Double Winning St Johnstone FC Thread

[Widge]

6 minutes ago, Lang Toon Saintee said:

What a difference a day makes..I'm sure if you asked before Sunday if MOH was worth a new contract most Saints fans would say that he has not done enough to justify one.

He’s still not in my eyes. One swallow doesn’t make a summer (unless your Tam). He’s not contributed nearly enough in the last 2 seasons to warrant a new deal on the large wage he’ll be getting. It’s another May conundrum, if he’s willing to sign back again for a back up wage and slash his income in line with his ability now then I’d happily take him. If he’s wanting the same high wage and important player bonuses, then he can go. We can get a better technically, more productive, cheaper option who will learn the system that O’Halloran has simply been unable to do. 
 

Saw an article saying talks with Bryson have broken down and he does want to stay. Suggests he is wanting more than we’re willing to offer him. If it was me, I’d be going after Reagan Hendry, much like most of the league will be. Sort of guy who can learn off Craig for a season and play that role long term/when McCann leaves. If ever there was a selling point for him, I’d say look at McCart and Rooney now, they’re absolutely flying. Compare that to how Forrest has struggled a bit at Livi, or White has bombed at Motherwell. The step up is a big one, even Nesbitt has gone through periods of playing poorly, Shankland has struggled for goals as expected. If ever there was a team who are beginning to play good passing football from the back, with a young squad and coach who’re looking to bring new ideas to the table and a fan base who will give him time, it’s saints. 

[RandomGuy.]

Hendry, McCowan and Armstrong this Summer pls.

[Mr Positive, sometimes.]

57 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

Hendry, McCowan and Armstrong this Summer pls.

I wondered if we were looking at Hendry. Wasn't Davidson watching them a few weeks ago?

Although also heard he has a European based agent which who likely get him a move abroad... who knows though.

Edited April 29, 2021 by Mr Positive, sometimes.

[RandomGuy.]

4 minutes ago, Mr Positive, sometimes. said:

I wondered if we were looking at Hendry. Wasn't Davidson watching them a few weeks ago?

Although also heard he has a European based agent which who likely get him a move abroad... who knows though.

He was at Dunfermline v Dundee, I'd be surprised if every top flight club hadn't looked at Hendry over the past season though.

[Genuine Hibs Fan]

1 hour ago, RandomGuy. said:

Hendry, McCowan and Armstrong this Summer pls.

Hendry and Armstrong?

[Jamie_B]

3 hours ago, Merkland Red said:

They play different positions though. Considine is about 4th choice LCB and Gallagher is the big man in the middle to win headers. Kerr is up against McTominay and Hanley from the looks of things.

Possibly, though I'd have thought Hanley was more of the central CB role (I'd rather have him there than Gallagher anyway) and McTominay would be better deployed in the midfield if we possibly can? I'm not for a second suggesting Kerr should be coming in to start - but he'd be a great back up option at RCB behind either of the two you mention.

[DukDukGoose]

1 minute ago, Jamie_Beatson said:

Possibly, though I'd have thought Hanley was more of the central CB role (I'd rather have him there than Gallagher anyway) and McTominay would be better deployed in the midfield if we possibly can? I'm not for a second suggesting Kerr should be coming in to start - but he'd be a great back up option at RCB behind either of the two you mention.

I've no argument with him getting a look but I think the two you've mentioned aren't the ones in his way.

Considine was effectively a last minute call up and ended up playing well.

[Leith Green]

1 hour ago, Widge said:

The step up is a big one, even Nesbitt has gone through periods of playing poorly, Shankland has struggled for goals as expected.

Not sure these two should even be mentioned in the same sentence, this season tbf. Shankland is 16th equal in top league goals table.

 Nisbet has - despite a wee fallow period earlier this year - done fantastically well.

That he got goals wasnt unexpected, given how attacking Hibs play - I was a wee bit surprised how poor a return Shankland has had, but imo that is down to the system Mellon was playing, I still think there is a good player in there.

There are definitely good players to be had in the Championship.

[DukDukGoose]

4 minutes ago, Leith Green said:

Not sure these two should even be mentioned in the same sentence, this season tbf. Shankland is 16th equal in top league goals table.

 Nisbet has - despite a wee fallow period earlier this year - done fantastically well.

That he got goals wasnt unexpected, given how attacking Hibs play - I was a wee bit surprised how poor a return Shankland has had, but imo that is down to the system Mellon was playing, I still think there is a good player in there.

There are definitely good players to be had in the Championship.

Would Nisbet get more goals playing for Dundee United though? 

[Leith Green]

9 minutes ago, Merkland Red said:

Would Nisbet get more goals playing for Dundee United though? 

No sure if thats tongue in cheek - but I doubt it unless they sorted out supply to the front players - Hibs have scored >50% more goals than Utd and as you can see from the table above, we are not reliant on one player.

[Kyle]

52 minutes ago, Genuine Hibs Fan said:

Hendry and Armstrong?

Regan Hendry and Daniel Armstrong at a guess

[DukDukGoose]

18 minutes ago, Leith Green said:

No sure if thats tongue in cheek - but I doubt it unless they sorted out supply to the front players - Hibs have scored >50% more goals than Utd and as you can see from the table above, we are not reliant on one player.

Yeah but that's my point. You're saying they shouldn't be mentioned in the same sentence but also saying Nisbet scores more because he plays for Hibs.

I think Shankland is a bit overrated but we'd be in a much better place if we had him or Nisbet. Wouldn't be fussy over which it was.

[double deluxe]

1 hour ago, RandomGuy. said:

He was at Dunfermline v Dundee, I'd be surprised if every top flight club hadn't looked at Hendry over the past season though.

Steven MacLean was at the Raith game that same night.

[The Marly]

Hendry and Armstrong?

At a stretch [emoji6]

[The Marly]

I've no argument with him getting a look but I think the two you've mentioned aren't the ones in his way.
Considine was effectively a last minute call up and ended up playing well.

You're only as good as your last game. Considine was pish in his last game.

[DukDukGoose]

5 minutes ago, The Marly said:

1 hour ago, Merkland Red said:

I've no argument with him getting a look but I think the two you've mentioned aren't the ones in his way.
Considine was effectively a last minute call up and ended up playing well.

You're only as good as your last game. Considine was pish in his last game.

Yeah. I don't think Considine should be there. Considine is a back up left sided centre back in a 3 though. Kerr will be looking to play on the right hand side.

I'd have had him in for a look a long time ago. Considine isn't the man blocking his path though.

[Radford]

My thoughts on O'Halloran have pretty much been covered. He was possibly my favourite player from the last decade when he was at the peak of his powers but he hasn't come close to recapturing that since his return and I think those days are gone for him in a St Johnstone shirt. 

He can't get to grips with the 5-2-3 system and you've seen how well Davidson has managed to coach others into it. The last couple of games have really been his first run as a striker but would he even have featured if Middleton was available? He's done alright at wing back but you wouldn't want him starting there on anything approaching a regular basis. 

Could he go somewhere else and they stick him on the touchline and make him a focal point and he finds his form of 5 or 6 years ago? Probably highly unlikely.

So what can he still offer Saints? Little more than an option off the bench IMO and any contract would need to reflect that. If someone else can offer him more than that then fair play to them but given how well Callum Davidson has done with his players, they should probably be asking themselves why they think they can get so much more out of him. 

The other aspect of it for Saints worth simply mentioning is the stalling elsewhere in the squad and the risk we are maybe running of needing to recruit far more players than is usual practice this summer. That isn't a reason to offer any player more than the club think they are worth though. They've never done that and it's always served them well. 

Edited April 29, 2021 by Radford

[Jamie_B]

14 minutes ago, Merkland Red said:

Yeah. I don't think Considine should be there. Considine is a back up left sided centre back in a 3 though. Kerr will be looking to play on the right hand side.

I'd have had him in for a look a long time ago. Considine isn't the man blocking his path though.

I'd agree with that re: Considine - my point about him and Gallagher is more that if we're happy taking Scottish Premiership CBs in the squad then I'd submit that Kerr is at least the equal of the two already there ability wise!

If it was me I'd be picking Tierney, Cooper, Hanley, McKenna, Hendry and Kerr as the centre back options. That gives you two LCBs and four right footed guys who could all play either centrally or on the right in theory. It would also allow you McTominay as either a CB or midfield option, especially given we have 26 places available.

I'd really love to see Rooney get a shout, especially since Liam Palmer should be absolutely nowhere near the squad. I'd rather we took Patterson than him if it came to it.

[Mr Positive, sometimes.]

In his prime form while at Saints Mr O'Halloran was super exciting yet very simple at the same time. In a nutshell, stay wide and be very direct, get to the byline etc which he does well. Sometimes I wonder if Michael himself thinks hes a better football than he actually is and he really should just stick to his strengths of staying wide on the right. Its been shown this year he's not capable of anything more than that when asked to be clever offensively in a front three of defensively to take up good shape he's struggled which all but confirms for me there's no place for him in the team under CD long term. 

As a measuring stick of how exciting he was I remember exactly where I was and how excited I felt when I found out he was returning on loan from Rangers so for me that shows just how well he had done and just how exciting he had been at times. 

[capt_oats]

23 minutes ago, Radford said:

Could he go somewhere else and they stick him on the touchline and make him a focal point and he finds his form of 5 or 6 years ago? Probably highly unlikely.

Out of curiosity, is the current version of MOH better than Jake Hastie, Sherwin Seedorf, Steven Lawless or Jordan Roberts?

It feels like we've tried to sign him at least 3 times while Robinson was at the club and we're likely to be in the market for wingers. By and large we've played 433 under Alexander but truth be told he's still a complete unknown in terms of how he wants his teams to set up and what he's actually looking for in a player whereas with Robinson it was clear he was 100% sold on pace over ability (*waves at Sherwin*)..

Our January signings feel like they were a lucky dip and a means to an end just to get some fresh bodies in. Kelly and Roberts worked out others...less so but it's unclear how many of those were part of an actual strategy on Alexander's part given that barring Lawless they were 6 month deals to the end of the season or loans.