Guest Flash Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 (edited) That we'll not be as good as last season is likely of course. The players to have come in are unlikely to be as good as the ones who left up the way, at least not yet. However, we finished 7 points ahead of Falkirk last season and 17 ahead of Raith who were 5th. I accept Raith, who incidentally have made wholesale changes too, basically chucked it over the last month but that's a big gap to close. We could conceivably be worse than last year, have everyone else be exactly the same and still be good enough to make 4th so your conclusion isn't entirely accurate.No, that doesn't work. Even if we are only slightly worse, Falkirk could easily get 2 draws at Palmerston instead of 2 defeats, so there is 4 points of your 7 closed right away. If they get 2 draws at Palmerston and 2 wins at home that would be a 12 point turnaround. And if Raith beat us 3 times plus 1 draw instead of us beating them 3 times that is a 15 point swing, which closes the 17 point gap. And that doesn't include matches against anybody else which, potentially, we are going to take fewer points from than before. So my conclusion is entirely accurate. Edited for typing. Edited July 19, 2015 by Flash 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby findlater Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 Randomly Met Billy Hewitson today and he reckons the new players are going to be a real asset to the club so I am a lot happier than I appeared yesterday in my first post. Need a good start and hopefully get some quick wins under our belt. C'moan the South 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priti priti priti Patel Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 (edited) Mr X, is there any chance you can put the closed door friendly results on the OS fixtures page? They are clearly a staple in our pre-season programme and it would be nice to be able to give them all the once over on one page. Edited July 19, 2015 by Margaret Thatcher 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 No, that doesn't work. Even if we are only slightly worse, Falkirk could easily get 2 draws at Palmerston instead of 2 defeats, so there is 4 points of your 7 closed right away. If they get 2 draws at Palmerston and 2 wins at home that would be a 12 point turnaround. And if Raith beat us 3 times plus 1 draw instead of us beating them 3 times that is a 15 point swing, which closes the 17 point gap. And that doesn't include matches against anybody else which, potentially, we are going to take fewer points from than before. So my conclusion is entirely accurate. Edited for typing. If your auntie had testicles she'd be your uncle. You can change a few individual results all you like. The fact is we had a decent margin in hand over Falkirk at the end (which might well have been more if we'd needed to win the last game instead of resting players in it) and were miles clear of 6th. You can't just say we're worse than last year so the only way we can remain 4th is if everyone else is worse too. You might be right but it depends how much worse we are. It's clearly perfectly possible to be worse and still better than everyone else, especially everyone other than Falkirk who were the only team below within five wins of us Your conclusion is not "entirely accurate". It's potentially accurate. It's also potentially wrong. It's not a black or white. Falkirk are the only side below us from this division last season not to have made every bit as many changes to their squad too for that matter. Raith, Dumbarton, Livingston and Alloa have all made wholesale changes. Two of them have new managers too (three if you don't count Lennon's back end of the season cameo with Alloa). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Flash Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 (edited) The point is that the 7 point gap with Falkirk could be closed by only changing the head to head results. If they are the same and we're worse, then the most likely outcome is that they will get more points in the head to head games than they did last season and will finish above us as a result. The decent margin over Falkirk was a consequence of the results in the games against them more than anything else. As I said swap the results from last season round and they finish 5 points ahead of us, even if all the other results are the same. It is the same with Raith - they could close the gap just by the head to head results alone. I was trying to show that what looks like a big points gap can be closed just in the matches against each other. Yes, it does depend on how much worse we are. But I think we only need to be marginally worse for Falkirk to go above us. ETA which is why I said I thought we would finish between 5th and 8th. If we are marginally worse, we'll be 5th and if we're significantly worse we could be 8th. And I'd have no complaints either way because you can't lose the players we lost and expect to finish in the same place. Edited July 19, 2015 by Flash 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Thompson Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 Mr X, is there any chance you can put the closed door friendly results on the OS fixtures page? They are clearly a staple in our pre-season programme and it would be nice to be able to give them all the once over on one page. Could do. They tend, though, to be more about game time than results. As today showed! The point is that the 7 point gap with Falkirk could be closed by only changing the head to head results. If they are the same and we're worse, then the most likely outcome is that they will get more points in the head to head games than they did last season and will finish above us as a result. The decent margin over Falkirk was a consequence of the results in the games against them more than anything else. As I said swap the results from last season round and they finish 5 points ahead of us, even if all the other results are the same. It is the same with Raith - they could close the gap just by the head to head results alone. I was trying to show that what looks like a big points gap can be closed just in the matches against each other. Yes, it does depend on how much worse we are. But I think we only need to be marginally worse for Falkirk to go above us. You're assuming, though, that everyone else - or at least Falkirk and Raith - will be at least the same as last season. Falkirk have yet to replace Loy. and their record last season when he was injured was pretty woeful. As SD said, Raith have had as big a turnover as us and a new manager. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priti priti priti Patel Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 Could do. They tend, though, to be more about game time than results. As today showed! True, but you could link to the news reports as match reports, and/or write 'Bounce game' or 'Closed doors' instead of friendly? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lyle be back Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 Saints scored 3 goals in last 2 minutes. Was a very young experimental team at that time on the pitch. Wouldnt read to much into result. Thanks for the reassurance. Must admit I was concerned when I first saw the score. Do we know who was in defence at the time - ie any likely starters? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Thompson Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 True, but you could link to the news reports as match reports, and/or write 'Bounce game' or 'Closed doors' instead of friendly? That would take a bit of work. Everything is linked so that it updates automatically. To get the score on the fixtures page would mean either having live updates or a match report, including line ups etc. Its possible to rework it but not that easily 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebobsboy Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 Could do. They tend, though, to be more about game time than results. As today showed! You're assuming, though, that everyone else - or at least Falkirk and Raith - will be at least the same as last season. Falkirk have yet to replace Loy. and their record last season when he was injured was pretty woeful. As SD said, Raith have had as big a turnover as us and a new manager. Could do. They tend, though, to be more about game time than results. As today showed! You're assuming, though, that everyone else - or at least Falkirk and Raith - will be at least the same as last season. Falkirk have yet to replace Loy. and their record last season when he was injured was pretty woeful. As SD said, Raith have had as big a turnover as us and a new manager. I think a lot will depend on our strikers, McHugh is a gamble but looks ok so far if he can keep fit and i wouldn't say he is the same type of player as Loy, we are still looking for an experienced front man. Allied to Baird, and Biabi who should kick on this year. If we can get our strikers scoring goals and not just relying heavily on one man like Loy last year then we should make top 4 no problem 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Flash Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 I'm assuming that the opposition will be of a similar level to last season. You're assuming, though, that everyone else - or at least Falkirk and Raith - will be at least the same as last season. Falkirk have yet to replace Loy. and their record last season when he was injured was pretty woeful. As SD said, Raith have had as big a turnover as us and a new manager. Well, yes, that was my assumption. Which is why I said it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Thompson Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 I think a lot will depend on our strikers, McHugh is a gamble but looks ok so far if he can keep fit and i wouldn't say he is the same type of player as Loy, we are still looking for an experienced front man. Allied to Baird, and Biabi who should kick on this year. If we can get our strikers scoring goals and not just relying heavily on one man like Loy last year then we should make top 4 no problem As is everyone else. Having known that Loy was going since January if there were similar replacements out there you would have thought you would have one by now. I think its fair to say that Falkirk arent going to replace Loy with anything like the same quality. However, as you say, if other players can step up it might not be an issue. Its a big ask though for players like Baird and McHugh who have never been particularly prolific scorers in their careers. Well, yes, that was my assumption. Which is why I said it. I know. I wasnt questioning that, more pointing out that its a strange assumption to make and there is little evidence to support it 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Flash Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 I know. I wasnt questioning that, more pointing out that its a strange assumption to make and there is little evidence to support itI can't be bothered quoting myself again, but I also said that you know more about the opposition than I do. I don't really keep up with what other teams are doing, so I don't really have much of a clue about who they have or haven't signed. And, even if I did, I don't know what many of the players are like. I don't even know what most of our own players are like, I'm assuming they are not as good as the ones who left otherwise Dundee United, Hearts etc would have signed them instead of the players they signed from us.However, it is comforting to know that all the other teams are in the same boat. Which presumably means that if we finish 4th with a worse team than last season, we'll have a better chance of winning the play-offs. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebobsboy Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 A lot of our fans have said the same thing about Houston knowing full well Loy was going and yet did sod all about sourcing his replacement, we do seem to have a knack of uncovering unknowns like El Allagui, Taylor and Loy who have all been successful, whether this trend continues remains to be seen, can't keep pulling rabbits out a hat i suppose. We did miss out on Clarkson, he had agreed terms but Motherwell came in at last minute, he would have been a decent replacement for Loy. Lee Miller and Jon Daly have been mooted, but more in hope than expectation i think. Miller is one i wouldnt really want anyway. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 As is everyone else. Having known that Loy was going since January if there were similar replacements out there you would have thought you would have one by now. I think its fair to say that Falkirk arent going to replace Loy with anything like the same quality. However, as you say, if other players can step up it might not be an issue. Its a big ask though for players like Baird and McHugh who have never been particularly prolific scorers in their careers. Neither has Loy. He's a good player but wasn't a prolific scorer by any means, certainly not before he arrived at Falkirk. He's done well there and scored almost every second game in his time there though a good few of them were penalties. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebobsboy Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 Neither has Loy. He's a good player but wasn't a prolific scorer by any means, certainly not before he arrived at Falkirk. He's done well there and scored almost every second game in his time there though a good few of them were penalties. He missed a good few aswell. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawk Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 With an open mind I'm looking forward to Saturday to see how this new team gel. Normally I would be looking for a comfortable home win and it should be the case but you never know with a local Derby and a new team. It seems such a long time since the excitement of the last competitive game. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERSOUTH Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 Great to see another local firm puting money in to Queens Oakbank sponsoring the Portland terrace thats 3 sides of the ground soonsored anyone any idea what kind if money is brought into the club from this? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_vortex Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 Great to see another local firm puting money in to Queens Oakbank sponsoring the Portland terrace thats 3 sides of the ground soonsored anyone any idea what kind if money is brought into the club from this? £3,000 to sponsor the Portland Road End 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONKMAN Posted July 21, 2015 Share Posted July 21, 2015 20's drew 0-0 with Carlisle this afternoon. Not sure how queens didn't win the game with the chances they had. Higgins didn't look up to much if I'm being honest. Jack Devlin looked sharp when he came on, but he needs to sort out that haircut before he can be taken seriously. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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