GordonS Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 16 minutes ago, Day of the Lords said: 12 hours ago, GordonS said: There was an attempted coup d'etat in Japan the night before the surrender, by senior military figures who wanted to fight on. In the history of zoomers these guys must have been right up there in the VIP section. The Americans would have reduced the entire country to radioactive ash one city at a time until an unconditional surrender came. Regardless of what the IJN wanted in the early 40s, Japan's strategic needs weren't in the USSR. Their invasion of China and South East Asia - where they committed heinous atrocities that don't get properly remembered in the West - meant that they needed more natural resources they didn't have at home, especially oil. The US had imposed sanction on Japan because of their aggression, so they decided they needed Borneo. That meant sailing past the US-controlled Philippines, which wouldn't be possible with the power of the US Navy around. Hence, Pearl Harbor. Like authoritarian regimes very often do, they assumed a democracy would be too soft and fluffy to fight back after a brutal blow. Man, did they ever read that wrong. Didn't the yanks only have the two A-bombs which were dropped anyway? I'm sure I read a while back that had the Japanese not surrendered, an invasion would have been necessary as developing another a-bomb would have taken too long. There wasn't one ready imminently but it wouldn't have taken too long, IIRC it would have been 2-3 months. After the unspeakable horrors of Okinawa it's extrememly unlikely they'd have sent soldiers to the Japanese home islands, they'd just have waited and dropped A bombs as they made them until the Japanese accepted the inevitable. They'd likely have continued with the conventional aerial bombardment too, which, incredibly, was worse than the atomic bombings. In one night, 9-10 March, about 100,000 were killed in the firebombing of Tokyo. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 1 hour ago, Day of the Lords said: 13 hours ago, GordonS said: There was an attempted coup d'etat in Japan the night before the surrender, by senior military figures who wanted to fight on. In the history of zoomers these guys must have been right up there in the VIP section. The Americans would have reduced the entire country to radioactive ash one city at a time until an unconditional surrender came. Regardless of what the IJN wanted in the early 40s, Japan's strategic needs weren't in the USSR. Their invasion of China and South East Asia - where they committed heinous atrocities that don't get properly remembered in the West - meant that they needed more natural resources they didn't have at home, especially oil. The US had imposed sanction on Japan because of their aggression, so they decided they needed Borneo. That meant sailing past the US-controlled Philippines, which wouldn't be possible with the power of the US Navy around. Hence, Pearl Harbor. Like authoritarian regimes very often do, they assumed a democracy would be too soft and fluffy to fight back after a brutal blow. Man, did they ever read that wrong. Didn't the yanks only have the two A-bombs which were dropped anyway? I'm sure I read a while back that had the Japanese not surrendered, an invasion would have been necessary as developing another a-bomb would have taken too long. Third bomb was planned for Sapporo in Hokkaido. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peasy23 Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 This thread reminded me to reconnect with my big German pal. He’d got run over a few months back but is on the mend. Thanks P&B for the inspiration to extend the hand of friendship to a German.Is this him? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 55 minutes ago, GordonS said: There wasn't one ready imminently but it wouldn't have taken too long, IIRC it would have been 2-3 months. After the unspeakable horrors of Okinawa it's extrememly unlikely they'd have sent soldiers to the Japanese home islands, they'd just have waited and dropped A bombs as they made them until the Japanese accepted the inevitable. They'd likely have continued with the conventional aerial bombardment too, which, incredibly, was worse than the atomic bombings. In one night, 9-10 March, about 100,000 were killed in the firebombing of Tokyo. All the PoWs (In Japan, at least) would have died. Probably most of the rest of them held elsewhere, too, if Sandakan was anything to go by. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshmallo Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 The armed forces and the NHS combine to give the ultimate gammon combo. The two greatest religions this country has ever seen. -3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shandon Par Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 21 minutes ago, peasy23 said: Is this him? That’s him! Never had a beard before the lockdown. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forest_Fifer Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 Didn't the yanks only have the two A-bombs which were dropped anyway? I'm sure I read a while back that had the Japanese not surrendered, an invasion would have been necessary as developing another a-bomb would have taken too long. They expected to have another ready later in August, 3 more in September, and 3 in October. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesConnelly Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 So if tomorrow is VE day, does this mean today is VD day? Quite a few newsreaders today have said “VD Day” before correcting themselves. Even our very own Sally McNair on the lunchtime news 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melanius Mullarkey Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 2 minutes ago, JamesConnelly said: Quite a few newsreaders today have said “VD Day” before correcting themselves. Even our very own Sally McNair on the lunchtime news Sally does strike me as the type, dirty girl. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 2 hours ago, D.A.F.C said: 3 hours ago, Day of the Lords said: Didn't the yanks only have the two A-bombs which were dropped anyway? I'm sure I read a while back that had the Japanese not surrendered, an invasion would have been necessary as developing another a-bomb would have taken too long. More people died from conventional bombing in japan. Pretty sure they had more than two bombs, even the threat of more would be enough. Yes. More people died when Tokyo was bombed. However there was one big difference. When Hiroshima and Nagasaki were bombed, none of the aircrew died. No planes were lost. Nobody had to bail out. How do you fight a war where you incur massive casualties and the enemy incurs none? Also what do you do when it only requires a single plane to deliver the bomb? Are you on the lookout for every single plane? What clues are there? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bairnardo Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 Quite a few newsreaders today have said “VD Day” before correcting themselves. Even our very own Sally McNair on the lunchtime newsIt's almost like VE day was a minor acknowledgement at most before extremely cringe military fetishism crept into official pandemic response policy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 5 minutes ago, Bairnardo said: 1 hour ago, JamesConnelly said: Quite a few newsreaders today have said “VD Day” before correcting themselves. Even our very own Sally McNair on the lunchtime news It's almost like VE day was a minor acknowledgement at most before extremely cringe military fetishism crept into official pandemic response policy If it weren’t for the Pandemic the VE celebrations would have been hyped up even more by Johnson. Street parties, military parades, and more. The jingoism would be dripping from every UK government spokesperson’s tongue. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todd_is_God Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 Ive read many people, usually gammons tbf, comment on Victory over Europe rather than Victory IN Europe. Very telling IMO on why they are so excited about it 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsforlife Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 3 hours ago, LGF said: *Disclaimer* Not my house Right, that’s me put the bunting up, painted the front of the house, put poppies and a sad soldier silhouette on the door and hung a flag out the window, everyone will see how much I care. ’ have you put anything on the lamppost Dave? , What about the fence Dave? They’ll think you’re one of those ungrateful foreigners if you don’t get that sorted, oh and make sure there’s something in the grass, can’t have people thinking the green is secretly showing we’re part of the other lot. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 22 hours ago, Fullerene said: He was also a big fan of the Molotov Ribbentrop Treaty. Fantastic analysis. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamthebam Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 I'd quite like to celebrate VE Day in the traditional way- kicking the Tories out at an election a few months later.. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 7 hours ago, heedthebaa said: There you go lads, don’t say I’m not good to you. Sing loud and be proud 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shandon Par Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 Anybody got any Veras? Laaaahvly. Ahhahahahaa. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Orton Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 2 minutes ago, Shandon Par said: Anybody got any Veras? Laaaahvly. Ahhahahahaa. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.A.F.C Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 Mr C was a really talented dj and mc. Always thought he was a joke figure after that song but he was on pirate radio and playing raves well before the shamen. Heard a mix a few years back and it was class.On topic people in local area are trying to organise a VE sing along tonight. No coincidence that theres a lodge and legion plus a very staunch support usually. Once walked past a guy with full union Jack gear and bowtie etc in town, thought it was a pisstake then another group got off the bus round the corner. The kicking would have almost been worth laughing at them. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.