Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[Handsome_Devil]

9 minutes ago, Al B said:

A good mate of mine is a Hibee, and in any of our conversations about Ross and Alexander we always just seemed to be saying the exact same things.

I didn't like us renewing Alexander when we did given his history but the little bit of optimism I had said maybe he's learned from three identical sackings...nope.

Despite their cash, Hibs have no more top three finishes in the modern era than us and Ross got them their first in 16 years along with three cup finals. That has to be respected regardless of how it ended.

Size 72 IF in contrast to GA he has learned from how it ended and is willing to risk a little expansion after solidifying things there's little doubt he's a good appointment (assuming United a comic aberration on both sides).

That if is impossible for us outsiders to know but you'd say it's rarer for a manager to adapt like that than just be themselves - it's why so many have limited shelf lives after being the next big thing. 

Edited February 16, 2023 by Handsome_Devil

[thisGRAEME]

11 minutes ago, Al B said:

A good mate of mine is a Hibee, and in any of our conversations about Ross and Alexander we always just seemed to be saying the exact same things.

Ross' team was not perfect, but I think the internal machinations of the club ultimately did for him. They've gone through a power of staff.

I think it's on record (somewhere) that Ron Gordon admitted he made a mistake in emptying Ross.

FWIW; I do think, and have always thought, that Ross is a good manager. United and Alloa aside, which I'm willing to overlook for the context of them both, he's had a win rate around 50%, which is... pretty good? Drew too many at Sunderland, didn't win enough 'big games' at Hibernian, arguably, smashed the championship to bits with his St. Mirren side.

Good manager.

 

[YassinMoutaouakil]

Max Johnston was 6 when Jutkiewicz scored against Hibs. 

Cheers.

[Al B]

1 minute ago, thisGRAEME said:

Ross' team was not perfect, but I think the internal machinations of the club ultimately did for him. They've gone through a power of staff.

I think it's on record (somewhere) that Ron Gordon admitted he made a mistake in emptying Ross.

FWIW; I do think, and have always thought, that Ross is a good manager. United and Alloa aside, which I'm willing to overlook for the context of them both, he's had a win rate around 50%, which is... pretty good? Drew too many at Sunderland, didn't win enough 'big games' at Hibernian, arguably, smashed the championship to bits with his St. Mirren side.

Good manager.

 

I'll be the first to admit I don't really pay a huge amount of attention to other teams so I don't really know much about Jack Ross or have an opinion on him either way. All I know is that a lot of the things I was complaining about with GA, my mate was saying very similar things about his side under Ross. I fully expect that the expectations of the Hibs support and what they'd deem acceptable would be very different from ours though.

[thisGRAEME]

1 minute ago, YassinMoutaouakil said:

Max Johnston was 6 when Jutkiewicz scored against Hibs. 

Cheers.

Reported this post for making me feel terrible about life. This is cyberbullying.

[Ludo*1]

56 minutes ago, Swello said:

Going from someone with zero managerial experience to someone who would join the 1000 game club while with us is quite a reaction

That's straight from the Mark McGhee chat. He loved going on about the 1000 game thing.

[CoF]

29 minutes ago, Al B said:

A good mate of mine is a Hibee, and in any of our conversations about Ross and Alexander we always just seemed to be saying the exact same things.

ASOS / waffling shite / tombola ? 

[Swello]

5 minutes ago, Ludo*1 said:

That's straight from the Mark McGhee chat. He loved going on about the 1000 game thing.

I was painfully aware of that as I typed it out - Holloway would be bottom of the list for me.

[thisGRAEME]

Just now, Al B said:

I fully expect that the expectations of the Hibs support and what they'd deem acceptable would be very different from ours though.

It's what comes with them not coming from a football town, frankly.

I would say; He lost a cup semi, and a cup final to St. Johnstone, which was not good, but did get them to finish 3rd, which was good.

He was emptied after going on a run where he'd lost quite a few in a row, but from memory, it was a run where players as individuals did a whole manner of fuckin stupid shit, red cards and all sorts. They'd also just absolutely leathered Rangers 3-1 in a semi final. All in all, do I think Hibs would be a better side now if they'd held on to him? Probably, aye. Is he good enough for us? I'd say his experience with St. Mirren and getting them out of a relegation scrap might be invaluable, and he has the potential to make us actually decent. 

Also has the potential to be a Dundee United-esque catastrophe if the dressing room turns on him, but that's basically the risk we'll take with everyone, we don't hire slam dunks. 

[wellboy1991]

Am I the only one who just isn’t feeling the Holloway idea. 
 

Experience yes, but not in the Scottish game. 
 

I appreciate his whole personality thing but tbh is that just going to be a gimmick and before you know it we are down…. He strolls back down south and we are left to pick up the pieces. 
 

Something for me just doesn’t fit. 
 

edit to add - just looked at his Grimsby time, nah deck that. Don’t want him anywhere near the club. Left it a shambles seemingly. Bloated squad lacking in quality and recruitment was awful. 

Edited February 16, 2023 by wellboy1991

[RostokMcSpoons]

It was only yesterday I was bemoaning the fact we'd probably have to find some sort of left-field up-and-comer.... Ian Holloway is rather a pleasant surprise as a contender.   All of 'em tbh.

@Handsome Devil why are you wary of IH ?

 

[Antiochas III]

5 minutes ago, wellboy1991 said:

 

Experience yes, but not in the Scottish game. 
 

Never really got this way of thinking.  Why does it matter if he knows the Scottish game?  Not like we need him to sign players from our rivals...

[dezz]

Not that I’ve followed his career particularly closely, but I’ve never quite figured out if Holloway has a reputation/is well known because he’s actually a decent manager or whether it’s just because he’s a peculiar wee guy with a funny accent. 
I don’t think I want to take the risk finding out in our current predicament. I’d be on board with either McCann or Ross, both feel like Motherwell appointments given our hiring history. 

Edited February 16, 2023 by dezz

[RandomGuy.]

45 minutes ago, CoF said:

Can someone remind me again why Hibs sacked Ross? Thought it was mental at the time and looking at his record it still seems mental. 

Genuinely think them losing to us in both cups in our double season turned most of their fans against him.

Beat us and its just Livi in their way of a double.

[wellboy1991]

6 minutes ago, Antiochas III said:

Never really got this way of thinking.  Why does it matter if he knows the Scottish game?  Not like we need him to sign players from our rivals...

It’s generally quite important to understand the league you are in. Fresh ideas at the start of season and time to learn would be fine. However not in the position we are in. Again just my opinion. 

[Desp]

Grant McCann very much fits the profile of an Alan Burrows-style Motherwell Manager.  I don't think he'll get it this time.

Jack Ross, I believe, is a shoe-in for the gig providing we're able to agree terms on his contract.

I've half jokingly wanted Holloway as our manager for about a decade, pretty much for his patter alone.  No doubt he worked miracles at Blackpool, and has done decent jobs at Palace, QPR and Bristol Rovers in his time, but it's probably the best part of a decade since he achieved success anywhere.  I can see Holloway impressing the old boys on the interview panel with his chat and a few stories.  Ideal scenario is Holloway comes in, we stay up, and he leaves as a cult hero to head back down the road in the summer (we then appoint Grant McCann...).

[Les Cabbage]

Part of the problem with Ross at Hibs was that the fans never really liked him, he’s just not a very likeable guy on the face of it and he really doesn’t have much of a personality, a lot of our support felt he’s hard to really take to as a guy so when things stop going well he gets jumped on, the polar opposite of our current manager I suppose as he’s hard to take to as he has too much personality.

Anyhow, finished 7th in his first season which to be fair was partly caused by Heckingbottom but some proper shite results cost us the top 6, losing to the worst Hearts team ever 3-1 at home is the main one that sticks in the memory. Aye, the season was curtailed due to covid but we’d just lost to Hearts and Aberdeen before the break and bottom six was where we were headed.

The second season he had was his only real period of success and I do think it is a bit overstated, we finished 3rd, beating off competition from an Aberdeen side that went 10(?) games without scoring a goal with only 2 games to spare however you can only beat who you’re up against and it was a good season overall, however the fact we were the only team to lose 3 games at Hampden*in one season and none of them to the old firm was pretty unforgivable to many, not just cause of the results but the nature in which we folded at the big occasion.

* Notwithstanding Queens Park etc etc

He was sacked in the 3rd season he had with us IIRC in 8th, and we were rank rotten and that was with him having the likes of Boyle, Nisbet etc totally fit but unable to get anything out of them, think we lost something like 6 in 9 with only one win and we were in freefall before he was emptied, probably looked harsh from the outside looking in but from the inside it was the right choice, just a shame who we appointed after.

The other thing was that the football style was pretty rubbish too, although in fairness to him, the season we were at our best, no one was in the grounds and everyone was at home raging because they weren’t allowed to go anywhere apart from Tesco so you’re obviously gonna enjoy football less when you’re locked in your house fed up.

There was also the big game bottle merchant stick that we had to beat him with, his only victory against the old firm (including Celtics banter covid year) was the cup semi against Rangers and he won I think just once out of 5 games against Hearts, which isn’t very un-Hibs like on the face of but but this was when they they were at their Stendl/Levein etc banter era, aswell as losing twice to St Johnstone at Hampden.

So to conclude, he’ll probably do fine if he gets the job, not amazing, not awful but fine, League stability, relegation free, no cup wins, no europe but fine, however I thought the same when he went to Dundee Utd and he did not do fine.

Hope it’s Holloway though for the laughs.

[GreenGray]

58 minutes ago, CoF said:

Can someone remind me again why Hibs sacked Ross? Thought it was mental at the time and looking at his record it still seems mental. 

Fan pressure mainly. The cup final against St Johnstone was the final straw for a lot of hibs fans.

His next bad run after that was always going to see him off and it was a very poor run.

Granted he wasn’t exactly helped that summer transfer window following the final.

[supermarv]

Heard some small rumours of us going the DoF route nowadays. 
 

So hear me out… Ian Holloway comes in keeps us up as well as having an absolute jolly of a time, keep Kettlewell as a coach to Holloway (he gets the job in the summer and Holloway the new Director of Football.

[RostokMcSpoons]

1 hour ago, YassinMoutaouakil said:

Max Johnston was 6 when Jutkiewicz scored against Hibs. 

Cheers.