GiGi Posted June 9, 2020 Share Posted June 9, 2020 40 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said: Scotland doesn't vote as a nation. Why not? That's the right of every nation. If you have an entire country not getting the govt it wants you have a broken democracy. This is the crux of the independence argument for a lot of people. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted June 9, 2020 Share Posted June 9, 2020 4 minutes ago, GiGi said: Why not? That's the right of every nation. If you have an entire country not getting the govt it wants you have a broken democracy. This is the crux of the independence argument for a lot of people. We don't though. Quite a few voters in Scotland are happy with the govt they have but I, in England, am not. Regarding Scotland as a voting block when that is not how a GE is organised is absurd. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted June 9, 2020 Share Posted June 9, 2020 1 minute ago, The_Kincardine said: We don't though. Quite a few voters in Scotland are happy with the govt they have but I, in England, am not. Regarding Scotland as a voting block when that is not how a GE is organised is absurd. If you got rid of the Jocks you'd likely have the Tories running rUK in perpetuity. Surely a price worth paying? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon EF Posted June 9, 2020 Share Posted June 9, 2020 21 hours ago, The_Kincardine said: Well it would. The notion of an independent Scotland outside of the EU and without Mr Barnett's largess is sheer idiocy and I am amazed that posters are continuing this pie in the sky nonsense. Link 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GiGi Posted June 9, 2020 Share Posted June 9, 2020 1 hour ago, The_Kincardine said: We don't though. Quite a few voters in Scotland are happy with the govt they have but I, in England, am not. Regarding Scotland as a voting block when that is not how a GE is organised is absurd. Yes, the argument is that is in fact not how a GE should work ie we'd rather just not be part of it and have our own fully autonomous government. Scotland could vote all 59 seats in whatever colour they want for all the difference it would make. It doesn't work, so we should get rid. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Angelo Barksdale Posted June 9, 2020 Share Posted June 9, 2020 Empty headed separatists smh. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonS Posted June 9, 2020 Share Posted June 9, 2020 On 08/06/2020 at 23:43, Antlion said: I’m sure some still do, but I seriously doubt most do. Both parties have become infested with light Tories (and actual Tories) over the last couple of decades. I can’t think of many, for example, who would have voted for Jo Swinson’s mob believing she and hers were for anything other than self-interest, albeit with some support for the EU adding an attraction. The only reason you think that is because you don't like them. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antlion Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 8 hours ago, GordonS said: The only reason you think that is because you don't like them. And your claim that “most” Labour and Lib Dem voters are altruistic social justice devotees is based on something more than personal belief? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 33 minutes ago, MixuFruit said: Lots of Scots are happy with the government they have but I, in The Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, am not. North Macedonia these days. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 5 minutes ago, MixuFruit said: Huh so countries *can* change who they are... Yeah, they had a whole branding issue about the name Macedonia, with the Greeks. So when they wanted to drop the FYR bit (so 90s) the Greeks had a hissy fit until the Macedonians included the North bit. Maybe we could style ourselves the "Former British Nuclear dumping ground and holiday hunting lodge" of Scotland... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dons_1988 Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 13 hours ago, The_Kincardine said: We don't though. Quite a few voters in Scotland are happy with the govt they have but I, in England, am not. Regarding Scotland as a voting block when that is not how a GE is organised is absurd. You're just making a very simple argument for Independence here. If there is a clear divergence between what Scotland consistently votes for and how it is governed, then it really probably should be voting as a nation. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 2 hours ago, MixuFruit said: Lots of Scots are happy with the government they have but I, in The Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, am not. 1 hour ago, renton said: North Macedonia these days. He's talking about the scheme in Glenrothes which took up the mantle of FYR. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 10 hours ago, Dons_1988 said: You're just making a very simple argument for Independence here. If there is a clear divergence between what Scotland consistently votes for and how it is governed, then it really probably should be voting as a nation. Scotland doesn't vote either consistently or otherwise in a GE as there is no regional aggregation - just 650 constituencies with an MP each. The 'Scotland doesn't get the govt it voted for' trope is a grievance manufactured by the tartan fetishists which a. misunderstands the nature of a GE and b. regards Scotland as a homogeneous political entity which it certainly isn't. But they are good at doing grievance. Here's one I saw earlier That's the proposed new country - one based on a union flag on an egg box being food racism. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Angelo Barksdale Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 You don't have to worry about Scotland being a political entity if you don't consider Scotland to be a country. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 On 09/06/2020 at 20:26, welshbairn said: If you got rid of the Jocks you'd likely have the Tories running rUK in perpetuity. Surely a price worth paying? You're doing 'the Jocks' thing as if it's a unified voting entity and we all know it's not. I'd love a formula by which we corral the empty-headed muddle-minded together to make their own mess and leave rJock free for the decent Unionist majority. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 Just now, The_Kincardine said: You're doing 'the Jocks' thing as if it's a unified voting entity and we all know it's not. I'd love a formula by which we corral the empty-headed muddle-minded together to make their own mess and leave rJock free for the decent Unionist majority. The last time Scotland chose to be ruled by the Tories was the 1950's, and we chose to stay in a Union 62% of us are happy with, but to no effect. There is a democratic deficit by any stretch of the imagination by staying in this pretendy wee union of "equals". Even the brain dead are beginning to see that following a failed and deluded nation off the cliff of a no deal Brexit is not in our interests. The UK has become the global f**k up narrowly getting squeezed out of top place by Brazil and marginally by the US. We won't miss you, thanks for the Marmite. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, welshbairn said: The last time Scotland chose to be ruled by the Tories was the 1950's, Scotland never chose to be ruled by the Tories and isn't now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 9 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said: Scotland never chose to be ruled by the Tories and isn't now. When in doubt, nitpick. Much better than having a coherent argument. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 5 minutes ago, Baxter Parp said: When in doubt, nitpick. Much better than having a coherent argument. So whenever was Scotland ruled by Tories? That will deal with the nitpicking shite. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 Just now, The_Kincardine said: So whenever was Scotland ruled by Tories? That will deal with the nitpicking shite. The nitpick is the name of the party. That's all you've got. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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