Depression

[Genuine Hibs Fan]

8 hours ago, anotherchance said:

Struggling a bit.

I’ve coped OK with lockdown and WFH since March, despite it being far from ideal given I stay with the wife in a small two bedroom house. It gets a bit difficult when the wife is off, because she’s in and out of the spare room (my office) and gets nippy when I ask her not to get stuff delivered to the house when I’m here. If I’m honest I resent the fact that she doesn’t “get it” although at the same time I also hate that it’s been imposed on her, especially when she’s off and I’m working.

Everybody in work seems to have a circle jerk about how great it is not to be in the office, but personally the short bus journey in and back is bliss, as it gives me time to sit with my earphones in and chill for half an hour as well as the social aspect of things. I’m getting serious cabin fever (even though I get out a run at lunchtime) and I feel pretty marginalised when others talk about how much it suits them. There’s chat of a blended approach to working post COVID, but I have the fear that I’ll end up the only one there in the office, they’ll say it’s ineffective and it’ll end up being either my spare room or find another job.

I also get nonsense like this in my head when I’m in bed, I get myself wound up and I can’t sleep. It isn’t anything like others have to go through but it has an impact.

I wouldn't minimise this mate, it might not be as bad as some people are putting up with but a situation like that has a slow grinding effect on your mental well-being. I got into the office for the first time since starting a job in August yesterday and the feeling of relief was crazy. It's not about getting more done and being more productive but getting out of the house, especially if you don't have much space, is a godsend. 

One thing I'd say, and that I was doing March-june when I was still enjoying WFH, is try to replicate some of those things you enjoy. Ok, you can't really get on a bus for no reason but take a walk for half an hour before and after work with your earphones in, create that buffer between work and non work. Otherwise it's a bit of a grin and bear it situation, although might be worthwhile to chat to your wife and explain that if she's in while your working it would be great to maybe eat lunch together or something but you need space to concentrate then you are working. Creates another island around work and hopefully is a compromise that won't upset. Apologies if these are unhelpful or already tried but just thinking of what's worked at least a bit for me in the past

Just seen @Dons_1988 already covered a lot of this but bears repeating and might be a useful place to start

Edited November 12, 2020 by Genuine Hibs Fan

[velo army]

I've really enjoyed reading through this thread and seeing the extent to which other forum members both reach out to others with vulnerability and also the extent to which others offer advice and compassion. It's really moving to bear witness to.

I'm part of an organisation called the ManKind Project, which has men's groups all across the country (and in Europe and the US) and, in these times of Covid isolation they have organised online connection groups where men can show up and let themselves be heard. 

I would invite any man on here who feels a desire to be seen, heard and welcomed by other men just as you are, in a space where you can let down your armour for a bit to click on the link below.

https://mankindprojectuki.org/international-mens-day-registration?fbclid=IwAR3ZSdGMFv2-mKl_YYHYB4u5bZHtlWO6BjihDR5wDVabjpwl-4WblrL-tNg

Any further questions on this or any questions you have relating to this, men's mental and emotional health work or anything else not listed then please PM me.

 

Edited November 12, 2020 by velo army

[D.A.F.C]

It is patronising and also kinda dismissive and unhelpful.

Just be happy.

[Hillonearth]

7 hours ago, anotherchance said:

Struggling a bit.

I’ve coped OK with lockdown and WFH since March, despite it being far from ideal given I stay with the wife in a small two bedroom house. It gets a bit difficult when the wife is off, because she’s in and out of the spare room (my office) and gets nippy when I ask her not to get stuff delivered to the house when I’m here. If I’m honest I resent the fact that she doesn’t “get it” although at the same time I also hate that it’s been imposed on her, especially when she’s off and I’m working.

Everybody in work seems to have a circle jerk about how great it is not to be in the office, but personally the short bus journey in and back is bliss, as it gives me time to sit with my earphones in and chill for half an hour as well as the social aspect of things. I’m getting serious cabin fever (even though I get out a run at lunchtime) and I feel pretty marginalised when others talk about how much it suits them. There’s chat of a blended approach to working post COVID, but I have the fear that I’ll end up the only one there in the office, they’ll say it’s ineffective and it’ll end up being either my spare room or find another job.

I also get nonsense like this in my head when I’m in bed, I get myself wound up and I can’t sleep. It isn’t anything like others have to go through but it has an impact.

One thing that's become abundantly clear over the last six months is that everyone is reacting to this differently...in my place we're actively prioritising some time back in the office for those who have indicated they are beginning to struggle whether through lack of a suitable workspace at home, family situation or whatever. Some folk simply NEED it, and I hope your place would be open to something along these lines if you raise it with them.

Any decent employer will have to realise going forward though that one size does not necessarily fit all - the straw polls we've had reveal a really weird split, with maybe 20% keen to go back to the the old paradigm of office work 5 days a week, another 20% wanting to continue almost exclusively WFH, and the majority in the middle seeming to prefer elements of both once a degree of normality returns. It's going to be interesting down the line trying to match those aspirations...I suspect the blended approach of two or three days in the office and the remainder WFH will become the norm for the majority, certainly in my place.

[DA Baracus]

I think working from home since March has saved my life. Not hyperbole there.

I'm absolutely dreading having to go back to working full time in an office and know I'll badly struggle with it. We have to do the odd week in the office at the moment. Hate it.

I have very dark thoughts about it as I feel trapped since I can't afford to quit and far too fat to get a new job (if you think those things don't matter in interviews you're very much mistaken).

It looks like we'll still be working from home for a bit but there's no word yet on what we have to do in the new year. Noises are being made about getting more and more folk back more regularly. It's so infuriating because I don't need to be in the office at. I can do everything I need from home, and have been. 

I submitted a 10 page document a few months ago outlining a case for me becoming a permanent home worker. Management claimed to be receptive at the time, but it's stalled a lot and I get the feeling they've pretty much binned it and will claim HR said no (they said it wasn't their decision and that it was up to HR).

I'm going to ask the management about it soon, and will push them about this. I will take it to HR directly as well.

Just so annoyed that such an easy thing, that being me working from home, that has benefits for all involved, will probably not happen. Just the thought of it gets me massively down. Genuinely can't think how I will face it if/when it happens.

[velo army]

On 08/11/2020 at 23:55, V.Aye.R said:

What are the main signs people display with depression? Ive got a few pals who i suspect but its never more than that. Never a red flag as such.

I live a pretty cushty life but have found 2020 really tough. God knows how less fortunate people are doing.

Dons 1888 has replied with comprehensive wisdom here. I'll add a couple of thoughts.

The isolation many are experiencing will inflate the sense of loneliness they already feel. Even the most introverted person needs interaction. It's as necessary as food or water. We must never, ever forget that. And we need to stop minimising the effects of this denial. Numerous (and some fucking harrowing) studies have been done showing how necessary physical and verbal interaction is to both the developing child and to the developed adult, both in terms of psychology and physical health. We wouldn't gaslight our need for water or food, so addressing loneliness as an urgent fuckin emergency is a start.

In regard to your pals, I'm wondering what your intuition tells you. It sounds like you are concerned for them, certainly. It sounds like moving towards them and reaching out would be beneficial to you both. If someone really wants to work on their shit then it helps to see examples. Rarely will you jump into the water first. If we see that there are people swimming already then we'll go in. In the case of being in a depression, if someone else talks about their struggles first it creates an atmosphere of safety where they're given the signal that it's ok to swim and there are no sharks in the water. So my invitation to you would be to step into your vulnerability and have a go at saying how hard lockdown is for you.

Saying that., being in struggle can often simply be mitigated by the honest and genuinely loving presence of another. Playing a game of online CoD or having a takeaway and easy banter can be every bit as helpful as tackling the issues head on. 

 

 

[V.Aye.R]

Dons 1888 has replied with comprehensive wisdom here. I'll add a couple of thoughts.
The isolation many are experiencing will inflate the sense of loneliness they already feel. Even the most introverted person needs interaction. It's as necessary as food or water. We must never, ever forget that. And we need to stop minimising the effects of this denial. Numerous (and some fucking harrowing) studies have been done showing how necessary physical and verbal interaction is to both the developing child and to the developed adult, both in terms of psychology and physical health. We wouldn't gaslight our need for water or food, so addressing loneliness as an urgent fuckin emergency is a start.
In regard to your pals, I'm wondering what your intuition tells you. It sounds like you are concerned for them, certainly. It sounds like moving towards them and reaching out would be beneficial to you both. If someone really wants to work on their shit then it helps to see examples. Rarely will you jump into the water first. If we see that there are people swimming already then we'll go in. In the case of being in a depression, if someone else talks about their struggles first it creates an atmosphere of safety where they're given the signal that it's ok to swim and there are no sharks in the water. So my invitation to you would be to step into your vulnerability and have a go at saying how hard lockdown is for you.
Saying that., being in struggle can often simply be mitigated by the honest and genuinely loving presence of another. Playing a game of online CoD or having a takeaway and easy banter can be every bit as helpful as tackling the issues head on. 
 
 

Cheers, some good advice and also@Dons_1988

Refreshing to have some small space the internet with folk not just being complete cnuts to each other.

[V.Aye.R]

Sometimes I think its little tells you get from people, they might say things like (often with a beer in them)

"I see all the guys settling down and doing well from themselves"

Its sometimes an illusion to others that they are "behind" their pals etc. The guy in question has a lovely missus, nice house, respectable job. I dont have the same concerns about him that i used to looking back.

Not an expert but society probably doesnt help by encouraging this obsession with your standing and materialism.

I often look at thr cars in the carpark and think jeezo, these folk must be doing ok... In reality they are probably tied to some crazy PCP deal on a car thats worth more than their annual salary and live in a house with negative equity.

[Jacksgranda]

3 minutes ago, V.Aye.R said:

Sometimes I think its little tells you get from people, they might say things like (often with a beer in them)

"I see all the guys settling down and doing well from themselves"

Its sometimes an illusion to others that they are "behind" their pals etc. The guy in question has a lovely missus, nice house, respectable job. I dont have the same concerns about him that i used to looking back.

Not an expert but society probably doesnt help by encouraging this obsession with your standing and materialism.

I often look at thr cars in the carpark and think jeezo, these folk must be doing ok... In reality they are probably tied to some crazy PCP deal on a car thats worth more than their annual salary and live in a house with negative equity.

I often look at the new car(s) sitting in the paved/tarmaced driveways outside the double garage of the brand new two storey mansion with its electronic entrance gates and boundary stone wall and think "Thank heavens I haven't the cost of that hanging over my head".

[velo army]

15 minutes ago, V.Aye.R said:

Sometimes I think its little tells you get from people, they might say things like (often with a beer in them)

"I see all the guys settling down and doing well from themselves"

Its sometimes an illusion to others that they are "behind" their pals etc. The guy in question has a lovely missus, nice house, respectable job. I dont have the same concerns about him that i used to looking back.

Not an expert but society probably doesnt help by encouraging this obsession with your standing and materialism.

I often look at thr cars in the carpark and think jeezo, these folk must be doing ok... In reality they are probably tied to some crazy PCP deal on a car thats worth more than their annual salary and live in a house with negative equity.

Aye Brene Brown (check her out by the way if you haven't already) calls it "scarcity culture" in which we always focus on how we don't have enough and aren't enough. As you pointed out, we're encouraged to aren't we? Advertisements telling us that if we have this new thing we'll be sexy/desirable/a worthy member of society. Contentment puts the breaks on the wheels of commerce.

Something I need to start doing is working on gratitude. I fall into the trap also of believing I'm not educated enough, not muscly enough, too chubby (I'm not, by any metric, but I see what I want to see), not handsome enough, not secure enough etc and it keeps me in a loop of anxiety and sadness. Gratitude is simply choosing to be grateful for what I have and accentuating the positive. It doesn't mean that I have to put up with a malnourishing situation, but if I've rewired my brain to be grateful then I'm more likely to believe I'm strong enough, clever enough etc to improve my situation.

That's the idea, but f**k me I reckon I'd find it easier training to run do an Ironman than doing a 10min gratitude meditation every day. I managed 10mins last night but it's a battle with the inner demon voices.

 

[thistledo]

1 hour ago, velo army said:

Saying that., being in struggle can often simply be mitigated by the honest and genuinely loving presence of another. Playing a game of online CoD or having a takeaway and easy banter can be every bit as helpful as tackling the issues head on.

Sound advice tbh. I spent many hours playing CoD Warzone with a few mates, few beers and having a laugh during lockdown. If it wasn't for this online social aspect I'd certainly be suffering a lot more. 

Usually get out for a fairly long walk at lunchtime and listening to mindfulness type podcasts, sometimes I think I can't fucked with this and sometimes when I'm walking I'm like f**k this. But then I keep walking, keep listening, take my mind away from everything else and by the time I get back I feel so much better for it. 

[Ron Aldo]

Wouldn't go as far as saying I'm depressed but have been feeling pretty down about things recently.

I work in insurance for a fairly small company and its been a bit of a b*****d of a year as a whole. In June we found out that our main work provider had gone tits up and everything was a bit uncertain for a few months.

A few weeks ago we found out that they had a new work contract pretty much finalised but the terms meant less income for the company meaning the possibility of redundancies. A couple of weeks later it was signed off and 5 people (out of about 30) have been made redundant. Fortunately I wasn't one of them and the rest of us have been asked to take a pay cut in order to prevent further redundancies. I've agreed to this (and I understand everyone else has too) as, after an uncertain few months, I was just happy to still have a job.

However, this feeling seems to have worn off over the last few days and I've been feeling pretty low as the realisation has since kicked in that I'm actually now on less than when I started with when I joined the company 3 years ago. It sort of feels like my life has gone backwards or, at best, stood still. I've got more commitments than I had a few years ago (mortgage etc.) but am now having to cover them on a similar salary.

I appreciate this isn't a massive problem in comparison to what a lot of others are dealing with at the moment and, in a way, I do think myself lucky. Just wanted to vent a wee bit and share experience with those who are/have been in a similar situation.

[Hillonearth]

4 hours ago, DA Baracus said:

I think working from home since March has saved my life. Not hyperbole there.

I'm absolutely dreading having to go back to working full time in an office and know I'll badly struggle with it. We have to do the odd week in the office at the moment. Hate it.

I have very dark thoughts about it as I feel trapped since I can't afford to quit and far too fat to get a new job (if you think those things don't matter in interviews you're very much mistaken).

It looks like we'll still be working from home for a bit but there's no word yet on what we have to do in the new year. Noises are being made about getting more and more folk back more regularly. It's so infuriating because I don't need to be in the office at. I can do everything I need from home, and have been. 

I submitted a 10 page document a few months ago outlining a case for me becoming a permanent home worker. Management claimed to be receptive at the time, but it's stalled a lot and I get the feeling they've pretty much binned it and will claim HR said no (they said it wasn't their decision and that it was up to HR).

I'm going to ask the management about it soon, and will push them about this. I will take it to HR directly as well.

Just so annoyed that such an easy thing, that being me working from home, that has benefits for all involved, will probably not happen. Just the thought of it gets me massively down. Genuinely can't think how I will face it if/when it happens.

And that's the other side of the coin from the earlier post on the subject, and exactly why I was saying employers will have to show a bit of nuance once this is over and done with. When we canvassed people with their views on the subject, it was because we were under the impression that a significant proportion of people were desperate to get back to office working ASAP, which turned out not really to be the case at all...it turned out that the ones that were had just been a bit more vocal about it, to the point where we were able to accommodate those wanting to come back fairly easily. In a couple of cases it even transpired that after being back in for a few days people were happy to go back to WFH once they were secure in their own minds that what they left in March wasn't exactly what they were going back into in July.

I suspect down the line most offices will have more of a half-empty Friday afternoon vibe about them all week. After a year of a workforce proving it CAN work from home, it'll be almost impossible for most reasonable employers to put the genie back in the bottle and mandate five days a week in the office.

 

[D.A.F.C]

Bit fucked off recently and its mostly down to you know what.
If there's one positive thing to come out of that and my outburst on heads gone its the realisation that I'm letting a few arseholes change my entire view on life.
Ten years of it, feel trapped and helpless but also know its down to me.
Feel a bit silly to rant at strangers and I think I'm applying a toxic situation to everything and lashing out.
There is good people out there as seen on this thread. Finding a way to cope but look for a longer term solution is the way forward.
As an example today was expected to work miracles, didn't even have tools or support but instead of help I got made a fool out of by people who can't do it with the support and equipment.
Sometimes its takes a situation to get so extreme that you just think this really isn't about me, its just madness.

[D.A.F.C]

I think working from home since March has saved my life. Not hyperbole there.
I'm absolutely dreading having to go back to working full time in an office and know I'll badly struggle with it. We have to do the odd week in the office at the moment. Hate it.
I have very dark thoughts about it as I feel trapped since I can't afford to quit and far too fat to get a new job (if you think those things don't matter in interviews you're very much mistaken).
It looks like we'll still be working from home for a bit but there's no word yet on what we have to do in the new year. Noises are being made about getting more and more folk back more regularly. It's so infuriating because I don't need to be in the office at. I can do everything I need from home, and have been. 
I submitted a 10 page document a few months ago outlining a case for me becoming a permanent home worker. Management claimed to be receptive at the time, but it's stalled a lot and I get the feeling they've pretty much binned it and will claim HR said no (they said it wasn't their decision and that it was up to HR).
I'm going to ask the management about it soon, and will push them about this. I will take it to HR directly as well.
Just so annoyed that such an easy thing, that being me working from home, that has benefits for all involved, will probably not happen. Just the thought of it gets me massively down. Genuinely can't think how I will face it if/when it happens.

Hi, i know we have had arguments and disagreements but if you really feel that being fat is holding you back I can help you with that and advise. I lost two stone and kept it off a few years back. Even if its accountability and motivation.
Cant tell you how much exercise helped me, probably saved my life and has helped me meet others as well.
Pretty sure there's others on here who would help as well. Perhaps get a group together and help each other with motivation and tips??

[Thistle_do_nicely]

had a wee breakdown at work (from home, I guess) - partner has been vomiting and suffering severe stomach pains, has barely eaten anything and lost a horrifying amount of weight. She started feeling a bit better a few days ago (this has been dragging on for weeks now) and stopped being sick with her anti-emetics, even managing to hold down some food but she started being ill again this morning.

after my lunch break i started getting... like, visions of moments from happier days in our relationship and I couldnt stop crying for a few minutes. once it was out my system i was fine to carry on. I'd let my manager know yesterday and they were great about it, didnt let anyone at my work know i broke down a bit the day though, I don't think I'm needing time off tbh but still, the weekend cant come soon enough. it just all got to me in a bad way.

All her blood/urine test results came back negative for whatever they tested her for and she's on a waiting list for an endoscopy. Which at the moment going by the letter she got said could be a long fucking time.

kitchen ended up an absolute state, managed to gut it a bit yesterday before the bins went out thankfully so all the rubbish is sorted and the dishes aren't piling up.

Just venting - feels a little bit better to put it in words to get me thinking and confronting it, but it's all so terrifying. 

Edited November 12, 2020 by Thistle_do_nicely

[NotThePars]

15 minutes ago, D.A.F.C said:

Finding a way to cope but look for a longer term solution is the way forward.

What practical steps are you taking or what help have you sought?

[D.A.F.C]

What practical steps are you taking or what help have you sought?

Just looking for roles online tbh its that bad that when I come home I need to exercise to forget about it then before I know it its 9pm and I just want to chill out.
Really should have done something during lockdown. Trapped in a cycle.
As for help I dont know where to start. Also feel like my problem is a bit trivial but also need to seek advice.
I just need a positive environment for a few months to reset myself.

[The_Kincardine]

8 minutes ago, D.A.F.C said:

Bit fucked off recently and its mostly down to you know what.
If there's one positive thing to come out of that and my outburst on heads gone its the realisation that I'm letting a few arseholes change my entire view on life.
Ten years of it, feel trapped and helpless but also know its down to me.
Feel a bit silly to rant at strangers and I think I'm applying a toxic situation to everything and lashing out.
There is good people out there as seen on this thread. Finding a way to cope but look for a longer term solution is the way forward.
As an example today was expected to work miracles, didn't even have tools or support but instead of help I got made a fool out of by people who can't do it with the support and equipment.
Sometimes its takes a situation to get so extreme that you just think this really isn't about me, its just madness.

Chin up, buddy.  You join a long line of posters who have had a good pitch-forking.  Sometimes deserved and sometimes unwarranted.

What I've said to others in your situation - and there have been a few - is simple:  Stick to posting about your club and chipping in on the non-contentious GN threads.and you'll see that the forum has a lot of decent blokes posting on here and you'll be a welcome contributor.

You should also avoid conflating your P&B situation with what's going on at work as the two are very different.  I'd suggest 1. Take a moment. 2, Get Heads Gone out of your system 3. Assess your work situation in isolation.

If your job is getting on top of you then, of course, post about it as lots of blokes feel the same right now.  Many will help you.

[NotThePars]

3 minutes ago, D.A.F.C said:

Just looking for roles online tbh its that bad that when I come home I need to exercise to forget about it then before I know it its 9pm and I just want to chill out.
Really should have done something during lockdown. Trapped in a cycle.
As for help I dont know where to start. Also feel like my problem is a bit trivial but also need to seek advice.
I just need a positive environment for a few months to reset myself.

I think you've said before that your work pays you well enough and it's been a factor in you staying there.

Can you afford to see a private therapist? 

Have you spoken to a GP?

I'm only asking cause I don't want to offer advice that you've already taken. I have been on and off SSRIs myself and didn't see that much of a change after a while or it brought on new issues but they have been, for me for a time and for many people in general, a life changer. I'm doing therapy atm roughly once every 2-3 weeks and I'm finding it really helpful. I did CBT first which wasn't for me but again can be a game changer and am currently doing psychotherapy which is great for drilling down into yourself and helping to see things clearer.

Even the patronising shite that clueless folks tell you like exercise or going for a walk etc can be really helpful I find when done in conjunction with stuff like this.