invergowrie arab Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 11 minutes ago, welshbairn said: No more than we get annoyed by English tv presenters referring to Lock Lomond. The "ll" should be aspirated to the sides of the tongue, bit like a very soft Scottish "ch". "thl" is much better than just "L" though. The difference is non Welsh speakers basically have no frame of reference for LL and aren't doing it out of laziness. I bet not one of the English newsreaders who say Lock would talk about Johann Sebastian Back. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiegoDiego Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Yassssss more old language/place name chat. Scots used to have a letter called a yogh https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yogh which had a sort of yuh sound and looked like a 3 with the tail below the line. When standard printing presses came in they didn't have yoghs so printers used a Z which didn't otherwise exist on Scots So Dal3iel, Men3ies Cul3ean etc would have been Dalyell, Menyies, Culyean etcWhen I was young I knew a family called MacKenzie who still pronounced it as a yogh. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, invergowrie arab said: The difference is non Welsh speakers basically have no frame of reference for LL and aren't doing it out of laziness. A one off visitor, fair enough. It's the holiday home owners who pride themselves in not making an effort who should be thrown in a stone weighted sack into Llyn Tegid. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottmcleanscontacts Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 No more than we get annoyed by English tv presenters referring to Lock Lomond. The "ll" should be aspirated to the sides of the tongue, bit like a very soft Scottish "ch". "thl" is much better than just "L" though.I'd been taught by a Welsh dwelling family member that the LL sound applied more when it appeared in the middle of a name. Say for example Llangollen - would be pronounced with a harder C at the start - something like Clangochen. But there's every chance they were talking shite.Is Ebbw Vale pronounced Ebba Vale and is Cardigan 'Cardeekan'? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coprolite Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, scottmcleanscontacts said: I'd been taught by a Welsh dwelling family member that the LL sound applied more when it appeared in the middle of a name. Say for example Llangollen - would be pronounced with a harder C at the start - something like Clangochen. But there's every chance they were talking shite. Is Ebbw Vale pronounced Ebba Vale and is Cardigan 'Cardeekan'? W is halfway between oo and uh, so it's ebbouh vale. Not sure Cardigan is Welsh, i think it might be English. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 5 minutes ago, DiegoDiego said: 1 hour ago, invergowrie arab said: Yassssss more old language/place name chat. Scots used to have a letter called a yogh https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yogh which had a sort of yuh sound and looked like a 3 with the tail below the line. When standard printing presses came in they didn't have yoghs so printers used a Z which didn't otherwise exist on Scots So Dal3iel, Men3ies Cul3ean etc would have been Dalyell, Menyies, Culyean etc When I was young I knew a family called MacKenzie who still pronounced it as a yogh. Just to clarify without adding anything new. Quote MacKenzie is the Scots form of a Gaelic name. There is no “Z” in Gaelic. In the original Gaelic form, instead of MacKenzie, you’d write MacCoineach (which means Son of Coineach or Son of Kenneth). Guess what? The name Coineach is pronounced Koinyogh. Yes - it’s that yogh (“ƺ”) sound that became represented by the letter “Z” in printing. Hence, MacCoinƺ came to sound like MacKoin-zee and soon mutated into the modern form MacKenzie. So there you have it: someone killed Yogh “ƺ” . I accuse Paxton and his printing press. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 5 minutes ago, scottmcleanscontacts said: I'd been taught by a Welsh dwelling family member that the LL sound applied more when it appeared in the middle of a name. Say for example Llangollen - would be pronounced with a harder C at the start - something like Clangochen. But there's every chance they were talking shite. Is Ebbw Vale pronounced Ebba Vale and is Cardigan 'Cardeekan'? Pronunciation is quite different in the South compared to the North and Mid Wales, I only know how they speak in the North. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottmcleanscontacts Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 W is halfway between oo and uh, so it's ebbouh vale. Not sure Cardigan is Welsh, i think it might be English. Certainly it's the anglicised name for the Welsh place. I can't remember how it's spelled in y Gymraeg. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derry Alli Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 (edited) 36 minutes ago, TheScarf said: While we’re on the subject, oven is pronounced ‘uhven’ not ‘ohven’ Dork in my work calls it 'Oh-ven'. Follows that with using foil under the grid in the grill as its "less cleaning up". When pointed out that putting the foil between the grid and sausages/bacon/whatever makes it even less cleaning up says "but then my food would taste like metal." Edited September 18, 2020 by Mr. Alli 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coprolite Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 3 minutes ago, scottmcleanscontacts said: Certainly it's the anglicised name for the Welsh place. I can't remember how it's spelled in y Gymraeg. I don't know. Just looked it up on wiki and it looks quite nice. They've got a big wicker badger. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
microdave Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 One and a half pages of how to pronounce words is a PTTGOMN! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 10 minutes ago, microdave said: One and a half pages of how to pronounce words is a PTTGOMN! Thank the Lord, I thought it was just me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shandon Par Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Pork. Fork. Ford. All words many Aberdonians struggle to pronounce. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmic Joe Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 1 minute ago, Shandön Par said: Pork. Fork. Ford. All words many Aberdonians struggle to pronounce. See also Why, Where, When etc 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
invergowrie arab Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 3 hours ago, welshbairn said: A one off visitor, fair enough. It's the holiday home owners who pride themselves in not making an effort who should be thrown in a stone weighted sack into Llyn Tegid. Fair enough. They should face petrol and match justice 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherrif John Bunnell Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Folk on Twitter making jokes about Gareth Bale playing golf. Hilarious. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todd_is_God Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 7 hours ago, invergowrie arab said: Yassssss more old language/place name chat. Scots used to have a letter called a yogh https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yogh which had a sort of yuh sound and looked like a 3 with the tail below the line. When standard printing presses came in they didn't have yoghs so printers used a Z which didn't otherwise exist on Scots So Dal3iel, Men3ies Cul3ean etc would have been Dalyell, Menyies, Culyean etc Similarly the "Ye" part of "Ye Olde" is pronounced 'The' The 'Y' began life as a 'thorn' þ with the symbol below being used to represent the word 'The' 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpetmonster Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 There’s no point to the Welsh, we don’t need coal any more and rugby isn’t a proper sport. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broomhill Ultra Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 People that say ‘double down’. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Archer (Raconteur) Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 30 minutes ago, Broomhill Ultra said: People that say ‘double down’. Domino players? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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