St Mirren V Dundee

[The Master]

33 minutes ago, Bobby_F said:

It really does. 

Only Dundee fans and contrarians would say otherwise.  
 

You need to visit the VAR thread. It’s only St Mirren fans saying it does. 

 

[ZingaliMan]

1 hour ago, The Master said:

You need to visit the VAR thread. It’s only St Mirren fans saying it does. 

 

Sportscene punters saying tonight and last night 2 different punters said it was over the line also. The thing that bothers me is we have a ref who can replay over and over from all angles how the f**k can they miss that. 

[The Master]

5 minutes ago, ZingaliMan said:

Sportscene punters saying tonight and last night 2 different punters said it was over the line also. The thing that bothers me is we have a ref who can replay over and over from all angles how the f**k can they miss that. 

Because no angle conclusively shows it over the line. 

It’s that simple. 

Edited August 13, 2023 by The Master

[Buddie Holly]

5 minutes ago, The Master said:

Because no angle conclusively shows it over the line. 

It’s that simple. 

i have to agree

if there’s not an angle that shows 100% the ball is over the line they can’t give the goal

have to laugh at those claiming it definitely was over because i have yet to see footage that proves it

thankfully it didn’t matter in the end

 

[flyingscot]

I get why VAR didn't think they could award it, but then we got a goal at Pittodrie on VAR which I would say was no more obvious than yesterday and angles were no better.

Referee was howling yesterday anyway. Hadn't a clue, was fussy as f**k and gave some awful calls. The best one was the foul on Tiffoney which ended in two bookings for Dundee. Incredible.  

Dundee's VAR penalty is a foul but you hardly ever see them called really. There is a ton of that going on in the box which doesn't get picked up so annoying when one does! I mean nobody even appealed for a penalty in real time! 

[sergie's no1 fan]

32 minutes ago, flyingscot said:

I get why VAR didn't think they could award it, but then we got a goal at Pittodrie on VAR which I would say was no more obvious than yesterday and angles were no better.

Referee was howling yesterday anyway. Hadn't a clue, was fussy as f**k and gave some awful calls. The best one was the foul on Tiffoney which ended in two bookings for Dundee. Incredible.  

Dundee's VAR penalty is a foul but you hardly ever see them called really. There is a ton of that going on in the box which doesn't get picked up so annoying when one does! I mean nobody even appealed for a penalty in real time! 

Tbh the Dundee player deserves credit for getting back on his feet quickly, probably why folk didn't realise it at the time. It was a daft foul to give away though, really cheap and needless. Just as well Hemming saved it.

Anyone else thinking we are lacking a bit of leadership on the park just now? We have looked great at times, but when we have been under the cosh and a bit flappy in both 2nd halves there weren't too many players stepping up to calm things down.

[Molotov]

3 hours ago, Captain_Sensible said:

I wish we’d had goal line technology back in the day for the 1983 Scottish Cup Semi Final replay…..

Lex Richardson was cheated out of two major domestic cup finals both due to incredible decisions awarded in favour of the blue bigots.

Cheating on a scale that unless you were there you’d never believe a ref could actually award such corrupt decisions.
 

 

 

[Liam899]

I reckon St Mirren will finish comfortably in the top six, potentially at the expense of Hearts and Hibs. European football for the Buddies. 

I’m hoping St.Johnstone’s season pans out as is being predicted, and maybe Livi struggle as well. That gives us a bit of hope, then build from there.

[Molotov]

7 minutes ago, Liam899 said:

I reckon St Mirren will finish comfortably in the top six, potentially at the expense of Hearts and Hibs. European football for the Buddies. 

Those sides have far bigger budgets and resources to sustain a long season. Injuries and suspensions will invariably affect us more than the bigger teams. 
It would be great to achieve European football but I’d rather win another cup. Preferably the Scottish cup. 

[djchapsticks]

7 minutes ago, Liam899 said:

I reckon St Mirren will finish comfortably in the top six, potentially at the expense of Hearts and Hibs. European football for the Buddies. 

I’m hoping St.Johnstone’s season pans out as is being predicted, and maybe Livi struggle as well. That gives us a bit of hope, then build from there.

Dundee will probably be fine. The squad on paper is decent but players looked disjointed like they are still trying to gel. I don't think they'll suffer too many issues once thry are up to speed.

That's twice now I've seen the boy Bakayoko as well and he looks exceptionally poor up top. Zach Robinson (even with the penalty) and even Zak Rudden both looked far more dangerous.

[Bobby_F]

14 minutes ago, Molotov said:

Those sides have far bigger budgets and resources to sustain a long season. Injuries and suspensions will invariably affect us more than the bigger teams. 
It would be great to achieve European football but I’d rather win another cup. Preferably the Scottish cup. 

Saw something earlier saying O’Hara could be out for a month.  

One game in and we potentially lose out captain for 4-5 games. 

So yeah, depth of squad might be what makes this harder for us.  But the core of our squad is pretty strong and I think we could have a positive season ahead.  

[DeeTillEhDeh]

5 hours ago, Captain_Sensible said:

I wish we’d had goal line technology back in the day for the 1983 Scottish Cup Semi Final replay…..

I wish we had it in 1966.

[flyingscot]

1 hour ago, sergie's no1 fan said:

Tbh the Dundee player deserves credit for getting back on his feet quickly, probably why folk didn't realise it at the time. It was a daft foul to give away though, really cheap and needless. Just as well Hemming saved it.

Anyone else thinking we are lacking a bit of leadership on the park just now? We have looked great at times, but when we have been under the cosh and a bit flappy in both 2nd halves there weren't too many players stepping up to calm things down.

Yeah Ashcroft (I think) in fairness did well to continue, but nobody appealing for it just made it feel like a strange one. It was a clear pull, but again I guess it's the consistency of VAR as they can invariably get ignored.  

I don't think we lack leadership - there are very experienced players right across the team and Fraser, Gogic, Flynn were all on the pitch at one point who could lead. I think we just didn't make the right tactical changes to get going. Our fullbacks were (understandably) gassed and with Dundee going to a 4 in midfield we were outnumbered which left the midfield struggling to both hold the ball and Dundee used the extra body well. We would probably have been better going 5-4-1 and stuffing up the midfield a bit, allowing us to match Dundee a bit more in the wings. It was something we struggled with against Kilmarnock last year so no surprise Docherty switched it. 

24 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

Dundee will probably be fine. The squad on paper is decent but players looked disjointed like they are still trying to gel. I don't think they'll suffer too many issues once thry are up to speed.

That's twice now I've seen the boy Bakayoko as well and he looks exceptionally poor up top. Zach Robinson (even with the penalty) and even Zak Rudden both looked far more dangerous.

Dundee overall showed enough about them to make you think they'll be competitive in the league and probably right about team gelling. The boy Beck was torn to shreds defensively and they could do with someone clinical and more up for the fight up top than Bakayoko. 

[Doonhame Buddie]

Dundee are not the worst team in he league (I’m looking at you St Johnstone), but it is never easy for newly promoted teams. My preference would be for Joe Shaughnessy to rally his new team and secure top flight security and for Livingston and the Perth mob to be relegated. 
Dundee for relegation next season. 
 

[Coventry Saint]

Wasn't there chat that we get more money for Carson if they stay up, or have I dreamt that? I know the Gallagher fee goes up if United get promoted so I might be confusing it with that. Either way, I'm quote happy for Dundee to stay up, especially if it's at the expense of St Johnstone who are basically the new Accies at this stage.

[doogster]

23 hours ago, Cardle is Magic said:

Glad Dundee missed their penalty because that was a ridiculously soft decision and an awful VAR intervention. Same sort of shirt pulling happens at nearly every set piece.

As for not being able to award a goal when the ball crosses the line

Is this not one of the reasons for VAR technology; to avoid cheating?  I assume the intention is to stop blatant shirt pulling at corners. Your guy was fouling in the box and got called out for it.  If the scrutiny continues it will be less prevalent your team will benefit from it also.

Edited August 14, 2023 by doogster

[Wilbur]

6 hours ago, doogster said:

Is this not one of the reasons for VAR technology; to avoid cheating?  I assume the intention is to stop blatant shirt pulling at corners. Your guy was fouling in the box and got called out for it.  If the scrutiny continues it will be less prevalent your team will benefit from it also.

I agree with the penalty decision. Shirt pulling inside the box is a penalty. Just because most offenders get away with it doesn't make this incident a 'soft' penalty. 

 

[Doonhame Buddie]

35 minutes ago, Wilbur said:

I agree with the penalty decision. Shirt pulling inside the box is a penalty. Just because most offenders get away with it doesn't make this incident a 'soft' penalty. 

 

Yes it was a penalty but the inconsistency is frustrating. There are example of shirt pulling and players holding each other at virtually every corner. Are we to see a penalty awarded at every corner?

[Ric]

I'm not convinced the ball went over the line.

Don't get me wrong, it totally looks like it has, the wide angle from the right of the goals shows it being 90-95% over the line, but the rules are clear, it needs to be all of the ball.
I've seen numerous times, a ball that looks like it's over, and everyone agrees it's over, yet on full inspection it wasn't. I'd probably be more motivated to say it was over if it was the difference between a draw and a win, but as it never cost us anything (other than some minor GD) then I'm not overly fussed.

You'd think, if we are introducing VAR, that the "hawkeye"/goal line tech would have been part of that. It's technically the easiest (and presumably, cheapest) part of the VAR system, and something that has been operational all around the world for different sports. Why SFA/SPFL chose not to include it, despite a delayed start last season that could have been used to factor it in, is beyond me. The cynic in me thinks that offsides and red cards are what they wanted VAR for because it's probably the things that hit the OF the most. It's not true, but you do wonder why it's not a "full" VAR system.

Edited August 14, 2023 by Ric

[djchapsticks]

14 hours ago, The Master said:

It really doesn't.

Well OK.

Replace the 'certain goal' statement with 'a last ditch desperate clearance off the line by Shaughnessy' and the point still stands that during the last half hour of sustained Dundee possession and pressure in our third of the park, we actually looked more likely to add a third than Dundee did of equalising.

It wasn't a dissimilar pattern to the last 25 mins of Aberdeen Celtic yesterday where ball was played almost entirely in Celtic's defensive third but Aberdeen actually didn't create much of note, Celtic broke up park three times and looked more like scoring every time.

The goal itself for Dundee was also annoying. It came out of absolutely nowhere and I don't think anyone in the ground could have said they'd seen it coming on pressure or balance of play. Indeed, at the point it went in, it was looking like a fairly textbook plod by both sides to the finish line and the goal sort of provided a toe up the hole for Dundee to become more urgent.