TheProgressiveLiberal Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 I'd wager a large part of the Nazis marching today were hoping for a fight. But the fact is that these groups have peaceful rallies all over the country every week. Odds are the same happens here if the groups with an extensive recent history of engaging in political violence against peaceful people don't show up to fight. I'm sure we can dig up recent crimes committed by Nazis or KKK members, but I don't see regular burning of buildings and attacks on innocents at their rallies. That's antifa and BLM. Those groups deserve blame for creating this situation by setting out to deny the Constitutional rights of American citizens. Democrat politicians who have allowed this environment to grow in out country and who did not do their job to protect the march and keep the groups separate in this specific instance also deserve blame. -2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Gaines Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheProgressiveLiberal Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 An apples to apples comparison between this incident and Muslim "terrorism" would go something like this: Sketchy Muslim group is opening a mosque (constitutionally protected peaceful activity). Extreme Christian group with a history of anti-Muslim violence show up to stop services from being held, using violence if necessary. Republican government which attempted to stop opening of mosque orders police to stand down. Fights involving both sides break out. A Muslim kills a couple of the Christians, who were at least affiliated with the violent group whether they were personally engaged in the violence or not. I would place this under political violence, but not terrorism. -3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 Please stop calling these people Nazis Nazis dressed sharp 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 Oh aye, just a poor right thinking white boy goaded too far by libtard snowflakes, in no way a terrorist, anyone would do the same under those circumstances.. From his facebook page: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 The progressive liberal is working damn hard with his broom here. Sweep, sweep...It's not working. This is the far right. This is what it looks like. You can't wash it off no matter how hard you try. The far left can often go too far with protests but there's really no comparison that stands up to this. In motive and in action they are very, very different. The far left can be misguided - but the far right shows humanity at its very ugliest. This must be challenged wherever it exists. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 Is Trump being sarcastic here? Usually when he says "sad" it's in reference to the "failing" New York Times. https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/896512981319790592 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheProgressiveLiberal Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 (edited) This question is specifically for pandarilla, welshy, and any of the other non-far lefties here: Do you believe that fascist groups who have gone through the proper permitting processes offered to all groups should be allowed to conduct public rallies free from attack? And if you think I'm defending this young man, you are mistaken. This is the natural consequence of a culture where street brawling (almost 100% from left wing groups like BLM and Antifa in recent US history) is tolerated by certain local government. I watched a livestream recording from reporter who was near where the car hit the crowd. There were antifa flags visible. About three minutes before they were chanting: "Who shut shit down? We shut shit down." The Charlottesville and Virginia government had months to prepare for this. Instead the cops didn't show up on time, immediately ordered a dispersal when they arrived, and then were given stand down orders as street brawling began. The last Nazi vs. Commie showdown that made national news was from a few months ago in Pike County, Kentucky. The same Nazi groups went there to have a mass rally and try to recruit in Trump's heartland. It's a country that went Republican twice between 1932 and 2008. Then it went 80% for Trump. Antifa groups from cities like Cincy and Charlotte announced they would counter demonstrate. The local government was obviously very annoyed, but they set to work. Their mayor requested everyone stay away, but said they'd respect the Constitutional rights of American citizens. The town council passed an anti-masking law. Local authorities requested extra state police and they were provided. The authorities set up staging areas for the protesters and escorted them to the protest site. Counter protesters were required to stay a certain distance away. Everyone was warned they follow the law or face arrest and severe prosecution. Police were deep between the two groups. Nothing happened. It's not hard if the government is doing their job, and not hoping that the goons of their side shut down the goons from the other side. Edited August 13, 2017 by TheProgressiveLiberal 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 Not if they're inciting hatred. Nazis have to be opposed. It would be lovely if they could be ignored but the background context of the united states in 2017 takes that option away. The c**t in the white house used these people. He wound them up and goaded them. Just to be clear I'm not saying everyone that voted trump fits this profile. But he absolutely embraced this sick, twisted, internet movement. He is partially culpable. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjw Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 This question is specifically for pandarilla, welshy, and any of the other non-far lefties here: Do you believe that fascist groups who have gone through the proper permitting processes offered to all groups should be allowed to conduct public rallies free from attack? If you need a bunch of toy soldiers who have a gold card at the local army surplus store to come and defend you,your probably doing something wrong.For a country that places such high esteem on Veterans, its strange that you'd let people hero worship the very beliefs that seen so many Americans die fighting against. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 If you need a bunch of toy soldiers who have a gold card at the local army surplus store to come and defend you,your probably doing something wrong.For a country that places such high esteem on Veterans, its strange that you'd let people hero worship the very beliefs that seen so many Americans die fighting against. I loved the 'my heritage is fighting nazis' slogan. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheProgressiveLiberal Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 1 minute ago, mjw said: If you need a bunch of toy soldiers who have a gold card at the local army surplus store to come and defend you,your probably doing something wrong. For a country that places such high esteem on Veterans, its strange that you'd let people hero worship the very beliefs that seen so many Americans die fighting against. So, I assume you're referring to the Oath Keepers and 3%ers. I saw you reference this before. You are mistaken. Knowing their MO, these groups were their to protect private property. In states that allow open carry they gather at events like this to stop people from burning cars and smashing storefronts. Seems they were successful today because you didn't see as much of that as if this had happened in a place that bans open carry like California, DC, or NYC. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheProgressiveLiberal Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 4 minutes ago, pandarilla said: I loved the 'my heritage is fighting nazis' slogan. Heard a "We're here, we're gay, we fight the KKK" chant. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 16 minutes ago, TheProgressiveLiberal said: This question is specifically for pandarilla, welshy, and any of the other non-far lefties here: Do you believe that fascist groups who have gone through the proper permitting processes offered to all groups should be allowed to conduct public rallies free from attack? No. By definition fascists think they should be allowed to execute their racist ideology by the use of force. It's everyone's duty to resist them by any means necessary. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheProgressiveLiberal Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 1 minute ago, welshbairn said: No. By definition fascists think they should be allowed to execute their racist ideology by the use of force. It's everyone's duty to resist them by any means necessary. Ok, but the other side of this equation is the same, minus the racism. Antifa and BLM have used force across the country to shut down political gatherings from non-fascist groups. It's insane. Portland, OR had to cancel their town parade because Antifa threatened violence if the Oregon Republican Party was allowed to participate. So, is it just the racist part, and not the use of force part that's your main problem? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Cort's Hamstring Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 7 hours ago, TheProgressiveLiberal said: Context matters. Groups like the Oath Keepers and 3%ers coordinate with the police before exercising their constitutional rights. They have zero history of violence and it's clear to the police exactly what is going on. It's quite a bid different than some dude running armed around a gang controlled neighborhood and the police have no idea what's happening. American police murder black children carrying toy guns with impunity. The idea that this isn't entirely down to race is laughable. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 Ok, but the other side of this equation is the same, minus the racism. Antifa and BLM have used force across the country to shut down political gatherings from non-fascist groups. It's insane. Portland, OR had to cancel their town parade because Antifa threatened violence if the Oregon Republican Party was allowed to participate. So, is it just the racist part, and not the use of force part that's your main problem? In general I'm opposed to the use of force - but some things need to be fought against. If any extreme left organisation use force then the law of the land will rightly deal with them. But again, some things need to be fought against. Hate speech should never be tolerated by the authorities. This is where I disagree with the US constitution. Like I said earlier, some far left groups can go over the top. I do not believe they can ever be seriously compared to the far right (both in terms of actions and motives). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 American police murder black children carrying toy guns with impunity. The idea that this isn't entirely down to race is laughable. Legitimate issues (unlike the far right). I'm frankly amazed that there hasn't been more violence from sections of the black American community. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 5 minutes ago, TheProgressiveLiberal said: Ok, but the other side of this equation is the same, minus the racism. Antifa and BLM have used force across the country to shut down political gatherings from non-fascist groups. It's insane. Portland, OR had to cancel their town parade because Antifa threatened violence if the Oregon Republican Party was allowed to participate. So, is it just the racist part, and not the use of force part that's your main problem? You're talking about an anonymous email. The local "antifa" groups disavowed the threat. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjw Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 Why didn't someone in his family or community tell the authorities this terrorist had been radicalised? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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