Big Rangers Administration/Liquidation Thread - All chat here!

[Homer Thompson]

Idea was SFL1 would expand to 12, and they'd also play 14 = 36. It failed on several counts... First, you'd need USH over both divisions, to safely split after 22 games. Second, it could see 4-up-4-down (SPL clubs bricking it) or 0-up-0-down (SFL1 clubs bricking it). Third, clubs atop the Third 8 have nothing to play for.

Gordon Smith advocated it a few years back, too, without any success - those issues seem insurmountable.

Well you dont need undersoil heating. I can see why to 0 or 4 up/down could be an issue, but maybe thoughts have changed? Surely, it could also be done with a playoff at the end? Not sure what you mean by your third statement.

[Happy Buddie]

is it about time to lay out the battle groups as they curently stand?

I make it ----------------------Pro-Sevco Doncaster, Regan, Longmuir, Stenhousemuir, Dumbarton

Anti-Sevco Everybody else except Jim Ballantyne

Any better picture?

[punk_dfc]

One has to wonder if the 'financial carrots' that are being offered are being dreamed up on the basis that Sevco 5088 are in the position to complete (start?) a season in any league.

Last week at St Mirren Park, this was the very point I raised with Stewart Gilmour et al. There is all this talk about the alleged financial hit being less painful with the newco in the 1st Division, but does anyone involved actually have even a modicum of confidence that this operation will be able to function as a viable football club within the next 3 weeks or so? Needless to say, they weren't brimming with confidence, and you could sense their anxiety in this regard - upon which I pointed out just how much of a gamble it would be basing any restructuring off the game etc. on such flimsy pretence.

Indeed, one of our directors spoke briefly with me afterwards, and highlighted my point again, pretty much confirming that no-one has any confidence that Green will pull it off (fnar, fnar).

That is a key point. Charles Green doesn't quite strike me a guy who is doing this for the benefit of the ex-Rangers support. He knows that there is a potential cash cow at the end of this and will keep it going until this is realised. However, he isn't going to do this for an extended period of time.

[Dundee Hibernian]

I've got the 16 spl share conundrum sussed.

11 present teams, plus Club 12, Warriors, the Sons (of the Rock), Green Rangers and finally the Sons (of John Brown). 2 Rangers sides in a top league of 16, giving a guaranteed 4 bigot fest games to televise even with sides playing each other only twice.

Oh, and No Relegation (or Surrender).

(and all no more stupid than the authorities are suggesting)

[HibeeJibee]

The ways things are going we'd be as well get Topping & Doncaster, Regan & Ogilvie and Longmuir & Ballantyne onto a revival episode of "Bullseye".

Whatever money is won at the end is divided by 10 and becomes the latest number of teams in the reconstruction plan, but it can be gambled for a speedboat or caravan to give to Sevco 5088.

John Brown can be the "Cash for Charity" celebrity.

[Granny Danger]

Maybe the SFL position should be this:

Give us league reconstruction, a better share of the money and more say on the way forward and you can have newco in the 3rd division.

Otherwise you can have Spartans in the 3rd division.

[Florentine_Pogen]

The ways things are going we'd be as well get Topping & Doncaster, Regan & Ogilvie and Longmuir & Ballantyne onto a revival episode of "Bullseye".

Whatever money is won at the end is divided by 10 and becomes the latest number of teams in the reconstruction plan, but it can be gambled for a speedboat or caravan to give to Sevco 5088.

John Brown can be the "Cash for Charity" celebrity.

Charlie's preferred modes of escape when he's chased out of Glasgow ?

[CaleyStan]

1342006412[/url]' post='6418442']

In a way I can see why they would draft a set of "financial carrots" (read: bribes) as these are matters of numbers on a page.

However the idea that clubs being "offerred an expanded top-tier by 2015" or similar is timely is ludicrous. It's a bare-faced insult, infact.

A complete reorganisation of the national league system, off the back of a fag packet, at 2 days notice in order to accomodate Rangers straight back into SFL1? Farcical...

There's also no need for SFL clubs to feel tempted by such an offer. If Rangers go to the 3rd then serious league reconstruction & general leveling out of power and finance distribution are more likely to stay at the top of the agenda. Shoehorning Rangers back into the SPL as quickly as possible does nothing for the long term interests of the vast majority of SFL clubs - hence the pathetic package of lies and threats being put to them.

[HibeeJibee]

Well you dont need undersoil heating. I can see why to 0 or 4 up/down could be an issue, but maybe thoughts have changed? Surely, it could also be done with a playoff at the end? Not sure what you mean by your third statement.

For clubs in the Third 8 there's nothing to play for except avoiding the bottom ~2 places (relegation to SFL2) so if you're well ahead your season is over. Not entirely sure what you mean r.e. play-offs as the purpose of the Middle 8 is that whoever finishes top 4 play SPL next season and whoever finishes bottom 4 play SFL1 next season.

It'd be quite risky without universal USH, you'd be splitting after New Year.

[Granny Danger]

I've got the 16 spl share conundrum sussed.

11 present teams, plus Club 12, Warriors, the Sons (of the Rock), Green Rangers and finally the Sons (of John Brown). 2 Rangers sides in a top league of 16, giving a guaranteed 4 bigot fest games to televise even with sides playing each other only twice.

Oh, and No Relegation (or Surrender).

(and all no more stupid than the authorities are suggesting)

I have the other 4 SPL shares. I bought them from a Mr C. Whyte. They are sitting in a drawer in my house and will only be used on a rainy day. FACT.

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

The heroic Mr Hutton is back with another dose of telt for the Sevco apologists. The equally heroic Sammy the Tammy gets a namecheck as well.

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/raith-rovers/110394-turnbull-hutton-sees-opportunity-for-other-clubs-in-rangers-pantomime/

Edited July 11, 2012 by Sherrif John Bunnell

[ribzanelli]

I have the other 4 SPL shares. I bought them from a Mr C. Whyte. They are sitting in a drawer in my house and will only be used on a rainy day. FACT.

£1 each or did you get a bulk discount?

[Born To Run]

Maybe the SFL position should be this:

Give us league reconstruction, a better share of the money and more say on the way forward and you can have newco in the 3rd division.

Otherwise you can have Spartans in the 3rd division.

I still don't understand why Longmuir didn't take a strong stance akin to this, and hold Regan + Doncaster to ransom in order to get a better deal. This is the best opportunity he and the board will ever have to improve the SFL's circumstances, and he's ran away scared from it.

Too late now, though. Yet another disappointment.

Edited July 11, 2012 by Born To Run

[Florentine_Pogen]

From STV sport :-

Raith Rovers director Turnbull Hutton believes the Rangers situation should be used as an opportunity to “rebalance” Scottish football and bridge the gap between the SPL and the SFL.

Hutton, who described plans to parachute the newco Rangers into the First Division last week as a move to “bully and railroad” SFL clubs, says he doesn’t buy into claims by those at the top of the game that £15.7m a year could be instantly lost if the Ibrox side are instead placed into the Third Division.

Raith will vote against any move to allow Rangers into the second tier and Hutton sees something positive out of the current crisis for other clubs in the Scottish game.

“I can understand the argument but I am not convinced at the figures which have been produced and distributed,” Hutton said of the SPL's claims of financial meltdown. “They are a worst case scenario and I don't believe it's that bad.

“There are two ways to look at this. One that says it is a tragedy, doomsday, Armageddon and all those things.

“The other is to say it is an opportunity. Maybe the game needs rebalanced. There is a massive difference between the SPL and SFL1. The SFL1 clubs are the one who would aspire to be in the top division.

“But if the whole financial structure is against that, what chance do you have? It seems over the years, since the SPL was set up, the gulf has got wider and wider and wider.

“It probably takes something like this to give you the chance to start again. It should be an opportunity I think.”

Hutton also questioned the positions of Scottish FA chief executive Stewart Regan and his SPL counterpart Neil Doncaster, saying he isn’t convinced they have the greater interests of the Scottish game at heart.

“I wonder if they really understand Scottish football. I think they understand the money making concept and look at the English Premier League as a role model.

“But I don't think either of them have been to a game at Annan, Brechin, Peterhead or whatever else. They don't understand what goes on in the lower leagues.

“If you don't understand that, then your job in the SFA especially is to have an overall brief watching Scottish football. If we are focusing on Premier League and cutting deals to protect the Premier League, I think that is wrong.”

Asked if he felt their positions were untenable, Hutton replied: “I think it is difficult. I think there is a feeling that they've lost the plot in one or two ways. It is going to be difficult for them to regain the trust I think they have lost.”

SFL clubs will decide on Friday whether to allow Charles Green’s newco Rangers into the league, before then voting whether to give the league board a mandate to put the club into the First Division if a deal can be struck with the SPL and SFA for sporting and financial concessions.

“I am not all that convinced Friday is the important day,” said Hutton. “I think Friday will be indicative of what's happened with clubs being lobbied and promises made.

“There are two issues. There is the Rangers issue and there is the need to reorganise Scottish football. They are two separate issues but they are being thrown together to come up with a quick, magic solution.

“I am not sure that's the right way to go. I think a bit of time is needed. Whatever way the vote goes, it won't be the end of it. It will continue after Friday.

“There will be more pain, more revelations, more new stories that come along and we will have to take it from there.

“The best suggestion I had was that all the SFL clubs should send their mascots. Our Roary Rover and Sammy the Tammy from Dunfermline should go up arm in arm up the stairs at Hampden.

“It would be a fine pantomime finale for what has turned out to be a pantomime all through.”

Edited July 11, 2012 by Florentine_Pogen

[Huistrinho]

You seem a reasonable chap, unless it's a ruse. Why would you choose to support a bigoted institution like Rangers? Serious question.

I'll try to give you a serious answer then.

The summary is basically this: as a 4 year old kid, I fell in love with football and Rangers were my local team. I knew nothing of certain fans' "traditions" until I was a teenager, and no idea their true impact on society until later still (as it happens, I'm a Scottish republican atheist, who lived in Dublin for a number of years - I'm remarkably far from the stereotype).

The club certainly wasn't established as a bigoted institution and I'd say that in my time of supporting the club, it hasn't resembled one. While those in charge in the 1920s may have tried to capture anti-irish feeling in the country, these days the only remnant of that is an element of the fan base (especially so if you want to view Sevco as a new club) - they're the "bigoted institution", and a slowly dying one at that. Every support has morons; a large support has more morons than most. If the club were actively promoting the views of this element of the support, I'd be off in a shot. But they're not - even though they're not going to the lengths to eradicate it that I wish they would.

I readily admit to feeling conflicted. I often think of Rangers fans with similar views to myself (whom I believe are the vast majority) as being like the moderate religious, in that through their existence they implicitly give the fundamentalists justification and a place to hide.

At heart, I'm still that kid that fell in love with football and with a football team - as I assume most of us are. That's why I'm still a Rangers supporter.

[Granny Danger]

£1 each or did you get a bulk discount?

Sorry I can't reveal that, I had to sign an NDA. I must say this surprised me a bit a bit because Mr Whyte looked like a stand up guy and I thought an NDA seemed a bit shifty.

[ayrmad]

From STV sport :-

Raith Rovers director Turnbull Hutton believes the Rangers situation should be used as an opportunity to “rebalance” Scottish football and bridge the gap between the SPL and the SFL.

Hutton, who described plans to parachute the newco Rangers into the First Division last week as a move to “bully and railroad” SFL clubs, says he doesn’t buy into claims by those at the top of the game that £15.7m a year could be instantly lost if the Ibrox side are instead placed into the Third Division.

Raith will vote against any move to allow Rangers into the second tier and Hutton sees something positive out of the current crisis for other clubs in the Scottish game.

“I can understand the argument but I am not convinced at the figures which have been produced and distributed,” Hutton said of the SPL's claims of financial meltdown. “They are a worst case scenario and I don't believe it's that bad.

“There are two ways to look at this. One that says it is a tragedy, doomsday, Armageddon and all those things.

“The other is to say it is an opportunity. Maybe the game needs rebalanced. There is a massive difference between the SPL and SFL1. The SFL1 clubs are the one who would aspire to be in the top division.

“But if the whole financial structure is against that, what chance do you have? It seems over the years, since the SPL was set up, the gulf has got wider and wider and wider.

“It probably takes something like this to give you the chance to start again. It should be an opportunity I think.”

Hutton also questioned the positions of Scottish FA chief executive Stewart Regan and his SPL counterpart Neil Doncaster, saying he isn’t convinced they have the greater interests of the Scottish game at heart.

“I wonder if they really understand Scottish football. I think they understand the money making concept and look at the English Premier League as a role model.

“But I don't think either of them have been to a game at Annan, Brechin, Peterhead or whatever else. They don't understand what goes on in the lower leagues.

“If you don't understand that, then your job in the SFA especially is to have an overall brief watching Scottish football. If we are focusing on Premier League and cutting deals to protect the Premier League, I think that is wrong.”

Asked if he felt their positions were untenable, Hutton replied: “I think it is difficult. I think there is a feeling that they've lost the plot in one or two ways. It is going to be difficult for them to regain the trust I think they have lost.”

SFL clubs will decide on Friday whether to allow Charles Green’s newco Rangers into the league, before then voting whether to give the league board a mandate to put the club into the First Division if a deal can be struck with the SPL and SFA for sporting and financial concessions.

“I am not all that convinced Friday is the important day,” said Hutton. “I think Friday will be indicative of what's happened with clubs being lobbied and promises made.

“There are two issues. There is the Rangers issue and there is the need to reorganise Scottish football. They are two separate issues but they are being thrown together to come up with a quick, magic solution.

“I am not sure that's the right way to go. I think a bit of time is needed. Whatever way the vote goes, it won't be the end of it. It will continue after Friday.

“There will be more pain, more revelations, more new stories that come along and we will have to take it from there.

“The best suggestion I had was that all the SFL clubs should send their mascots. Our Roary Rover and Sammy the Tammy from Dunfermline should go up arm in arm up the stairs at Hampden.

“It would be a fine pantomime finale for what has turned out to be a pantomime all through.”

As much as the bolded bits had me LMFAO they are sadly very accurate.

[blanco]

You'd expect "Rangers" to argue their case, but theyve generally accepted 3rd Division, though would prefer as good a result as possible

You'd expect the SPL people to try & ensure "Rangers" arent away too long, though be an idea not to try & pull an illegal fast one

But the guy at the SFA?? That character should be out a job, plain & simple

SFL Chairmen hold all the cards. Doncaster & Regan are panicking & throwing everything they can think of at it. Hold your nerve SFL

That's the beauty of the orc, so hellbent on punishing everybody else due to their absence they don't realise that division 3 will kill them faster than Craig Whyte killed TCFKAR. Apparently sevco have sold under 1000 season tickets so far and i doubt there's going to be a massive rush regardless of what league they end up in, and with figures like that it only makes it even more likely that administration looms for the the b*****d offspring of TCFKAR.

[Mark Connolly]

Sorry I can't reveal that, I had to sign an NDA. I must say this surprised me a bit a bit because Mr Whyte looked like a stand up guy and I thought an NDA seemed a bit shifty.

A source close to GD has informed me that this transaction was the source of Craig Whyte's billions.

[SaintPaul]

Don't post here often, but need to vent. I've just had a ten minute argument with a workplace ORC around this whole situation. Key points from him were:

Regan and Doncaster have a vandetta against his team - WTF!?

He asks why they are being 'punished'. I said you're not being punished, you're a new team that's asking to join the league structure. We then had 10 minutes of 'No we're not', 'Yes you are', 'No we're not', 'Yes you are'…

I said that the club he supported died in June this year and he needs to accept it. He turned back to his desk and ignored me.

These guys just don't get it do they? The Regan vandetta is the funniest thing I've heard in ages!!