The Very Meh Humza Yousaf Thread.

[effeffsee_the2nd]

31 minutes ago, Aufc said:

I wonder what the SNPs next move will be once they raise a relatively minor amount with these tax increases. Where do they go from here? They cant just keep increasing higher rate tax bands continually. As someone who has voted for them continually in the past, i cant see me voting for them going forward. 

Am I right in thinking though, the money raised can't be kept my the SG, all revenues go directly to HM treasury & then distributed back via the block grant?

I think they've lost my vote, first time since turning 18 aswell

[renton]

1 hour ago, razamanaz said:

She blames Westminster of course and then says we cannot spend the money we do not have - how did they get into a £1.5 billion hole then? Stupid woman

Most of ScotGov's budget still comes from the bloc grant, the value of which derives from the UK government's budget decisions.

It's not that the Scottish Government spent more money than it had, it's that it will have less to spend than planning assumptions to date, based on the previous bloc grant. 

In much the same way as the MoD suddenly found itself with a similar 10 billion hole in it's equipment plan, despite not actually having changed the plan, UK government refusal to inflation proof public services will clearly have a knock on effect to any fixed budget - like Scotland's.

That's the harsh reality of devolution. It was never designed to be compatible with too much divergence. 

Not much can be done until Starmer arrives in late 2024 and suddenly increases public spending in vital services, introduces progressive taxation of it's own, a true living wage for all, reforms local government spending and introduces radical constitutional reform to deliver a more sustainable settlement for the devolved admins.

No laughing at the back please.

Edited December 19, 2023 by renton

[superbigal]

Apparently we are skint as the appeal is abandoned.

Surely to feck Humsa can find some Ambulance chaser in a no win no fee

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-67761819

[HibeeJibee]

Much of the 'blackhole' is not down to lower spending at Westminster. It was Yousaf and his cabinet who awarded a number of larger public sector pay rises than was done in England or Wales or Northern Ireland. It was they who protested at NI being cut but equally chose not to balance it by increasing baseline income tax. It was Yousaf, this time apparently without his cabinet, who froze council tax (with "fully funded" actually proving "~45% funded").

 

2 hours ago, Aufc said:

I wonder what the SNPs next move will be once they raise a relatively minor amount with these tax increases. Where do they go from here? They cant just keep increasing higher rate tax bands continually.

Tbf the political optics of going back to the well every year - carry on like this by 2025 there'll be about 6 new tax bands, and top rate 50% or more - are likely more important than its economic consequences. They don't raise much... behaviours in reaction won't lose much... but 'fiscal drag' aside (£28,000 is barely "above average" nowadays) few bemoan richer people + business paying more.

Trouble is with overall tax at post-war high, and growing % here now paying more than down south, people will expect it reflected in public services (not worsening + performing "better" comparatively UK-wise); reduced "waste"; etc.

Politically becomes very risky if health, education, transport, etc. standards seem to be declining; and/or not out-performing England; moreso if mismanagement continues grabbing headlines (e.g. 'ferrygate').

Edited December 19, 2023 by HibeeJibee

[orfc]

Fortunately the cutoff is 7.5K over a basic MSPs salary and the allowances don't count so the SNP holyrood cannon fodder they need to pass this will be generally ok

And now we know what MSPs mean by "high earners": "More than me"

[strichener]

11 hours ago, Leith Green said:

My sons schoolpals mum is Spanish, has that status and has been here 20 years - its abolutely right and fair that my sons pal gets free tuition fees as well.

Is it?  Do the Spanish offer free tuition to Scots?  That's a rhetorical question.

[TONTROOPER]

Personally.... I have serious doubts as to whether you have EVER voted for the SNP Mr. Troll.

# posted in reply aufc.

Edited December 19, 2023 by TONTROOPER

[TONTROOPER]

57 minutes ago, orfc said:

Fortunately the cutoff is 7.5K over a basic MSPs salary and the allowances don't count so the SNP holyrood cannon fodder they need to pass this will be generally ok

And now we know what MSPs mean by "high earners": "More than me"

"Oh look!.....a wee yoon trolll fae Gretna."

[doulikefish]

If those earning over 75k can't afford it then they should cancel Netflix and stop getting drinks from Starbucks 

[Leith Green]

35 minutes ago, strichener said:

Is it?  Do the Spanish offer free tuition to Scots?  That's a rhetorical question.

I can only answer for France - if you are there on residency and settled status - aye.

Cant see it being much different for the Spanish, as all these were reciprocal agreements pre Brexit and the issue on settled / residents was pretty much nailed in the awful exit agreement "we" agreed.

[effeffsee_the2nd]

27 minutes ago, doulikefish said:

If those earning over 75k can't afford it then they should cancel Netflix and stop getting drinks from Starbucks 

Two things to keep in mind here,

1) those with the ability to bypass paye will continue do so and will be unaffected by this. So were talking about c***s with jobs at the end of the day, not the 1%

 

2) As much as there are plenty of out of touch  wankers spouting this shite about the less well off, be careful not to sound spiteful in a “ ha ha serves you right for getting paid too mich” kind of way

[doulikefish]

4 minutes ago, effeffsee_the2nd said:

Two things to keep in mind here,

1) those with the ability to bypass paye will continue do so and will be unaffected by this. So were talking about c***s with jobs at the end of the day, not the 1%

 

2) As much as there are plenty of out of touch  wankers spouting this shite about the less well off, be careful not to sound spiteful in a “ ha ha serves you right for getting paid too mich” kind of way

I pay the top rate of  Norwegian tax but you crack on 

[Trogdor]

My biggest issue with the SNP's tax bands is the higher rate (42%) starting at £43,663. It is where the volume of tax earners are which is why its set at that point. However, its a blatant cash grab against those who can't mitigate it as they are all taxed at source. Unlike those at the top of the tree.

I've never agreed with it since it's inception. I'm not agin paying higher taxes for better services (free education, free prescriptions, more GPs, more dentists etc.). I just think that £43.7k is low to start losing more than half every pound you earn between tax & ni.  The higher rate threshold of the UK Government is more sensible, it kicks in at about £50k.

I have no issue with paying 42% over 40%, I think that's fair but the low bar is capturing a lot of people who aren't higher earners. There is also the refusal to raise the bar, I believe that's referred to as fiscal drag.

[Left Back]

On 17/12/2023 at 10:05, Leith Green said:

If my son went to uni in England, fees are £9250 pa.

Even on a 3 year degree, thats £27750 - do a masters and its £37000 - more than it costs me for him going to Glasgow Uni.

But, but £2200 more in tax.....................

 

Another great theory.

Funded uni places in Scotland are capped so it’s absolutely possible to pay tax in Scotland but not financially benefit from “free” uni tuition either as a parent or a student.

[Eatmygoal]

46 minutes ago, doulikefish said:

I pay the top rate of  Norwegian tax but you crack on 

Are salaries generally higher in Norway and are things for example childcare relatively less expensive? 

I wouldn't mind paying more tax if I had loads of disposable income at the end of the day, but as someone with two young kids and a wife with a relatively low income we are already feeling the pinch.

 

 

[vikingTON]

36 minutes ago, Trogdor said:

 

I've never agreed with it since it's inception. I'm not agin paying higher taxes for better services (free education, free prescriptions, more GPs, more dentists etc.). I just think that £43.7k is low to start losing more than half every pound you earn between tax & ni.  The higher rate threshold of the UK Government is more sensible, it kicks in at about £50k.

I have no issue with paying 42% over 40%, I think that's fair but the low bar is capturing a lot of people who aren't higher earners. 

They objectively are higher earners. It is £10k higher - roughly 30% higher - than the median full-time salary:

https://digitalpublications.parliament.scot/ResearchBriefings/Report/2023/2/27/e0888682-8f9a-46f0-9448-5a588c583f58

Just now, Eatmygoal said:

Are salaries generally higher in Norway and are things for example childcare relatively less expensive? 

I wouldn't mind paying more tax if I had loads of disposable income at the end of the day, but as someone with two young kids and a wife with a relatively low income we are already feeling the pinch.

1) If you're paying a higher level of tax then you're quite clearly not on a 'relatively low income'. See the figures above.

2) It's really not incumbent on the state to subsidise your family planning (or indeed housing purchases, daft car leasing schemes etc. - insert other middle class fixations here) through taxation policy.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

5 hours ago, superbigal said:

Apparently we are skint as the appeal is abandoned.

Surely to feck Humsa can find some Ambulance chaser in a no win no fee

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-67761819

At last some fucking sense.

[Eatmygoal]

6 minutes ago, virginton said:

They objectively are higher earners. It is £10k higher - roughly 30% higher - than the median full-time salary:

https://digitalpublications.parliament.scot/ResearchBriefings/Report/2023/2/27/e0888682-8f9a-46f0-9448-5a588c583f58

1) If you're paying a higher level of tax then you're quite clearly not on a 'relatively low income'. See the figures above.

2) It's really not incumbent on the state to subsidise your family planning (or indeed housing purchases, daft car leasing schemes etc. - insert other middle class fixations here) through taxation policy.

1) My wife has a relatively low income not me!

2) I own my car, its not fancy or new. I have a very modest mortgage. I don't expect the state to subsidise my lifestyle as you put it. Your tax base will soon be eroded if we all stop having kids! 

 

[Left Back]

9 minutes ago, Eatmygoal said:

1) My wife has a relatively low income not me!

2) I own my car, its not fancy or new. I have a very modest mortgage. I don't expect the state to subsidise my lifestyle as you put it. Your tax base will soon be eroded if we all stop having kids! 

 

I’d bet tax wasn’t a consideration when yourself and your wife were family planning.

Could be an interesting chat-up line for the young team today.

If you don’t give me my nat king who will pay your parents pensions?

Edited December 19, 2023 by Left Back

[vikingTON]

7 minutes ago, Eatmygoal said:

1) My wife has a relatively low income not me!

So you're a two person wage-earning family - one of which is earning in the upper income tax brackets, with a banger of a car and a 'modest' mortgage. 

Your feeling the pinch story doesn't really add up then. 

Quote

Your tax base will soon be eroded if we all stop having kids! 

There are 7 billion people on the planet and half of many developing countries' population consists of children. The tax base can be maintained by sensible migration policies rather than nativist subsidy for sprog rearing.