WoSFL Premier Division thread

[Big Davy Boy]

how long can cliftonhill continue for - does there main stand get any work done on it as the rest of the grounds clised i think

[Burnieman]

On the subject of SFA/Govt assistance to upgrade grounds owned by clubs, I guess part of the problem has been decades of certain clubs spending big on players whilst fans piss against a wall and get rained on.   Should the taxpayer bail them out if the ground needs upgraded?  

SFA Licencing has forced some clubs down the road of having to think about it, but there are grounds that are so far gone only starting afresh elsewhere would solve the issue if a club wants licenced.

The Highland League is an example of clubs investing in facilties over decades.  The Junior game never followed suit.

[Shanner]

Just now, Burnieman said:

On the subject of SFA/Govt assistance to upgrade grounds owned by clubs, I guess part of the problem has been decades of certain clubs spending big on players whilst fans piss against a wall and get rained on.   Should the taxpayer bail them out if the ground needs upgraded?  

SFA Licencing has forced some clubs down the road of having to think about it, but there are grounds that are so far gone only starting afresh elsewhere would solve the issue if a club wants licenced.

The Highland League is an example of clubs investing in facilties over decades.  The Junior game never followed suit.

the junior game contained a larger variety of teams than the HL (which is basically a division) so I'm not sure it's fair to characterize this as a one-size-fits-all Juniors Bad thing.

[Burnieman]

5 minutes ago, Shanner said:

the junior game contained a larger variety of teams than the HL (which is basically a division) so I'm not sure it's fair to characterize this as a one-size-fits-all Juniors Bad thing.

C'mon for generations there was zero money put into Junior grounds when compared to level of spending on players, with only a few exceptions.

100% of HL have seats and lights and was even a requirement to join I believe.  What percentage on Junior grounds upto the move to senior football had match lights and seats. 5% if I'm generous.

[FairWeatherFan]

10 minutes ago, Shanner said:

the junior game contained a larger variety of teams than the HL (which is basically a division) so I'm not sure it's fair to characterize this as a one-size-fits-all Juniors Bad thing.

And the 3 Regions usually imposed ground standards for their top division. Just as the WoSFL does now.

Yet none of them did so with any teeth to be meaningful.

[GordonS]

2 hours ago, An Absolute Imposter said:

As we know governments in these isles pay lip service to sport and recreation, so don't look to them for any assistance.

At a time of insanely tight budgets and huge cuts, for Scottish or local government to spend money on facilities for a few hundred folk to watch a game of football every two weeks would be batshit mental. They can't fund schools, community centres, ice rinks and swimming pools never mind our particular hobby. What we do isn't sport, it's spectating.

There has been grant money available for community facilities - putting in astro and lights and making it available all week, like Bo'ness did. You need a genuine community benefit and not just some terracing for the likes of us. https://www.falkirk.gov.uk/news/article.aspx?aid=7715#:~:text=This is the second Place,the whole Bo'ness community. 

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

20 minutes ago, GordonS said:

At a time of insanely tight budgets and huge cuts, for Scottish or local government to spend money on facilities for a few hundred folk to watch a game of football every two weeks would be batshit mental. They can't fund schools, community centres, ice rinks and swimming pools never mind our particular hobby. What we do isn't sport, it's spectating.

There has been grant money available for community facilities - putting in astro and lights and making it available all week, like Bo'ness did. You need a genuine community benefit and not just some terracing for the likes of us. https://www.falkirk.gov.uk/news/article.aspx?aid=7715#:~:text=This is the second Place,the whole Bo'ness community. 

Some of the money they are spunking away is far worse used than improving community sporting venues. You only have to look at the success of clubs with good all weather parks ability to become a community asset to see how any penny spent on sports facilities to improve participation and integration is money well spent. 

[GordonS]

30 minutes ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Some of the money they are spunking away is far worse used than improving community sporting venues. You only have to look at the success of clubs with good all weather parks ability to become a community asset to see how any penny spent on sports facilities to improve participation and integration is money well spent. 

That's the same point I made. There's money for facilities where people can play football and for other community benefits, like at Bo'ness, but the discussion on this thread has been about the facilities for fans. 3G cages suit the community just fine. 

When you're talking about spending of £50 billion you'll always be able to point the finger at something wasteful, but the reality is it adds up to very little now. The media does a truly dreadful job painting an accurate picture of public spending.

Edited April 25 by GordonS

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

23 minutes ago, GordonS said:

That's the same point I made. There's money for facilities where people can play football and for other community benefits, like at Bo'ness, but the discussion on this thread has been about the facilities for fans. 3G cages suit the community just fine. 

When you're talking about spending of £50 billion you'll always be able to point the finger at something wasteful, but the reality is it adds up to very little now. The media does a truly dreadful job painting an accurate picture of public spending.

Given the mental health crisis in this country and the way isolation emboldened it during lock down (and the fact we’ve not recovered) anything which gets people engaging, whether through participating, volunteering and spectating is removing isolation for even a short time. Consider clubs at our level are for the most part in areas of deprivation then its an even more important case. We fund the arts for spectating, festivals, art shows, music etc and i think considering the needs of sports consumers/spectators is equally important. Its part of our heritage, ingrained in our culture and vital for our communities. 

[An Absolute Imposter]

22 minutes ago, GordonS said:

That's the same point I made. There's money for facilities where people can play football and for other community benefits, like at Bo'ness, but the discussion on this thread has been about the facilities for fans. 3G cages suit the community just fine. 

When you're talking about spending of £50 billion you'll always be able to point the finger at something wasteful, but the reality is it adds up to very little now. The media does a truly dreadful job painting an accurate picture of public spending.

There are a few good examples in East Dunbartonshire of locally funded facilities that cost whatever they cost and are either under utilised or in one case not used to its capacity.

One us Huntershill, which even when it was being built there was enough voices telling the council it was not fit for purpose, the other is in Kirkie which is virtually lying empty.

Both of these could have been setup for multiple sport use not just football with some basic decent spectator facilities.

Petershill in Glasgow is a good facility with decent spectator facilities, do not know if any sports outside football have access to it.

A little joined up thinking wouldn't go amiss and as we are aware our leaders are world class as wasting money building these centres that do not meet the needs of locals.

But it's not just councils an governments, there are enough entrepreneurial  business people around who could invest in infrastructure. But would rather spend their money on vanity projects at small clubs and then bugger off when they get bored.

[Shanner]

5 hours ago, Burnieman said:

C'mon for generations there was zero money put into Junior grounds when compared to level of spending on players, with only a few exceptions.

100% of HL have seats and lights and was even a requirement to join I believe.  What percentage on Junior grounds upto the move to senior football had match lights and seats. 5% if I'm generous.

 Buckie Thistle found wanting and making a mockery of the playoff system today though. 

[Burnieman]

Just now, Shanner said:

 Buckie Thistle found wanting and making a mockery of the playoff system today though. 

Which has nothing to do with the standard of their ground 

[Shanner]

Just now, Burnieman said:

Which has nothing to do with the standard of their ground 

Ah that's grand then. Juniors bad. 

[Burnieman]

3 minutes ago, Shanner said:

Ah that's grand then. Juniors bad. 

WTF are you on about?

[PossilYM]

42 minutes ago, Shanner said:

 Buckie Thistle found wanting and making a mockery of the playoff system today though. 

Pyramid coming apart at the seams 

[Shanner]

10 minutes ago, PossilYM said:

Pyramid coming apart at the seams 

I don't bother my arse with the HL most of the time but is this because most of them don't fancy traveling beyond their traditional area?

I know the Pyramid bros like to make out that nobody minds 600 mile round trips for league matches but it seems like an argument for regionalization of League 2 to me. 

[PollokGang]

17 minutes ago, Shanner said:

I don't bother my arse with the HL most of the time but is this because most of them don't fancy traveling beyond their traditional area?

I know the Pyramid bros like to make out that nobody minds 600 mile round trips for league matches but it seems like an argument for regionalization of League 2 to me. 

In a country of Scotland’s size there is zero need for 4 national leagues. Two. Three at most. 

[clansman]

The Highland League Clubs all expressed a problem with this newly brought in requirement as it is obviously more difficult to get a doctor to attend matches in rural areas.

[southerner]

1 hour ago, PollokGang said:

In a country of Scotland’s size there is zero need for 4 national leagues. Two. Three at most. 

Agree and disagree at the same time with you and find your point to be very central belt biased as you will get to the majority of the venues around 1.5 hours, with the odd exception. I think we need three top leagues of around 12 teams and 2 regional tier 4 leagues to stop the Stranraer v Elgin situation which lots of clubs in tier 5 and below won’t find appealing or affordable.

[Thejackdaw]

Have been told by a decent source that buckie have put barriers in place themselves to deny them this play off and serious travel issues if they ' won ' .

Still think that the west of Scotland champions ( as its only theres to lose)in Talbot this season won't want to pretty much go up to the LL just like buckie don't want foreign territory.