General Politics Thread

[renton]

3 hours ago, Ad Lib said:

 

Honestly this is basic stuff. Capital spending is already accounted for in GERS. That's what the net fiscal balance represents as compared to the current fiscal balance. There is no money magically to save there.

It is hopelessly unrealistic to suggest that tax simplification or anti-avoidance law changes will materially increase Scotland's revenue. If anything the costs of running a separate revenue collection agency would increase. Look at how massively over budget Revenue Scotland was, and it was just dealing with land transaction taxes!

Can we raise corporation tax? Sure, if you want to lose revenue and see capital flight.

Land Value Tax would replace other taxes. There is not strong evidence it would substantially alter revenue streams, whatever its other merits.

Pension liabilities don't make a big difference. Scotland's demography is fairly similar to the UK's as a whole in that regard.

The point is we have to savagely cut to make an independent Scotland credible. We are talking across the board departmental cuts of 10-20% to get on an even keel. We cannot bet on another oil boom.

 

In terms of Income Tax, Corporation Tax and CGT Scotland lagged behind the UK average by something like 2.8 Billion, 1.2 Billion of that in income tax due to the differences in demographics between Scotland and the South East. Correcting that, by a more progressive tax regime, or by the application of the Living Wage across the private and public sectors would not only correct that particular imbalance but would raise money paid from NI as well. LVT would significantly alter revenue streams, even if it replacing some other local taxes, because unlike the CT it's a properly progressive tax (hell, even enacting CT with properly updated bands would generate significantly more revenue) and would allow us to raise revenue on land uses not currently taxed, it'd also encourage raised productivity in the use of land, a behavioural change which in turn could help push other direct tax takes up. The current CT revenue is something like 3 billion, an LVT in Scotland could raise as much as 12 billion, representing a significant dent in the standard GERS black hole by itself. The 2 billion defence overspend is already discussed. In short there is some easy expenditure cuts that wouldn't affect frontline public services and some more radical, progressive revisions to the existing tax system that would also raise significant revenues. As for pensions, the Scottish average is a few years below that of the UK, which is not insignificant in terms of pension liabilities but also there is the option for an independent Scotland to raise the retirement age above what the UK currently does (a pressure all Western nations will eventually feel) which would decrease one of the largest outlays in the welfare system. In work benefits is another, something that could be combatted by a more progressive tax system, and a commitment to higher wages, rather than the state constantly subsidising the private sector's bottom line.

The level of debt we would take finally, is up for negotiation, but per GDP or population share, while being fair, is not necessarily the best deal we could get.

The effect of Brexit is unknown at the moment, but a Scotland in the EU, with the rUK out would - assuming no trade war caused by hard Brexit - have the opportunity to significantly raise revenue from companies relocating north. 

GERS is, and only ever will be an estimation of how current UK policy affects Scotland. It says precisely nothing about an independent Scotland, and the choices it would be able or willing to make.

[dogmc]

Ireland spends c35% of its GDP on public expenditure. Scotland spends 44%.

Ireland generates c30% of its GDP in tax revenue. Scotland generates 35% of its GDP in tax revenue.

Ireland's deficit is 2.1% of its GDP. Scotland's deficit is 9.5% of its GDP.

If you think Scotland's solution is to cut public spending by £14 billion in order to cut taxes by £9 billion, I'm sure the Scottish Conservatives would love to have you on board.

How much have irish tax payers been forced to spend on trident, 2012 Olympics, hs2&3, illegal wars, upgrades to london sewer and transport infrastructure etc ?

[bob the tank]

Why is Scotland doing so badly on the broad shoulders of ukok? Or I so stupid I just can't work out the answer?

[ayrmad]

Why do all UKOK's wrongly assume that Scotland would start off with 100% of their share of the debt and 0% of their share of assets?

The Scottish universities need to take a long hard look at themselves if this is all they can produce.

[AUFC90]

Why do all UKOK's wrongly assume that Scotland would start off with 100% of their share of the debt and 0% of their share of assets?

The Scottish universities need to take a long hard look at themselves if this is all they can produce.

Because it suits them.
In all honesty I'm fed up with Scotland subsidising every shite hole north of the Humber.

[capybara]

I see Kez is putting forward her alternative programme for Government. The only problem I see is that it looks very like the party manifesto so roundly rejected in May.

[strichener]

2 minutes ago, capybara said:

I see Kez is putting forward her alternative programme for Government. The only problem I see is that it looks very like the party manifesto so roundly rejected in May.

It wasn't rejected, just misunderstood.  I am sure that once the Labour party manage to successfully educate the electorate that they will be back to rightful place at the top of Scottish politics.

[capybara]

4 minutes ago, strichener said:

It wasn't rejected, just misunderstood.  I am sure that once the Labour party manage to successfully educate the electorate that they will be back to rightful place at the top of Scottish politics.

I fear they will have a long wait. Another thing that was said yesterday , was comments by Labour leader contender Owen Smith. That the promises made by Better Together (Jobs, Frigates, The EU etc ) were all dependent on the a Labour Government being elected. I do not remember hearing this from BT .

[Antlion]

On 1 September 2016 at 13:10, capybara said:

I see Kez is putting forward her alternative programme for Government. The only problem I see is that it looks very like the party manifesto so roundly rejected in May.

So is the third party in Holyrood just desperate for stuff to do, or what? I can really think of no formal reason why a third party would put forward an "alternative programme for government" a year into a government. It's surely the definition of "scrambling for relevance"?

[Newbornbairn]

Bye Bye Keith Vaz you slimy chancer - http://archive.is/5cil2

 

Caught with male prostitutes

 

Quote

While chair of the Home Affairs Select Committee, Mr Vaz has publicly said he was “not convinced” that men who pay for sex should face prosecution.

Within weeks of a report from the committee, he himself paid money to escorts in a flat he owns near his family home in Edgware, North West London.

Quote

In a 90-minute rendezvous on August 27, the former Minister for Europe offered to cover the cost of cocaine if it was brought to the flat – but said he did not want any himself.

He is currently heading up the committee which has investigated harm caused by the illegal Class A drug.

Mr Vaz, Labour MP for Leicester East since 1987, also told the pair to bring along poppers – the sex-enhancing drug.

In Parliament, he defended use of the drug when it faced a ban.

 

[jmothecat]

Bye Bye Keith Vaz you slimy chancer - http://archive.is/5cil2

 

Caught with male prostitutes

 

While chair of the Home Affairs Select Committee, Mr Vaz has publicly said he was “not convinced” that men who pay for sex should face prosecution.

Within weeks of a report from the committee, he himself paid money to escorts in a flat he owns near his family home in Edgware, North West London.

In a 90-minute rendezvous on August 27, the former Minister for Europe offered to cover the cost of cocaine if it was brought to the flat – but said he did not want any himself.

He is currently heading up the committee which has investigated harm caused by the illegal Class A drug.

Mr Vaz, Labour MP for Leicester East since 1987, also told the pair to bring along poppers – the sex-enhancing drug.

In Parliament, he defended use of the drug when it faced a ban.

 



Good riddance to him. This sort of story has been coming for a while.

[Sooky]

In the wake of all the madness lately, it's quite refreshing to have a good old fashioned 'politician caught with prostitutes and cheating on their partner' scandal.

[ayrmad]

On 04/09/2016 at 07:32, Antlion said:

So is the third party in Holyrood just desperate for stuff to do, or what? I can really think of no formal reason why a third party would put forward an "alternative programme for government" a year into a government. It's surely the definition of "scrambling for relevance"?

I thought each party got that chance in each election campaign, New Labour do appear to suffer from a huge bout of self importance with an even bigger doze of self entitlement heaped on top for good measure.

[Alan Stubbs]

90 minute shagging sessions and pays for other people's ching.

A lot to admire there. Vaz4PM.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

Black Lives Matters UK could always have a protest to help him out . . .

[capybara]

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/14735734.Top_Scottish_Labour_donors_walk_away_from_Dugdale/

Poor old Kez nae friends or money.

[banana]

Thicko feminist Labour Shadow Foreign Secretary Emily Thornberry throws a wobbly when asked the names of some important foreign politicians, plays the sexism card

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-37332287

[Thistle_do_nicely]

1 hour ago, banana said:

Thicko feminist Labour Shadow Foreign Secretary Emily Thornberry throws a wobbly when asked the names of some important foreign politicians, plays the sexism card

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-37332287

Was she not allowed to have any notes to refer to in front of her??

She could have handled that far more artfully.

[capybara]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37342152

 

Cameron had enough. By -election  in Witney.

Edited September 12, 2016 by capybara

[jmothecat]

Michael Fallon 'the difficulty with the shadow defence minister has got is my Defence ministers don't know who he is.'