When will indyref2 happen?

[SandyCromarty]

33 minutes ago, Paco said:

How the hell are you guys all going down the route of referenda made and carried out by Scotland, UDI etc and not even managing to mention Catalonia?

Such a thing would be roundly ignored by the international community. The very last thing the EU with a strained relationship with London need is to be seen to be breaking up the UK. The US will prioritise the upcoming rip-off trade deal and will do nothing to jeopardise it, if they even notice or care. Russia will be all over it and that’s about it.

Not fair but entirely true. If the world doesn’t care enough to do a thing about Hong Kong, a genuinely major trade hub, it certainly doesn’t care about Scotland.

A referendum absolutely has to be backed up by something like the Edinburgh Agreement or it’ll be ignored by essentially everyone, including many in Scotland.

As far as I can recall not one Nationalist on here has called for UDI, it has always been suggested by the unionists to create division and argument.

I posted an explanation on Catalonia a page back, by some member EU states Catalonia is viewed as a Spanish region not a country, prior to 1707 Scotland was an Independent Sovereign state, it is now a country, recognised as such worldwide, within a UK framework.

The EU has repeatedly declared that as far as Catalonia is concerned they will not interfere in Spanish internal affairs. As far as I know Catalonia was never a sovereign nation and initially it was part of the Kingdom of Aragon. However I would back their determination to separate from Spain.

Hong Kong is part of China, it was under english colonial rule for around 150 years and was handed back to China in 1997, part of the handing back deal was that China agreed to allow HK another 50 years of capitalism, I've travelled from HK to mainland china by ferry from Kowloon, it is easier for us to visit HK than it is for mainland chinese. As it is part of China the world can only negotiate for a peaceful process anything else would mean all out war, the Crimea is in a similar position though it was overrun by force.

[HTG]

18 minutes ago, SandyCromarty said:

Thanks for that, but why is there a need for another HMRC office when the East Kilbride office has been dealing with Scottish taxes for decades?

Is this another attempt by Westminster to impose another UK  office establishment in our capital.

East Kilbride will close over the next few years. All of HMRC in the west of Scotland will move to a purpose built hub in Glasgow. There is more being made of this hub in Edinburgh than is necessary in that it's mostly about centralising HMRC. But where more is being made of it, it's generally by the likes of Alistair Jack. 

[strichener]

2 minutes ago, SandyCromarty said:

by some member EU states Catalonia is viewed as a Spanish region not a country, prior to 1707 Scotland was an Independent Sovereign state, it is now a country, recognised as such worldwide, within a UK framework.

All EU member states see Catalonia as a Spanish region, it is classed that way by the EU itself.  As is Scotland and not one f**k will be given about pre-1707.  If there is no agreement at a UK level for independence then there will be no international recognition.

[DiegoDiego]

You're right in that respect, but as I recall the last major number of countries declaring Independence were in Africa back in the sixties where countries achieved Independence from Colonial Rule  by various European countries.

So you don't recall the fall of communism then?

[SandyCromarty]

3 minutes ago, strichener said:

All EU member states see Catalonia as a Spanish region, it is classed that way by the EU itself.  As is Scotland and not one f**k will be given about pre-1707.  If there is no agreement at a UK level for independence then there will be no international recognition.

Gie yer heed a shake.

Too much in the Mormond last night?

[strichener]

Just now, SandyCromarty said:

Gie yer heed a shake.

Too much in the Mormond last night?

The Mormond has been closed for a while now.  Much like your own mind when it comes to international relations.

[SandyCromarty]

2 minutes ago, DiegoDiego said:

 

So you don't recall the fall of communism then?

I go as far back in HK as when there was two Chinese Communist stores on the Kowloon side during the cultural revolution, the big buy then was their camphor chests, on the desk next to me I have a first edition of Chairman Mao Quotations which I bought in one of the stores.

[DiegoDiego]

I go as far back in HK as when there was two Chinese Communist stores on the Kowloon side during the cultural revolution, the big buy then was their camphor chests, on the desk next to me I have a first edition of Chairman Mao Quotations which I bought in one of the stores.

I think you somewhat missed my point.

[SandyCromarty]

16 minutes ago, strichener said:

The Mormond has been closed for a while now.  Much like your own mind when it comes to international relations.

International Relations?

I wis in Baghdad when you were in yer Dads Bags.

[strichener]

20 minutes ago, SandyCromarty said:

International Relations?

I wis in Baghdad when you were in yer Dads Bags.

Were you as thick then or is it just senility setting in?  You think that because Scotland was an independent nation over 300 years ago that it will give reason for the EU to treat it differently to Catalonia?  I'll have some of whatever you are taking.  It is certainly more potent than anything you could have obtained from the Mormond.

[BFTD]

I'm inclined to agree with Strichener here, God help me.

We'd get nothing from the rest of the world in the event of UDI. Even if something unlikely happened, like the armed forces being deployed to Glasgow and ending up shooting protesters, the most you'd see would be a few mumbled, "regrettable events...sad day for Western democracy...hope the people of the United Kingdom can come together to solve their issues," type platitudes from international leaders.

Nothing we have makes helping with our problems worth jeopardising international relations or trade with the UK. We're on our own on this.

[NotThePars]

Yeah, strichener hasn’t said anything uncontroversial.

[strichener]

2 minutes ago, NotThePars said:

Yeah, strichener hasn’t said anything uncontroversial.

Ever!

[NotThePars]

Ever!

Don’t push your luck

[welshbairn]

Northern Cyprus is still only recognised by Turkey 37 years after UDI.

Edited September 6, 2020 by welshbairn

[Mark Connolly]

I thought when people mentioned UDI on here, it was meant to be a joke. Do people actually think it is an option?

[MONKMAN]

No sane person thinks UDI is even an option.

[Mark Connolly]

2 minutes ago, MONKMAN said:

No sane person thinks UDI is even an option.

TBF, I was asking about the people who post on P&B

[The_Kincardine]

7 hours ago, SandyCromarty said:

Hong Kong is part of China, it was under english colonial rule for around 150 years and was handed back to China in 1997, part of the handing back deal was that China agreed to allow HK another 50 years of capitalism, I've travelled from HK to mainland china by ferry from Kowloon, it is easier for us to visit HK than it is for mainland chinese. As it is part of China the world can only negotiate for a peaceful process anything else would mean all out war, the Crimea is in a similar position though it was overrun by force.

It never was.

[Marshmallo]

On 05/09/2020 at 15:20, NotThePars said:

 

Imagine it all said in an Ian Paisley register. “WESTMINSTER SAYS NO, EU SAYS NO, UN SAYS NO”