The New Raith Rovers Thread

[Raithie]

4 minutes ago, Bambino7 said:

He's not looking that much into the future, just knuckling down at Dumbarton and trying to prove a couple of people wrong whilst not spitting the dummy out and being respectful and loyal to Raiith having looked after him over the past 18 months (and more).

Him not being at Raith next season under Locke is totally my opinion not anyone else's. 

Sounds like he has a good head on his shoulders and is going about it the right way. Hopefully he knows the Rovers fans are behind him and hope to see him playing for us soon. 

[Rovers_Lad]

15 minutes ago, Raithie said:

Lot of things to factor in though. Drysdale's glowing remarks about him last week basically spelt out he's going nowhere anytime soon, or at least that's how I read it. We're probably not in a position to pay off the remainder of his contract and I doubt he'll walk away from what I'd say is his last real stint at management.

The crux

[roverthemoon]

To be honest I probably wouldn't want him sacked at the moment. I'd rather we didn't become a knee jerk club. We've had a horrendous dip in form but he deserves a chance to turn it around. McKinnon had a bad dip too so it can happen to anyone. If after the next five or six games we are still looking for a win then it's probably game up.  Don't get me wrong I've little faith in him to turn it around but there is s chance he might given our squad 

[Bambino7]

27 minutes ago, roverthemoon said:

To be honest I probably wouldn't want him sacked at the moment. I'd rather we didn't become a knee jerk club. We've had a horrendous dip in form but he deserves a chance to turn it around. McKinnon had a bad dip too so it can happen to anyone. If after the next five or six games we are still looking for a win then it's probably game up.  Don't get me wrong I've little faith in him to turn it around but there is s chance he might given our squad 

Is it knee jerk though?  He's transformed you into utter shite and alienated a lot of the players and given jobs to his pals.  Terrible terrible manager to boot.

[Arthur Orton]

1 minute ago, Bambino7 said:

Is it knee jerk though?  He's transformed you into utter shite and alienated a lot of the players and given jobs to his pals.  Terrible terrible manager to boot.

I have to agree with Bambino, the guy is incompetent.  He got an easy time at Tynecastle due to the kids but even then he was tactically inept, made poor decisions and a half decent manager would have performed better.  

He also managed to lose a cup final from a winning position and even worse lost a cup semi against a team with nine men.

He subsequently failed at Killie and looks like he will do the same with yourselves.  His signings are usually poor too.

At best he is a coach, never a number one.

[Wee Sandy]

7 minutes ago, Bambino7 said:

Is it knee jerk though?  He's transformed you into utter shite and alienated a lot of the players and given jobs to his pals.  Terrible terrible manager to boot.

My point exactly, what we have now is a poor shadow of the (good)  team he was left.

[Ding Dang Doo]

1 hour ago, roverthemoon said:

To be honest I probably wouldn't want him sacked at the moment. I'd rather we didn't become a knee jerk club. We've had a horrendous dip in form but he deserves a chance to turn it around. McKinnon had a bad dip too so it can happen to anyone. If after the next five or six games we are still looking for a win then it's probably game up.  Don't get me wrong I've little faith in him to turn it around but there is s chance he might given our squad 

Nothing knee jerk about it. I understand where you're coming from and I hate clubs who put their manager under pressure, let along sack them, because they haven't won in 5 or 6 matches. The difference here is that it was so blinding obvious what was going to happen yet Mr "look at me I'm so important" Drysdale clearly loved his interview probably because Locke took one look at his and knew he could manipulate him into giving him a job.

We had a good start to the season taking 10 points from the first 12 but as has been said this was probably more down to the fact that we had a bit of momentum from the end of last season, played 2 of the promotion sides who were still finding their feet, a St Mirren side who didn't win a match until December and Dundee Utd who themselves were still coming together and we had several players desperate to prove something to McKinnon. However we also got knocked out the cup with struggling wins over Montrose and Cove and a home loss to Alloa. That takes us up to only 27th August and so if you look at us since them it's anything but a wee dip in form or some back luck. We have been awful!

3 wins since then against only Dumbarton (and we nearly threw that away), Falkirk (in which we actually played decent) and QOTS (who were in freefall). 

Locke has done what we all knew he would and signed his buddies. Skacel should be nowhere near our club and Dumbarton fans will tell you Vaughan did more on Saturday than Stevenson did in 5 months for them. The board say we have no money yet have sanctioned his signings funded by 3rd parties to which we have no idea if it's good or bad financially for the club. We probably have one of the biggest squads in the league. Locke says he wants to play youth yet would rather have either 6 subs or 2 keepers on the bench than let a youngster have some proper matchday experience. 

We are only going one way and that is down. If the board, and in particular Drysdale, want to employ a manager that takes us down then great but if Locke is still here come the end of the season I certainly won't be renewing any season ticket. I hate doing this but it's the only pulling power we have as fans over the club. Drysdale can hang around outside the club office pre match when we've got 1,100 coming next season to watch us play Forfar, Elgin or Peterhead looking all important knowing he has allowed this manager to take us down. 

Once Locke is away Drysdale should be the next one to consider his position. How he has lasted through crisis after crisis at the club I'll never know.

[basher brash]

Lockes basically inherited the back bone of McKinnons Squad 8-9 players who were high on confidence after reaching the play offs, Added 2 decent players McHattie, Mvoto IMO and look how far we have went back! On top of that wasting money on having  3 first team Goalies, 2 over the hill hearts rejects! and agreeing to the deal of the century for Rangers and throw in punting Vaughan out the door on loan. Either way Locke canny lose on Sunday  his own team wins or his favourite team wins and he can attend the after match party high fiving all the mad Jambos

[Daz80]

Bad enough sitting at Starks around some of the moaning faced gits but it's even worse on here.

 

Wanting to get beat against hearts, to get the manager out, aye good one.

 

This fantastic team that McKinnon left? What about Harry, longridge, Hardie (just back I know) Connolly, toshney, Anderson and McKeown? All starters last season  when we were winning and all out the door. Probably one or two I've missed as well. Can throw Craig Barr in as well with his injury record. 

[Broken Algorithms]

23 minutes ago, Daz80 said:

Bad enough sitting at Starks around some of the moaning faced gits but it's even worse on here.

 

Wanting to get beat against hearts, to get the manager out, aye good one.

 

This fantastic team that McKinnon left? What about Harry, longridge, Hardie (just back I know) Connolly, toshney, Anderson and McKeown? All starters last season  when we were winning and all out the door. Probably one or two I've missed as well. Can throw Craig Barr in as well with his injury record. 

Or maybe, people don't find it the best that we've taken 2 points from the last ten and that we're bottom of the league for form. Maybe people don't feel the manager is good enough? No goals from a striker since October. Consistently making baffling choices (Skacel and McManus starting games despite not scoring when playing together, Mark Stewart benched, Vaughan out on loan, Coustrain scoring then absolutely disappearing from the squad, two keepers on the bench with various youth development players). Consistently making baffling signings (Stevenson, Re-signing Scott Roberts).

Meanwhile, we have our board telling us there's been a poor response to the youth development fund and offering cheapest prices in the league right in the middle of a horrendous winless spree. The manager and the CEO give out conflicting information in the press. The clubs marketing setting up the hospitality based around trying to get Hearts fans in rather than look for Rovers fans. 

As I said earlier in the thread, it's like the fans and the club are on a completely different wavelength. I'd be happy if we won against Hearts, but being realistic about it I don't think we'll have a chance. There's a complete apathy which wasn't felt under McKinnon when we had our winless run there. You had the feeling that Ray had more to offer and that he could turn it around. We'd signed Jon Daly (past it) and Craig Wighton (too inexperience and frankly not very good for us) but we had the January window. This year we're facing the prospect of having Ryan Stevenson up top as one of our preferred choices. Hardie and Stewart work well together, but Stewart isn't getting game time. 

On the topic of season tickets, I can see the club having a struggle if Locke is still in charge in the summer. Last season, we had a barrowload of optimism on the back of McKinnon signing key players again, with an early bird offer and the promise of a long shot at promotion. There was no sign of the changes to come. I was quite vocal in emptying the pram over Locke's appointment. Long term, I can't foresee myself renewing next season. I don't feel the club listen to the fans it has at the moment. We get bleating statements about how we need more people through the gates, but that doesn't ring true to those freezing their arse off at 3:30 when Falkirk are peppering our goal in the middle of January. There's very little there to both bring new people in, and keep our current core happy at such ridiculous statements being released Incidentally, those looking to voice their discontent could always email the fans rep who is on the board if they aren't just looking after supporters groups. 

The next couple of months are key. It's all fine and well for Locke to speak about unity and sticking together. But if we're still in the same form come the end of the next month then the alarm bells will be as subtle as a hydrogen bomb going off at Starks. One of the things which I was worried about was the lack of progress when we made the appointment. After the honeymoon period, it's not looking too great at all. 

[Rovers1992/1993]

Bad enough sitting at Starks around some of the moaning faced gits but it's even worse on here.
 
Wanting to get beat against hearts, to get the manager out, aye good one.
 
This fantastic team that McKinnon left? What about Harry, longridge, Hardie (just back I know) Connolly, toshney, Anderson and McKeown? All starters last season  when we were winning and all out the door. Probably one or two I've missed as well. Can throw Craig Barr in as well with his injury record. 

Anderson didn't start at all in the second half of the season. He only made a couple of appearances from the bench during the incredible run.

Panayioutou didn't contribute much in that run either. Even though he did start a fair bit, he only got the goal against Rangers and then the goal in the playoffs against Hibs. I also can't remember him doing much in way of assists.

McHattie is a better all-round player than Mckeown. He's just being coached wrong at the minute.

We had Longridge. We now have Bobby Barr.. there's no contest there really.

Connolly and Toshney are really the only two of the players that you've mentioned that we haven't even came close to replacing from the second half of last season.

If I was to give you the option of getting beat 6 or 7-0 by Hearts this weekend, getting rid of Locke, and finishing the season well,

Or

Beating Hearts this weekend, being stuck with Locke all season, and letting him relegate us and we'll be playing our football in League 1 next season.

That's a no brainer really.

He's taking us down at this rate, but there's not a hope in hell that he'll be sacked if we win this weekend..

[piebob]

5 minutes ago, Rovers1992/1993 said:

Connolly and Toshney are really the only two of the players that you've mentioned that we haven't even came close to replacing from the second half of last season.

Even then, if we didnt have a squad of 963 players we might have been able to spend a bit more on players who could replace them. 

[Beachbum]

SIGNING NEWS: Welcome to The Rovers Fionn McLeod Kay! Fionn,17, hails from Kirkcaldy and has signed as a Modern Apprentice until summer 2018

Edited January 17, 2017 by Beachbum

[Scary Bear]

 

How come when you post things I just see a blank screen until I quote you?

[Ro Sham Bo]

Can we not just ask the BBC to pay the £82k from the cup match directly to Locke and Jackson as severance?

[baillieinleeds]

Hoping we knock Hearts out the Scottish Cup makes me a happy clapper? What an absolute slaver you are.

Of course I am you fucking moron.

[McGuigan1978]

Of course I am you fucking moron.

[emoji23]

[Geordie_Munrover]

MAY 21, 2016

If you’ve ever watched the TV series, Dexter, or read the Jeff Lindsay books that inspired the show, at some point you’ll have wondered, ‘surely he should have been found out by now?’

For those not au fait with the hit series, it follows a Miami PD forensic technician who also happens to be a serial killer. Despite half of Miami seeming to know his secret at various stages, and despite the inordinate number of delicate situations he finds himself in, his dark second life is never rumbled by the authorities.

That same ‘surely he should have been found out by now?’ question can also be applied to Raith Rovers’ newest manager.

While – and let’s be absolutely clear about this – Gary Locke is no secret serial killer, he does happen to be a football manager who, on the face of it, has been incredibly lucky to find himself at a full-time club for the third time.

And yet, here he is, in charge of the side who finished fourth in a strong Championship last season and who will look to repeat the feat (at least) next season.

There has been a lot of gnashing of teeth from Rovers supporters – and lots of sympathy and laughter in equal measure from other fans – about the decision on social media since it broke last night. As fans, we all love to wildly over-react, but there a number of reasons why this seems like such a perplexing decision by the Raith Board.

At the heart of the matter is the belief that Locke was a failure at both his previous clubs and doesn’t deserve another shot.

There isn’t one definitive, easy answer as to what extent Locke was responsible for in Hearts’ relegation in 2014 that ultimately cost him his job at Tynecastle. The 15-point deduction meted out at the start of the season would have made it incredibly difficult for any club to survive, and the squad was painfully reliant on young players too, but there’s a sense that Locke failed to get the best out of what he had available.

Throughout his time in charge Hearts seemed incredibly susceptible to cross balls and set pieces and were generally badly organised. Locke repeatedly re-iterated that it was ‘silly mistakes’ that cost his side points, but at what point do near-identical silly mistakes become a pattern that needs correcting? A good manager should be able to quickly identify issues and work to correct with them…a poor manager will rely on intangibles to defend his record. Hearts lost 65 goals that campaign. Compare it to this season where Dundee United lost 70 and Kilmarnock, 64 and it seems to fit into the argument that his team, regardless of the 15-point deduction, deserved to be near the bottom.

In the first half of the season, Locke chanted the mantra of ‘getting to 0 points as quickly as possible’, as if the league would restart once they hit the mark. Talk of catching opponents never seemed like a realistic concept as far as Locke was concerned and the players were obviously not inspired; it took Hearts until 25th January to hit a positive points total. By the time Locke was let go, five wins from the final eight (largely meaningless) games left him with a win ratio of 27%.

Allan Johnstone left Kilmarnock in February 2015, with his team in 8th position and Locke took over, initially on an interim basis. To celebrate the three-year deal he was later given by the Kilmarnock Board, he led his side to seven defeats in a row and some heavy flirting with relegation. Although he secured safety on the penultimate game of the 2014/15 season, he finally resigned in January of this year, after a 1-0 home defeat to Hamilton which left the Rugby Park club in 11th position; only ahead of a Dundee United side in their Premiership death throes.

In the case of Kilmarnock, there is no points deduction to obscure his performance as manager. Kilmarnock fans complained regularly of basic, route one tactics, the familiar complaint that his side’s lacked organisation and an inability to get the best out of the few decent players at his disposal. Killie conceded 20 goals in the seven games they lost at the back of the 2014/15 season and there was no sign of improved defensive solidity during the first half of 2015/16, when they lost 4-0 at home to Dundee, Ross County and Aberdeen and 5-2 at home to Thistle. Even as they imploded, Dundee United managed to bang five goals past Jamie MacDonald at Tannadice.

*

Which all begs the question: what have the Rovers Board seen in him?

Some hint might be given by his interview on BBC Sportsound a few nights ago. When asked about his time at Kilmarnock he blamed the fans, the board, the players and, given another 10 minutes, would have undoubtedly lumped in the groundsman into his game of Blame Roulette. There wasn’t one point where he held his hands up and admitted that he did anything wrong. Presumably he did much the same in his interview with Rovers.

He’s also an ex-Hearts man and, having worked with McGlynn, there’s always a chance that this has made some impression on the Board. The Hearts connection has been fairly consistent over the past decade at Raith and, while it’s slightly nebulous, it’s not unreasonable to think that that has aided Locke’s case in some form.

The only other possibility is that he’s seen as the best candidate to work with a club of Raith’s size. If you ignore his actual record, Locke has two Premiership teams on his CV. Stephen Aitken and Darren Young have none and, despite them having had relative success and appearing to be in the ascendency as managers, they don’t have the experience of working with clubs within the top 15 in the country. This is at odds with the Board’s decision last summer though.

Although Ray McKinnon was not welcomed with overwhelming delight by fans (who is?), he’d had moderate success in the lower leagues and joined with a definite sense that he was on an upward trajectory. The Board were proven to be completely correct and 2015/16 was the best campaign in many years at Stark’s.

With McKinnon we set a template for recruiting managers we should have carried into this summer. Bring in a hungry, young manager with a degree of success behind them, support them and aim as high as possible. There’s no guarantees that it would have worked, but there’s an ambition about that process. Signing McKinnon last summer suggested the club’s desire for improvement; both on and off the pitch. His positivity was something the fans could get behind and his ability as a manger shone through as the season progressed. No one could be blamed for him joining his boyhood club a few weeks back, but it should have set in motion a desire for Raith to repeat the process.

Admittedly, the managerial options were not abundant, but there were some promising candidates. Instead, the board’s decision highlights a poverty of ambition; a sense of ‘this’ll do’. Or maybe they’ve forgotten to do research and been blind-sided by his interview answers. Either way, there’s no evidence to suggest Gary Locke will be a success at Stark’s and the decision threatens to undo all the progress made over the past 12 months.

[Beachbum]

3 hours ago, Scary Bear said:

How come when you post things I just see a blank screen until I quote you?

 

 

Do not know.

[Rovers1992/1993]

How come when you post things I just see a blank screen until I quote you?

It's only when he puts up the Twitter posts, the rest of his posts are fine.