Next UK Labour Leader

[BerwickMad]

I'm reluctantly starting to agree with you to an extent. That said, he's fighting an uphill battle with some of the utter fucknuggets behind him on the benches.

However, please God, don't put another Blairite/ Moderate/ Neoliberal in charge.

Right policies generally, but wrong person. I thought that at the time of the election tbh which is why I didn't put him first pick on my list.

That list categorising MPs into four lists in terms of loyalty is interesting though. There aren't many people in the first two columns who scream potential leader to me. I know a little bit about Campbell and Lavery because they're the two Northumberland Labour MPs, but they aren't leaders. The people on the 'left' with good leadership potential on the opposition benches are SNP.

Labour need a winner and a proper leader who is going to go after the Tories. None of the previous leadership candidates had it. I'm afraid you're looking toward people closer to the centre for that leader. Even if I'd rather someone on the left in that position, there's nobody at the moment and I'd prefer a Labour leader closer to the centre able to win than a Tory government. It's almost like a compromise until the Labour left actually produce some good candidates.

[BerwickMad]

That's an English point of view btw. You have another option in Scotland.

[Wee Willie]

That's an English point of view btw. You have another a better option in Scotland.

FTFY

[Fide]

In general, if UK Labour would attack the Tories more and Corbyn less, they might get on better.

Corbyn, however, does need to become an effective opponent and not give his detractors any more ammo than they already have.

[DrewDon]

In general, if UK Labour would attack the Tories more and Corbyn less, they might get on better.

Who, in your mind, could be doing more to attack the Tories?

Most intelligent attacks on the Tories over the past week have come from backbenchers. It's Corbyn who seriously has to up his game when it comes to attacking the Tories - nobody else. 

[Peppino Impastato]

Who, in your mind, could be doing more to attack the Tories?

Most intelligent attacks on the Tories over the past week have come from backbenchers. It's Corbyn who seriously has to up his game when it comes to attacking the Tories - nobody else.

Erm...The Labour Party? Most backbenchers have expended much more energy attacking Corbyn than the tories since he was elected 1, and in Scotland they've been attacking the SNP much more than the tories for years. Labour are a joke.

[DrewDon]

Erm...The Labour Party? Most backbenchers have expended much more energy attacking Corbyn than the tories since he was elected 1, and in Scotland they've been attacking the SNP much more than the tories for years. Labour are a joke.

Labour has been attacking the SNP more than the Tories in Scotland because, up until a very short while ago, politics in Scotland was essentially a two-horse race: SNP v Scottish Labour. I'm sure if you analysed the SNP's attacks on their opposition, they will have 'attacked' Labour more often than Tories. That's just the nature of the game both parties are in; the SNP are a hell of a lot better at it than Labour, mind you. 

"Most" backbenchers haven't spent more time attacking Corbyn than they have the Tories. Then again, even if they had, I seriously doubt anybody is going to stop voting Labour because John Woodcock was nasty about Jeremy Corbyn on Twitter, for example. 

[Fide]

Who, in your mind, could be doing more to attack the Tories?

Most intelligent attacks on the Tories over the past week have come from backbenchers. It's Corbyn who seriously has to up his game when it comes to attacking the Tories - nobody else. 

 

As I have already conceded.

However, there does seem to be a section of Labour MPs, mainly moderates/ blairites, who seem to expend much of their energies on snide potshots at Corbyn.

[Peppino Impastato]

Labour has been attacking the SNP more than the Tories in Scotland because, up until a very short while ago, politics in Scotland was essentially a two-horse race: SNP v Scottish Labour. I'm sure if you analysed the SNP's attacks on their opposition, they will have 'attacked' Labour more often than Tories. That's just the nature of the game both parties are in; the SNP are a hell of a lot better at it than Labour, mind you.

"Most" backbenchers haven't spent more time attacking Corbyn than they have the Tories. Then again, even if they had, I seriously doubt anybody is going to stop voting Labour because John Woodcock was nasty about Jeremy Corbyn on Twitter, for example.

NowIit's a one horse race, but I actually meant labour mps when they still had some

And it is obviously extremely damaging electorally to have such a divided party where half your mps have said your own leader is unelectable, that's politics 101

[Arsenal till I die]

Labour has been attacking the SNP more than the Tories in Scotland because, up until a very short while ago, politics in Scotland was essentially a two-horse race: SNP v Scottish Labour. I'm sure if you analysed the SNP's attacks on their opposition, they will have 'attacked' Labour more often than Tories. That's just the nature of the game both parties are in

 

Until both parties change that, Scotland won't be independent and Labour won't get anywhere. Maybe both parties are behind modern technology - word spreads these days.

[dorlomin]

In general, if UK Labour would attack the Tories more and Corbyn less, they might get on better.

Exactly when has any leader of the two major parties not been copping huge amounts of flak from their own team? Thatcher was booted by her mob, Major had the whole "b*****ds" show down, Blair was quite reviled by large sections of his party, Brown faced will he wont he David Milliband to run against him, Cameron has part of his party half way into another party (UKIP) and all the opposition leaders from Foot onwards have had it as bad or worse. 

 

Corbyn is one of the biggest serial rebels in parliament, for people supporting him to call for discipline is ludicrous. 

 

The next election will be decided by voters in places like Corby, Stevenage and Warwick and Leamington. 

 

 

Conservative Christopher Mark Francis White  24,249 47.9

Labour Lynnette Kelly 17,643 34.9

UKIP Alastair MacBrayne[6] 4,183 8.3

Liberal Democrat Haseeb Arif 2,512 5.0

Green Azzees Minott 1,994 3.9

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warwick_and_Leamington_(UK_Parliament_constituency)#Elections_in_the_2010s

(Con majority 6606)

 

Conservative Stephen McPartland 21,291 44.5

Labour Sharon Taylor 16,336 34.2

UKIP David Collins 6,864 14.4

Liberal Democrat Susan Van De Ven 1,582 3.3

Green Graham White 1,369 2.9

TUSC Trevor Palmer 175 0.4

English Democrats Charles Vickers 115 0.2

Independent David Cox 67 0.1

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stevenage_(UK_Parliament_constituency)#Elections_in_the_2010s

Con maj 4955

 

Conservative Tom Pursglove 24,023 42.8

Labour Co-op Andy Sawford 21,611 38.5

UKIP Margot Parker 7,708 13.7

Liberal Democrat Peter Harris 1,458 2.6

Green Jonathan Hornett 1,374 2.4

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corby_(UK_Parliament_constituency)#Elections_in_the_2010s

Con maj 2412

 

The three turn outs are 70,67,70. Two of them are prosperous while Corby has its economic problems. There is little scope for some fantasy new voters turning up and propelling Labour to power. The kind of young and urban voter than loves Corbyn is not really a big factor here. The swing voters are people who voted Blair 3 times, have enough that they fear more radical change but feel that society does not care enough for the less well off. 

 

Crobyn's personal lack of any meaningful heft in such constituencies is multiplied by the fact that he will face the likelihood of a Lab\SNP coalition with the SNP once again boasting it will be coming to London to spend lots of money. Labour have to basically be looking likely to get a 50 seat advantage over the tories to so they can form coalitions with the lib dems\greens\SDLP rather than SNP. 

 

David Cameron f*cked a pig and is still ahead in the mid term polls. Corbyn is Labours IDS. Brain dead and repeats the same old tunes the core activists want to hear but is completely tone deaf to the people who actually decide UK parliamentary elections. 

[Wee Willie]

 

Exactly when has any leader of the two major parties not been copping huge amounts of flak from their own team? Thatcher was booted by her mob, Major had the whole "b*****ds" show down, Blair was quite reviled by large sections of his party, Brown faced will he wont he David Milliband to run against him, Cameron has part of his party half way into another party (UKIP) and all the opposition leaders from Foot onwards have had it as bad or worse. 

 

Corbyn is one of the biggest serial rebels in parliament, for people supporting him to call for discipline is ludicrous. 

 

The next election will be decided by voters in places like Corby, Stevenage and Warwick and Leamington. 

 

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warwick_and_Leamington_(UK_Parliament_constituency)#Elections_in_the_2010s

(Con majority 6606)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stevenage_(UK_Parliament_constituency)#Elections_in_the_2010s

Con maj 4955

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corby_(UK_Parliament_constituency)#Elections_in_the_2010s

Con maj 2412

 

The three turn outs are 70,67,70. Two of them are prosperous while Corby has its economic problems. There is little scope for some fantasy new voters turning up and propelling Labour to power. The kind of young and urban voter than loves Corbyn is not really a big factor here. The swing voters are people who voted Blair 3 times, have enough that they fear more radical change but feel that society does not care enough for the less well off. 

 

Crobyn's personal lack of any meaningful heft in such constituencies is multiplied by the fact that he will face the likelihood of a Lab\SNP coalition with the SNP once again boasting it will be coming to London to spend lots of money. Labour have to basically be looking likely to get a 50 seat advantage over the tories to so they can form coalitions with the lib dems\greens\SDLP rather than SNP. 

 

David Cameron f*cked a pig and is still ahead in the mid term polls. Corbyn is Labours IDS. Brain dead and repeats the same old tunes the core activists want to hear but is completely tone deaf to the people who actually decide UK parliamentary elections. 

 

Does this include Scottish voters or is it an England only decision?

[dorlomin]

Does this include Scottish voters or is it an England only decision?

The Tories have one seat in Scotland. What do you think that means for the number of seats Labour have to gain from the Tories and how that relates to Scotland?

[Antlion]

You list Prime Ministers who faced rebellion from within their own party. Corbyn hasn't even reached that heady height and yet many in his party are sharpening their knives...

[Benjamin_Nevis]

Does this include Scottish voters or is it an England only decision?

Who cares?

They're a shambling irrelevance up here and unlikely to get a sniff in England for years. f**k 'em.

[Antlion]

The Tories have one seat in Scotland. What do you think that means for the number of seats Labour have to gain from the Tories and how that relates to Scotland?

And yet they govern Scotland. Which Labour seem quite happy with. After all, they fought for it with them.

[dorlomin]

You list Prime Ministers who faced rebellion from within their own party. Corbyn hasn't even reached that heady height and yet many in his party are sharpening their knives...

F*ck me you are thick as pigshit. 

 

Foot... Labour was at war and split with the SDP.

Kinnock, militant and the other entryists.

Hague, his right wing constantly attacked him for being too moderate and his press lampooned him

IDS kicked out eventually. 

Howard, well short lived and doddered over the line with a minimal defeat. 

Miliband, constantly attacked for being too left wing, attacked constantly by the press. 

[Wee Willie]

The Tories have one seat in Scotland. What do you think that means for the number of seats Labour have to gain from the Tories and how that relates to Scotland?

 

Who cares?

They're a shambling irrelevance up here and unlikely to get a sniff in England for years. f**k 'em.

 

And yet they govern Scotland. Which Labour seem quite happy with. After all, they fought for it with them.

and that's why I care, altho I ken whit ye mean.

[Antlion]

I'm still bemused by the mentality of Scots that chirp about elections being decided in Leamington, Corby, etc. Is that something that pleases them? Does it make them feel that Scotland stands a proud equal to the other regions of the UK whose votes do not decide elections? I suppose anything that detracts from that repulsive sense of Scottish statehood that has them throwing up into their Union Jacks...

[Peppino Impastato]

I'm still bemused by the mentality of Scots that chirp about elections being decided in Leamington, Corby, etc. Is that something that pleases them? Does it make them feel that Scotland stands a proud equal to the other regions of the UK whose votes do not decide elections? I suppose anything that detracts from that repulsive sense of Scottish statehood that has them throwing up into their Union Jacks...

you're a fuckin great poster man best one here by far. Always hit the nail right on the head.

that is what independence comes downto Iin a nutshell, I want elections affecting sotland decided in Scotland, politicians governing Scotland answerable to the people of cotlland.

That's it, and nobody can tell anyone with a straightface tthere's anything wrong with that.