Scotland vs Norway 19th November 2023

[deadasdillinger]

8 hours ago, Stevie Kirk said:

He’s a diving wee fanny who thinks he can referee the game as well as play. 
 

Most pleasing.

This really is lovely, lovely stuff. I hope his antics have cost his greeting faced team a place at the Euros. Pleasing. .

[TheScarf]

17 hours ago, Bing.McCrosby said:

The performances haven't been terrible recently. But momentum and confidence is a big thing in sports, I feel we've lost a bit of that.

I dont think the France or England games have helped us tbh, probably the opposite.

Would have been great to end the campaign with a couple of wins to build that back up. 

A couple of friendlys against teams we should be beating and doing that I think is definitely what we need to get that belief back before the tournament.

I reckon we would've beaten both Georgia and Norway if our first choice defence and keeper weren't injured.  The England and France games didn't cause us to draw those games, injuries and a change in formation did.  

We scored 5 goals in those 2 games, you can pretty much guarantee we wouldn't have conceded 5 with Gunn, Robertson, Tierney, Hickey, Hanley all playing.

[2426255]

The momentum/confidence/belief thing is exaggerated in my opinion. I'd be surprised if guys like McGinn, McGregor, McTominay, McLean, Christie, Armstrong, Cooper, Robertson and Tierney etc experienced dips in confidence/belief because of short-term results. They're experienced players, they've been through the ups and downs of football - over the course and distance many times. 

I think fans transfer their own feelings onto the players. Fans lose belief, fans lose confidence. For players it has a place in probably more specific situations: injury recovery, strikers scoring, trying to play at higher levels, long losing runs - those kind of things.

I think it's an overemphasized and lazy form of analysis, why? because you can't really argue against it or measure it due to it being a subjective intangible that's easy to just toss out there. There are eleven players, so how do you begin to measure that in terms of the teams confidence and belief? The binary world of results, that's how: so if we lose, we didn't have belief/confidence. If we win we had belief/confidence. I don't think I've heard a player say they didn't have belief/confidence after winning a game or vice versa - wonder why that is. 

It's fucking stupid. 

Edited November 21, 2023 by 2426255

[HuttonDressedAsLahm]

45 minutes ago, 2426255 said:

The momentum/confidence/belief thing is exaggerated in my opinion. I'd be surprised if guys like McGinn, McGregor, McTominay, McLean, Christie, Armstrong, Cooper, Robertson and Tierney etc experienced dips in confidence/belief because of short-term results. They're experienced players, they've been through the ups and downs of football - over the course and distance many times. 

I think fans transfer their own feelings onto the players. Fans lose belief, fans lose confidence. For players it has a place in probably more specific situations: injury recovery, strikers scoring, trying to play at higher levels, long losing runs - those kind of things.

I think it's an overemphasized and lazy form of analysis, why? because you can't really argue against it or measure it due to it being a subjective intangible. There are eleven players, so how do you begin to measure that in terms of the teams confidence and belief? The binary world of results, that's how: so if we lose we didn't have belief or confidence and if we win we had belief and confidence. I don't think I've ever heard a player say they didn't have belief or confidence after winning a game or vice versa - wonder why that is. 

It's fucking stupid. 

I'd tend to agree - I'd also argue that belief/confidence comes from the last year or two of results, dating all the way back to September 2021.

I thought England/France was a mis-step, due to there being limited upside, made especially more difficult due to the forced changes.  Nevertheless, they'll be nothing more than a footnote in history.

Looking forward to the March friendlies, which - odd as it seems - I expect to be more competitive and enjoyable than these two November games were.

[ekok]

Looking forward bit worried by managers comments about friendlies up to Euros. Agree we don't want " easy " if there actually is such a thing anymore. Last thing we need is " difficult  " of which their are many. Momentum is the key,  not dispiriting losses against teams  truthfully fair bit ahead of us.

Suggest teams close to our standard,  similar in style to whoever is in our group. Don't see it matters if they are/ not going to Germany. 

[Kevin Finnerty]

1 minute ago, ekok said:

Looking forward bit worried by managers comments about friendlies up to Euros. Agree we don't want " easy " if there actually is such a thing anymore. Last thing we need is " difficult  " of which their are many. Momentum is the key,  not dispiriting losses against teams  truthfully fair bit ahead of us.

Suggest teams close to our standard,  similar in style to whoever is in our group. Don't see it matters if they are/ not going to Germany. 

Clarke has said that he wants to target European sides who failed to make the tournament for the friendlies. 

[velo army]

Sweden would be a good shout I think.

And Georgia .

[HuttonDressedAsLahm]

16 minutes ago, Kevin Finnerty said:

Clarke has said that he wants to target European sides who failed to make the tournament for the friendlies. 

Sweden definitely a good shout.  We're otherwise restricted to sides not in the playoffs - Norway?

Lithuania/Latvia etc.

If it has to be a side not qualified and not in playoffs, the list is very short.  I see little value in playing another Tier 1 side.  World Ranking matters for the WCQ draw, and we'll have plenty of those games in September - November of 2024.

June friendlies could be almost anyone, including outwith Europe if an African/Asian team sets up camp in London/Portugal etc.

[2426255]

35 minutes ago, ekok said:

Looking forward bit worried by managers comments about friendlies up to Euros. Agree we don't want " easy " if there actually is such a thing anymore. Last thing we need is " difficult  " of which their are many. Momentum is the key,  not dispiriting losses against teams  truthfully fair bit ahead of us.

Suggest teams close to our standard,  similar in style to whoever is in our group. Don't see it matters if they are/ not going to Germany. 

To my point about confidence, belief and the rest I think this is a good example where I think @ekok is being dispirited by recent results and doesn't want that to continue and less so the players who have experience with runs of negative or neutral results and will understand that results aren't indicative of performance.

Edited November 21, 2023 by 2426255

[Hendricks]

1 hour ago, HuttonDressedAsLahm said:

Sweden definitely a good shout.  We're otherwise restricted to sides not in the playoffs - Norway?

Lithuania/Latvia etc.

If it has to be a side not qualified and not in playoffs, the list is very short.  I see little value in playing another Tier 1 side.  World Ranking matters for the WCQ draw, and we'll have plenty of those games in September - November of 2024.

June friendlies could be almost anyone, including outwith Europe if an African/Asian team sets up camp in London/Portugal etc.

 

Sweden.

Bulgaria, Armenia, Latvia, Lithuania, Belarus, North Macedonia, Malta all available in March with no play offs and having not qualified.

Be very surprised if we don't play one of the Ireland's in the 4 games. 

 

 

[Bing.McCrosby]

5 hours ago, TheScarf said:

I reckon we would've beaten both Georgia and Norway if our first choice defence and keeper weren't injured.  The England and France games didn't cause us to draw those games, injuries and a change in formation did.  

We scored 5 goals in those 2 games, you can pretty much guarantee we wouldn't have conceded 5 with Gunn, Robertson, Tierney, Hickey, Hanley all playing.

I agree tbh, I wasn't blaming anyone. Its just an accumulation of circumstances, but we chose to play England and France.

[2426255]

34 minutes ago, Bing.McCrosby said:

I agree tbh, I wasn't blaming anyone. Its just an accumulation of circumstances, but we chose to play England and France.

The idea behind that decision isn't unreasonable. It was practice for a tough 2024 schedule (Euro-2024, UNL). He's not going to do UNL prep in March.

Trying to make the team better ahead of those tournaments is a fair one just like Turkey was good preparation for tough away Euro-2024 qualifying fixtures.

it's smart thinking and good forward planning in my opinion. Clarke is a smart man, He knows what he's doing. Disappointed people can't see that he's just planning ahead.

Edited November 21, 2023 by 2426255

[Binos]

On 19/11/2023 at 23:45, Aim Here said:

Uhhh, I seem to recall we beat them 1-0. England didn't beat the Netherlands by enough goals help us get through, sadly.

England were 4 up and managed to do us over by conceding daft late goal 

[ekok]

Sorry I think we have got a bit ahead of ourselves.  The one and only focus from now till Germany must be what should we do to give ourselves the best chance to prosper there . If we can do that, longer term progress can come into play later.

Why wouldn't we play someone who was going,  of course not in our group.  If they have qualified,  clearly at that level.

Or how about setting up a quasi group, for example the teams that didn't qualify from the 4 teams we will face. Will be some quality there.

 

 

 

[Stellaboz]

San Marino, Ireland, Norway then Portugal or Italy. Ramp it up. 

[Ewanandmoreagain]

7 hours ago, Hendricks said:

 

Sweden.

Bulgaria, Armenia, Latvia, Lithuania, Belarus, North Macedonia, Malta all available in March with no play offs and having not qualified.

Be very surprised if we don't play one of the Ireland's in the 4 games. 

 

 

We want to play continental teams , not one of the Irelands

[Hendricks]

2 minutes ago, Ewanandmoreagain said:

We want to play continental teams , not one of the Irelands

 

I agree but my prediction still stands. 

[Ewanandmoreagain]

8 minutes ago, Hendricks said:

 

I agree but my prediction still stands. 

Fair enough !

[Ewanandmoreagain]

At their first goal Jack Hendry should have been out to the scorer before Nathan P.

At their second Scott McTominay  should have been clearing it

 

[2426255]

Not sure where to put this, but it appears that Norway and Benfica player Fredrik Aursnes has retired from international football at the age of 28. Not because of injury, but because he's playing too much football. His last game internationally came in the 3-3 draw. Can't imagine how angry Scotland fans would be if say John McGinn decided to retire early. Obviously it's because they're not qualifying.

Quote

I want to thank my teammates, coaches and support staff for a great time on the national team. I am very proud to have been part of this group and represented Norway. However, I feel that I want more time and freedom to prioritize other things than football in my life. That is why I choose to join the national team. Ståle (Solbakken) and I have had good conversations about this over a long period. It's a difficult decision, but something I feel is right for myself and what I want to prioritize.

Fredrik Aursnes

 

Quote

Fredrik has been a fantastic resource for us. He had his best international matches at the start of the last qualifier. He has been an enrichment for us both on and off the field. I have known about his thoughts about the national team for quite some time and have managed to persuade him a couple of times to continue. We then agreed that if he felt the same need for breaks from football before this season, then I should not enter into new discussions.

Stale Solbakken

https://www.fotball.no/landslag/norge-a-herrer/2024/aursnes-gir-seg-pa-landslaget/