of note against a team parking the bus.

We might not play against a team like that at Euros, but you can’t put all your eggs in that basket. If you could resist the urge to be supercilious for a second - you’d maybe have understood better what I was saying.

I understood what you were saying, I just don't think it holds any water. We struggled to break down a defensive team in a single low energy, low stakes game, and I doubt Switzerland or Hungary are going to be basing their plans for the Euros around that single performance.

We have won every single competitive game under Clarke against teams at that level who have tried to do that to us, including twice against Cyprus within the last year or so. We are definitely a bit one-dimensional in how we create chances, but we will create them with volume and will eventually score most of the time. There definitely wasn't an issue with creating chances throughout qualifying.

[Diamonds are Forever]

I couldn't care less about friendly results and never go to the games. But my frustration is more that we get poor friendly results while learning absolutely nothing about fringe players or players who are challenging for the first 11.

I'm certainly not in the 'lets go with youth' camp and wanting to chuck a bunch of youngsters in. But surely playing different goalies is worthwhile given we know Gunn is going and will be number 1, what if he gets injured? Surely Ferguson has done enough to earn a couple of games. I've already seen Ryan Christie float around contributing nothing for 70 minutes about 40 times in his career, I don't need another. Same applies to Shankland, we all know what Dykes can and can't do, and that he is on the plane, giving Shankland 1 game away to Holland seems a bit harsh.

It's like we aren't really clear what the purpose of friendlies is. We don't generally use them to integrate new players, but we also clearly don't approach them with the same competitive edge that we do qualifiers.

[Ewanandmoreagain]

21 minutes ago, BB_Bino said:

There was no probably about it where I was sitting

 

I believe real Irish fans are not enamoured with our plastic Paddys