Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[eez-eh]

56 minutes ago, Speroni*1 said:

Yes.

One unnecessary death a day is worth more than the economy.

f**k sake.

With that train of thought we would all be in lockdown for the next 12+ months until everyone at risk is vaccinated. In fact with that train of thought we’d all be fucking housebound coronavirus or no coronavirus. Should we just ban all road traffic because it’s not really necessary and some people die from it?

f**k sake that might be the stupidest post I’ve ever read.

[Ludo*1]

8 minutes ago, eez-eh said:

With that train of thought we would all be in lockdown for the next 12+ months until everyone at risk is vaccinated. In fact with that train of thought we’d all be fucking housebound coronavirus or no coronavirus. Should we just ban all road traffic because it’s not really necessary and some people die from it?

f**k sake that might be the stupidest post I’ve ever read.

What arbritary number is worth the economy being screwed then? 10? 20? 100? 1000? When does it become worth it?

What's the human value here?

I'm not saying this as a 'rebuttal' because it's quite clearly not. I'm genuinely curious as to the figure people have in their heads of being worth it as opposed to not worth it.

[Jumbo Muir]

We're not talking about hindsight though. We sat and watched footage of Italian hospitals full to bursting and people grannies dying on trolleys in a hallway and did f**k all about it. I locked down a week or so before Johnston finally gave in, having used my eyes to see what was coming

So Sturgeon reacted as soon as she saw the Italian story unfold ?
She has followed Westminster until it was safe to announce what she is privy to later on in the lockdown but trying to score cheap political points whilst doing so.

[GordonS]

1 hour ago, Speroni*1 said:

Yes.

One unnecessary death a day is worth more than the economy.

f**k sake.

Around 1,800 people are killed on the UK's roads every year and 25,00 are seriously injured.

That could be reduced to a handful if the speed limit were 20 mph.

What do you think the speed limit should be?

[paranoid android]

Interesting that we're now focusing mainly on economics.

My feeling is that, at a certain point, which probably isn't too far off, economic considerations will outweigh health considerations, and that will be why and when the lockdown will end.

I'm not saying it will be the right thing to do, I just think that's what will happen. 

[eez-eh]

8 minutes ago, Speroni*1 said:

What arbritary number is worth the economy being screwed then? 10? 20? 100? 1000? When does it become worth it?

What's the human value here?

I'm not saying this as a 'rebuttal' because it's quite clearly not. I'm genuinely curious as to the figure people have in their heads of being worth it as opposed to not worth it.

Whatever number which is less than the number of deaths caused a gigantic depression that will see people lose jobs and be pushed into poverty. Whatever number of deaths which is less than those caused by people not seeking medical help and having procedures cancelled. Whatever number of deaths which is less than the number of people who commit suicide due to the mental health issues caused by a recession and/or lockdown.

There’s parallels between this and the old government surveillance/CCTV argument. Some people will argue in favour of the government being able to monitor every WhatsApp conversation you have or having CCTV plastered on every street corner - because after all it might result in less crime or terrorist activities being committed eh? When really any reasonable person will tell you that a small drop in crime is not worth living in a society where there’s no privacy and your every move/conversation is monitored. What you’re saying in regards to having no deaths follows a similar train of thought.

We obviously need to be careful about when and how we ease restrictions but the idea that we should continue tanking everything until there’s none is fucking bonkers.

[Ludo*1]

31 minutes ago, eez-eh said:

Whatever number which is less than the number of deaths caused a gigantic depression that will see people lose jobs and be pushed into poverty. Whatever number of deaths which is less than those caused by people not seeking medical help and having procedures cancelled. Whatever number of deaths which is less than the number of people who commit suicide due to the mental health issues caused by a recession and/or lockdown.

There’s parallels between this and the old government surveillance/CCTV argument. Some people will argue in favour of the government being able to monitor every WhatsApp conversation you have or having CCTV plastered on every street corner - because after all it might result in less crime or terrorist activities being committed eh? When really any reasonable person will tell you that a small drop in crime is not worth living in a society where there’s no privacy and your every move/conversation is monitored. What you’re saying in regards to having no deaths follows a similar train of thought.

We obviously need to be careful about when and how we ease restrictions but the idea that we should continue tanking everything until there’s none is fucking bonkers.

I don't disagree with anything you've said there.

As I said in a later post but clearly didn't convey anywhere near well enough, the economy is not worth a single life in terms of its concept. The issue is when the balance is tipped and more people are dying due to the economy crashing than the virus itself. Of course, at that point it's entirely different and needs to be judged accordingly IMO.

[Guest JTS98]

1 hour ago, paranoid android said:

Interesting that we're now focusing mainly on economics.

My feeling is that, at a certain point, which probably isn't too far off, economic considerations will outweigh health considerations, and that will be why and when the lockdown will end.

I'm not saying it will be the right thing to do, I just think that's what will happen. 

This has already happened in Malaysia.

After 7 weeks of lockdown most of the country is going back to work tomorrow.

The PM's speech which announced it was clear that they're not really sure this is a great idea, but the country can't afford not to.

Unfortunate for the government that they announced this on Friday and then Saturday saw a more than 50% spike in cases, taking us above 100 for the first time in a month.

Three states have announced they won't immediately be reopening as per the government's instructions because they think it's a bad idea. Malaysia's biggest trade union and medical bodies have come out against the decision.

But ultimately, there's going to be an economic decision at some point and here we are.

I'm lucky that I can still work from home. Not much will change for me apart from the shops probably being much busier now when I go for my shopping.

We'll know what's going on in a couple of weeks, I suppose.

Edited May 3, 2020 by JTS98

[paranoid android]

2 minutes ago, JTS98 said:

This has already happened in Malaysia.

After 7 weeks of lockdown most of the country is going back to work tomorrow.

The PM's speech which announced it was clear that they're not really sure this is a great idea, but the country can't afford not to.

Three states have announced they won't immediately be reopening as per the government's instructions because they think it's a bad idea. Malaysia's biggest trade union and medical bodies have come out against the decision.

But ultimately, there's going to be an economic decision at some point and here we are.

I'm lucky that I can still work from home. Not much will change for me apart from the shops probably being much busier now when I go for my shopping.

We'll know what's going on in a couple of weeks, I suppose.

Yup - unprecedented times, to be sure.

This is a football forum, and the tell-tale sign for us is that massive football clubs are making moves to get back to playing games - for the sake of their own survival, and for the sake of the economic survival of massive TV companies. 

From there, it's a short step to McDonald's, Greggs, and whoever the f**k else trading again - who knows what will happen.

Stay safe, brother. 

[SlipperyP]

14 minutes ago, JTS98 said:

This has already happened in Malaysia.

After 7 weeks of lockdown most of the country is going back to work tomorrow.

The PM's speech which announced it was clear that they're not really sure this is a great idea, but the country can't afford not to.

Unfortunate for the government that they announced this on Friday and then Saturday saw a more than 50% spike in cases, taking us above 100 for the first time in a month.

Three states have announced they won't immediately be reopening as per the government's instructions because they think it's a bad idea. Malaysia's biggest trade union and medical bodies have come out against the decision.

But ultimately, there's going to be an economic decision at some point and here we are.

I'm lucky that I can still work from home. Not much will change for me apart from the shops probably being much busier now when I go for my shopping.

We'll know what's going on in a couple of weeks, I suppose.

Yes, the scientist were in control for a wee while. The economist have regained the balance...at the moment.

[Theroadlesstravelled]

What's the point in fucking having a lockdown?

 

 

[Guest JTS98]

42 minutes ago, SlipperyP said:

Yes, the scientist were in control for a wee while. The economist have regained the balance...at the moment.

Aye. It could easily swing back the other way.

Apparently ventilator use in Malaysia is at 30% and leave for front-line health workers is being approved again. In that regard the relatively strict measures put in place here seem to have had the desired effect and this is buying the government the benefit of the doubt.

But the view of the medical bodies is that this will shove the numbers back up. The government seem happy to accept that and deal with whatever comes next.

Not much to do but wait.

Edited May 3, 2020 by JTS98

[resk]

Surely the way to celebrate VE day is in the original 1945 way- getting pished and trying to shag a nurse/WREN/ATS/land girl

I mean, they're all pretty old nowadays, or dead, but fk it - I'm in.

[Zen Archer (Raconteur)]

The reopening of Greggs to provide purvey sausage rolls premature.

[dirty dingus]

I think they will tell folk the lockdown will last another 2 weeks and will only be eased if they get the required numbers signing up to the track n trace app. they also need to advertise like f**k about wearing masks and social distancing. The 5 target thinging is quite flexible so they can bluster past them by saying the wonderful NHS and the brilliant effort by the public spiel. The govt are slready champing at the bit to restart as the  bunnet at the press conference was saying how eveyone is so exited about getting back to work (I, right) I'm in lockdown till 6th June so would like the guinea pig public to go test the waters before I venture out for a wee spot of camping and carry oot recreation time.

If all these small businesses open will anyone be using them?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/02/fearful-britons-oppose-lifting-lockdown-schools-pubs-restaurants-opinium-poll?CMP=share_btn_fb&fbclid=IwAR14yfp_rU0ZRgy5e9dNhFWE0H0mMa7PsmmkEu4rGoCdIH6TheQ9JV04ZWM

Edited May 3, 2020 by dirty dingus

[Guest Bob Mahelp]

https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1277003/Coronavirus-latest-Michel-barnier-eu-news-wuhan-institute-of-virology

The Express excelling themselves this morning....running with Trump's nut case theory about the Chinese, and adding a bit of serious EU bashing just in case the braindead arseholes who believe their shite weren't already wound up enough.

 

[Turkmenbashi]

9 hours ago, s_dog said:

 

In Scotland the capacity was 350 to begin with, now up ten times that, so prob not even anywhere near the capability to test enough now never mind two months ago. I wonder how Belgium for example are testing 10-20,000 daily (pop 11.5m), whereas we (pop 5.4m) are nowhere near half of that?

Until about a month ago it was the same here in Belgium as Scotland, testing only patients in hospital (+ maybe medical workers), then about a month ago we took all laboratory equipment from public + private sectors labs (Except large hospitals), took them to three mains locations, and developed a system to go round all care homes in the country and test all staff and all the people staying there. No matter whether there was any cases present or not. (My employer were involved this since mid March).

From my knowledge of people working in labs in Scotland who had correct equipment for covid testing until April no one had approached them for equipment and even then NHS England approached them before NHS Scotland.

I believe the intention is to eventually offer testing to anyone who wants it, but that is not ready.

[Wee Willie]

10 hours ago, Bairnardo said:

I would absolutely use it if its part of looseing restrictions. Like you though, I would like to see assurances that the whole thing is burned to the ground after we are past this. I think its use should be brought through parliament. That would give its use credibility, and could be used to put some legal restrictions on the post crisis data etc

Westminster ruled by the Tories and Labour an ineffectual opposition and you think it would give credibility - aye, right

10 hours ago, Granny Danger said:

I’ll take a guess and say part of it is to do with Belgium being an autonomous country and having total control over revenue raising and expenditure.

I could be wrong but I don’t think I am.

Well said

9 hours ago, superbigal said:

 

Actually Belgium is one of the most politically fragmented countries in the western world..
Belgium however as a nation has come together very well imo during the crisis.

 

Mibbe so but at least the rules are made in Belgium and no in France or Germany or.....

8 hours ago, Marshmallo said:

Yes.

It could be one of my grandparents, parents, colleagues or friends in that 40. If it's not then it could be one of yours. It's quite an easy choice between them and a shop that sells phone cases or vape refills.

It could also be me

[Stellaboz]

Belgium is mostly an utter dump of a country.

[topcat(The most tip top)]

Belgium is mostly an utter dump of a country.

^^^^ Teetotal Hillwalker with a chocolate allergy found