Young people “unable to work” at higher rates than older people

[Melanius Mullarkey]

1 hour ago, welshbairn said:

Youngsters take sickies a lot because they have fun things they'd prefer to be doing. Oldies see work as an excuse to escape from home.

I take sickies so I dont have to go into work.

Except I still pretend to go into work but then go on a solo jolly to the seaside or a drive up the hills.

 

[ICTChris]

2 hours ago, diegomarahenry said:

There have been societal changes as well, previously people would seek help from their parish or from family, community etc for personal problems. Most of these things don’t exist any more so they expect their workplace to give support.

In a short space of time at my last job, I had two people contact me out of hours to say they were suicidal, I had to facilitate counselling through the company. I couldn’t understand why they didn’t go to their family but some folk don’t have the option. 
 

It is easy to blame it on folk being shut-in nerds or socially awkward but there is very little incentive to be job conscious any more. 

I think that's probably true.  Workplaces offer things like mental health first aid or counselling services, partly as a good benefit but also I assume to help with productivity.  It's hard though, there are limits in what can be done in some cases.  In a previous role I had one of our colleagues very sadly took his own life and I remember some people saying "couldn't the company have done more, couldn't we have done more" but, and I might have actually said this, sometimes there isn't much that can be done.  The guy in that case was always alright with me but he was a pretty volatile character, alcoholic and habitual drug user with at least two divorces under his belt.  He was a prime candidate for severe mental health problems and I don't think the company could have done anything about it - maybe asking him to stop going for five pints at lunchtime, which he did almost every day.

 

[DiegoDiego]

We give new employees a glossy leaflet detailing how to get help, there are similar posters up around the place but often they still aren't aware we partner with a company providing such services.

I've had people come to me with mental health issues and I help them with relation to work, explain procedures and what we can do to assist. We do have quite a good questionnaire type thing to go through with them to see what can be done to make their time at work easier. But I also tell them to phone the number on the poster or speak to their doctor, as those people are professionals. I'm not going to give someone advice on something I'm not trained in.

There are unfortunately some people who either don't want to seek help or are ashamed of seeking help. As Chris alludes to, for some the problem is already terminal.

[Doctor Manhattan]

2 hours ago, Jives Miguel said:

No doubt this thread will devolve into incoherent boomer ramblings about Netflix, love island, social media, avocado toast and so on

You forgot oestrogen in the water supply. And if you think "social media" isn't a significant factor you can stick your red dots up your arse.

2 hours ago, Richey Edwards said:

Social media has taken a wrecking ball to the mental health of young people.

Indeed.

[VincentGuerin]

2 hours ago, DA Baracus said:

No wonder so many younger are disillusioned with work. What are you working for now? To get a house? Nope, won't be happening for a large number of people as it becomes increasingly out of reach. Increasing costs of everything sees wages increasingly spent on essentials, leaving less and less for things folk actually want to spend money on, so many rightly see the massive issues in front of them.

I think this is a huge part of it, based on what I hear from the Yoof that I work with.

I think there are two parts to that. One is that it is simply just factually difficult for young people to buy their own place and set up an independent life. The 20-somethings I work with are all on a decent wage, but hardly any of them own the place they live. Even thinking back to when I started working, this lot are behind me and my mates in terms of where we were at their stage in life in terms of being independent. They can't all just be feckless avocado lovers.

It certainly feeds into their attitude to work. I think there's resentment at being asked to put in a shift while getting relatively little for it in return in terms of advancing your life. And the mental health aspect of insecure living conditions and genuine doubt about what your future will look like is something I don't think we fully understand yet. The second part of the issue is that what I've just described is such common knowledge now that I think for a lot of the youngsters disillusion is almost a cultural expectation. I'm not saying they're wrong; I'm saying there's a snowball effect.

I genuinely think I'm good with the youngsters at work. I cover for them where I can and I try to see where they're coming from. But we haven't yet found a full understanding of each other. It's my perception that a lot of them lack resillience. Maybe that's a good thing. Maybe we should say no at work more often and prioritise ourselves. Maybe what I see as a lack of resillience is just them showing a better sense of their own wellbeing than I do. I've got to be honest, there have been plenty of times where I've given someone a good hearing, shown all the concern and given all the advice I can, given all the practical help that I can, and still been left with a feeling that the kindest advice I could give them (but never would) is "really, for now, just grit your teeth, get this done, then get up the road".

But it does lead to problems as their expectations of what work should be and what it should provide them with simply do not match up with current reality, or with the expectations those older than them often have.

[HeWhoWalksBehindTheRows]

1 hour ago, Melanius Mullarkey said:

I take sickies so I dont have to go into work.

Except I still pretend to go into work but then go on a solo jolly to the seaside or a drive up the hills.

 

Double bubble, nice.

[The Moonster]

4 hours ago, DiegoDiego said:

I've had the misfortune to have employed a couple of these types and it was bizarre to deal with them.

One had overhead some minor criticism of her (the person didn't know which member of staff was responsible, so it wasn't personal) and half an hour later she entered my office in tears asking to go home.

Another phoned me in a panic on my day off saying she couldn't cope. When I arrived ten minutes later everything was perfectly under control.

It's strange as their reactions are genuine, but just massively out of proportion to the events that caused them.

Unfortunately 90% of applicants are late teens, early twenties, so it's just something I have to put up with. It generally ends up with me having to cover their shift unpaid, then getting it in the neck from head office for acting so much TOIL.

Because they suffer from mental health issues I can't even extend their probation, let alone sack them, as HR are terrified of being taken to a tribunal over discrimination.

So one of your employees had a panic attack at work and you want to sack them for it? 

Unsure if you've just worded this poorly but I read all of that and think thank f**k I'm not working for you. 

[coprolite]

Vegans are generally weak. 
 

Spam (or any generic luncheon meat) on the nhs is what’s needed. Never did me any harm. 

[Busta Nut]

In all honesty I don't really "get" the mental health issues a lot of folk have to deal with, however I do think I'm the type to one day just explode in my mid fifties.

[Derry Alli]

It is 100% due ro the (now accepted and filtered in) use of social media in schools. 

Teachers are WhatsApp parents. Kids are glued to tablets and phones.

I see it with the apprentices at my work. They're passing tests as they're done over teams or whatever app it is and they're answering questions by gaining answers through Google on the phones beside them.

As a society we are becoming weaker, lazier and more accepting of faults and failures and to be honest, at 35 it's doing my tits in. 

[diegomarahenry]

21 minutes ago, Busta Nut said:

In all honesty I don't really "get" the mental health issues a lot of folk have to deal with, however I do think I'm the type to one day just explode in my mid fifties.

You haven’t grown up rattling Red Bull, Monster and Starbucks in to your veins 10 hours a day while spending 4 hours looking at your phone a day. Ending up with a resting heart rate of an overactive squirrel. 
I think people are more likely to speak of mental health issues or step away from pressure now that prevent breakdowns. But medicate themselves in to a panic attack on an hourly basis. 

[Doctor Manhattan]

36 minutes ago, Busta Nut said:

I do think I'm the type to one day just explode in my mid fifties.

[ICTChris]

It's worth saying that all the young people I work with are great, although I can't get on board with the return of the mullet.

[itzdrk]

[mozam76]

3 hours ago, Melanius Mullarkey said:

I take sickies so I dont have to go into work.

Except I still pretend to go into work but then go on a solo jolly to the seaside or a drive up the hills.

 

David Gilroy posting from the jail IMHO. 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Suzanne_Pilley

[philpy]

Apprentices get a bad rep sometimes, some are decent, but you always get the ones that sit in the van on their phone instead of getting out to help. I see it everyday in my line of work. Yeh, its my job to assist customers, but there's something infuriating about someone sitting on their arse looking at a phone when other people are busy. 

[Mark Connolly]

4 hours ago, Dan Steele said:

When I were a lad, we had to tell this story out loud.

Bloody modern gif images...

[Molotov]

1 hour ago, Busta Nut said:

In all honesty I don't really "get" the mental health issues a lot of folk have to deal with, however I do think I'm the type to one day just explode in my mid fifties.

[Molotov]

I have a feeling that this thread could result in a few heids gone moments.

@ICTChris has a canny knack of lighting the blue touch paper…

[DiegoDiego]

1 hour ago, The Moonster said:

So one of your employees had a panic attack at work and you want to sack them for it? 

Unsure if you've just worded this poorly but I read all of that and think thank f**k I'm not working for you. 

Yeah, I think I have worded that poorly. The girl who phoned me in a panic I didn't want to get rid of as she was generally decent at her job. It was just an example of a young person whose mental health affected their work.

The girl whose probation I wanted to extend had mental health issues, but I wanted to extend her probation because instead of competing the tasks assigned to her, she preferred to sit on her phone watching TV. Meaning more work for whoever came in after her. I've extended other people's probationary periods for less, but head office told me that I should make her permanent because they were worried about a possible tribunal, claiming her mental health was the reason. I was told "I've been to tribunals. Even if you're completely in the right morally and legally it's not something you want to have to go through. It'll be much easier just to pass her probation."

It should be mentioned that a lot of the young ones are very good indeed. One in particular who also happens to have mental health problems (though she says the structure of work actually helps her) I promoted because (amongst other things) I knew she would push me to be better at my job. She'll likely leave this year when she graduates and it'll be a huge loss.