spud131 Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 Most low/alcohol free beers actual taste quite decent and you'd be hard pushed to tell the difference in a blind taste test. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 Not liking rugby: fine Laughing at the significant number of rugby fans who simultaneously have a baseless superiority complex and massive chip on their shoulders about football: very enjoyable Having those views about rugby while liking American football: you're for the watching 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miguel Sanchez Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 (edited) Dunning1874's new avatar. Ed - I'm so thrown by this I don't even know what thread I'm in. Change back immediately. Edited February 8, 2021 by Miguel Sanchez 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 1 hour ago, Miguel Sanchez said: Dunning1874's new avatar. Ed - I'm so thrown by this I don't even know what thread I'm in. Change back immediately. Your tone is antagonistic and you're making me very angry. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgecutter Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 (edited) We have no free will. How we act at any given time is just the result of whatever the atoms etc in our brain have been doing immediately beforehand (much like the ever changing weather being controlled by the wider physical world). This is not to be confused with our actions being 'predetermined' in a way that there has been some sort of 'plan' set out for us in advance, just more of a chain reaction of chemistry/physics that we don't have the ability to consciously change. As such, if you're going to end up in jail for being a homicidal maniac, then there's nothing that the soulless complex physical object (that is you) can do to stop it. Basically, we have just as much influence over our future as a rock does over its own. Edited February 12, 2021 by Hedgecutter 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbaxters Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 8 minutes ago, Hedgecutter said: We have no free will. How we act at any given time is just the result of whatever the atoms etc in our brain have been doing immediately beforehand (much like the ever changing weather being controlled by the wider physical world). This is not to be confused with our actions being 'predetermined' in a way that there has been some sort of 'plan' set out for us in advance, just more of a chain reaction of chemistry/physics that we don't have the ability to consciously change. As such, if you're going to end up in jail for being a homicidal maniac, then there's nothing that the soulless complex physical object (that is you) can do to stop it. Basically, we have the same influence over our actions as a rock does over its own future. Sorry but... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 10 minutes ago, Hedgecutter said: We have no free will. How we act at any given time is just the result of whatever the atoms etc in our brain have been doing immediately beforehand (much like the ever changing weather being controlled by the wider physical world). This is not to be confused with our actions being 'predetermined' in a way that there has been some sort of 'plan' set out for us in advance, just more of a chain reaction of chemistry/physics that we don't have the ability to consciously change. As such, if you're going to end up in jail for being a homicidal maniac, then there's nothing that the soulless complex physical object (that is you) can do to stop it. Basically, we have just as much influence over our future actions as a rock does over its own. This is the galaxy brain version of "it wasn't me". 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgecutter Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, BFTD said: 14 minutes ago, jimbaxters said: Sorry but... ^^^ Libertarian found 9 minutes ago, BFTD said: This is the galaxy brain version of "it wasn't me". I believe it's referred to as 'hard determinism'. Edited February 12, 2021 by Hedgecutter 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19QOS19 Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 We have no free will. How we act at any given time is just the result of whatever the atoms etc in our brain have been doing immediately beforehand (much like the ever changing weather being controlled by the wider physical world). This is not to be confused with our actions being 'predetermined' in a way that there has been some sort of 'plan' set out for us in advance, just more of a chain reaction of chemistry/physics that we don't have the ability to consciously change. As such, if you're going to end up in jail for being a homicidal maniac, then there's nothing that the soulless complex physical object (that is you) can do to stop it. Basically, we have just as much influence over our future as a rock does over its own.You ventured down the YouTube rabbit hole as well? Stumbled upon something last week about the guy who claimed this after doing research. Makes a lot of sense tbh. Tl;dr, you're brain starts the process before you even think about it. An example was an itch. You're brain has already started the process of scratching it before you had a conscientious thought to do it. Obviously I believe we do have free will but the argument he was making is that technically we don't. It's certainly the argument I'll be using to defend myself after I commit my first murder. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgecutter Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 13 minutes ago, 19QOS19 said: You ventured down the YouTube rabbit hole as well? Stumbled upon something last week about the guy who claimed this after doing research. Makes a lot of sense tbh. Tl;dr, you're brain starts the process before you even think about it. An example was an itch. You're brain has already started the process of scratching it before you had a conscientious thought to do it. Obviously I believe we do have free will but the argument he was making is that technically we don't. It's certainly the argument I'll be using to defend myself after I commit my first murder. You're a soft determinist. FWIW, I have indeed seen some YouTube videos on it but it's something that niggled me for years earlier, which I looked up elsewhere. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coprolite Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 37 minutes ago, Hedgecutter said: We have no free will. How we act at any given time is just the result of whatever the atoms etc in our brain have been doing immediately beforehand (much like the ever changing weather being controlled by the wider physical world). This is not to be confused with our actions being 'predetermined' in a way that there has been some sort of 'plan' set out for us in advance, just more of a chain reaction of chemistry/physics that we don't have the ability to consciously change. As such, if you're going to end up in jail for being a homicidal maniac, then there's nothing that the soulless complex physical object (that is you) can do to stop it. Basically, we have just as much influence over our future as a rock does over its own. Overly reductivist imo. Another way to look at it is your free will is made up of and expressed through biochemistry. The biochemical interactions in your brain make up who you are. Free will only doesn't exist if you expect there to be a non-biological agent (a soul) to have and enact it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trackdaybob Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 YouTube videos -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19QOS19 Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 You're a soft determinist. [emoji6] FWIW, I have indeed seen some YouTube videos on it but it's something that niggled me for years earlier, which I looked up elsewhere. I don't even know what the video was about. It wasn't like I clicked on it specifically talking about freewill, it just came on as part of the segment 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dons_1988 Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 Is this not just a round about way of saying the brain controls the body? As I think we already knew that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eindhovendee Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 1 hour ago, Hedgecutter said: We have no free will. How we act at any given time is just the result of whatever the atoms etc in our brain have been doing immediately beforehand (much like the ever changing weather being controlled by the wider physical world). This is not to be confused with our actions being 'predetermined' in a way that there has been some sort of 'plan' set out for us in advance, just more of a chain reaction of chemistry/physics that we don't have the ability to consciously change. As such, if you're going to end up in jail for being a homicidal maniac, then there's nothing that the soulless complex physical object (that is you) can do to stop it. Basically, we have just as much influence over our future as a rock does over its own. I love Bill Bryson's introduction to A Short history Of Nearly Everything. https://www.pdfdrive.com/a-short-history-of-nearly-everything-e162373604.html It doesn't attempt to explain freewill or anything really but if everything was pre-determined wouldn't that be even more of a puzzle as to why (its a pretty big question already). Snipped a bit of it here. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TheJTS98 Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 2 hours ago, Hedgecutter said: We have no free will. How we act at any given time is just the result of whatever the atoms etc in our brain have been doing immediately beforehand (much like the ever changing weather being controlled by the wider physical world). This is not to be confused with our actions being 'predetermined' in a way that there has been some sort of 'plan' set out for us in advance, just more of a chain reaction of chemistry/physics that we don't have the ability to consciously change. As such, if you're going to end up in jail for being a homicidal maniac, then there's nothing that the soulless complex physical object (that is you) can do to stop it. Basically, we have just as much influence over our future as a rock does over its own. I think this is perfectly reasonable. We have the illusion of free will, but I don't see any way in which we can accurately be said to have free will. This article points out some of the negatives of removing that idea. But there are positives too. Some people in the world are born with no chance, but the acceptance of the notion of free will and people's ability to battle against their genes, their situation of birth, and their natural talents and short-comings leads to people accepting blame and feeling guilt for things they never really had the chance to change. https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2016/06/theres-no-such-thing-as-free-will/480750/ Anyway, 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon EF Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 Depends what you define free will as. If you define it as something completely independent of any physical or biological process then of course we don't have that as everything we are is physical/biological. I'd say actions don't need to be non-physical or unrelated to the current state of your brain to be described as free will. Just because you might make exactly the same decisions faced with exactly the same circumstances, doesn't mean it's not free will. Also, I'm not sure we can know that's the case. There could well be random processes in your brain that would result in different choices when faced with the same exact circumstances. Would that make your will any more or less 'free'? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgecutter Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 3 minutes ago, Gordon EF said: Depends what you define free will as. If you define it as something completely independent of any physical or biological process then of course we don't have that as everything we are is physical/biological. I'd say actions don't need to be non-physical or unrelated to the current state of your brain to be described as free will. Just because you might make exactly the same decisions faced with exactly the same circumstances, doesn't mean it's not free will. Also, I'm not sure we can know that's the case. There could well be random processes in your brain that would result in different choices when faced with the same exact circumstances. Would that make your will any more or less 'free'? From a personal perspective, I see free-will as the perception that if history was to be repeated then there could be a different outcome if our minds fancied there to be one. For me, we'd have the same outcome every single time, assuming there would be no Back to the Future-type extra knowledge that would obviously be an influential factor However, the big question I'm asking myself just now is why I decided to put pickle on today's cheese roll when I had just cheese yesterday. Same cheese, same pack of rolls. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon EF Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 3 minutes ago, Hedgecutter said: From a personal perspective, I see free-will as the perception that if history was to be repeated then there could be a different outcome if our minds fancied there to be one. For me, we'd have the same outcome every single time, assuming there would be no Back to the Future-type extra knowledge that would obviously be an influential factor However, the big question I'm asking myself just now is why I decided to put pickle on today's cheese roll when I had just cheese yesterday. Same cheese, same pack of rolls. Self-perpetuating loop. Yesterday's roll was too bland so your brain entered a state of wanting something a bit tangier today. Today will have been a bit much so it'll want something a bit safer. Repeat ad infinitum. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trackdaybob Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 YouTube videos 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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