WoSFL Premier Division thread

[clansman]

2 hours ago, wosgroundhopper said:

I took in the St Cadocs v Clydebank game at the weekend as it was fairly local and only a few weeks ago it looked like it could be a crunch match in the league title. Overall I thought a draw was a fair result, I don't think a draw suited either side in their pursuit of the league title. One of the Clydebank fans had told me a fact I found hard to believe until I checked it out myself. Out of 9 games where Clydebank have played league matches against another team that play on an astro they have picked up only 9 points, their two wins came against Largs and Cumnock, this seems a strange weakness for a team that plays/train on a 3G surface all the time. Enjoyable game and well worth the £8. I have already penciled in the return match in a few weeks time. 

 

With only 5 games left for Clydebank now, I think they are relying on other teams helping them out in order to win the league, I think maximum points are now required from their remaining games. I would be interested to hear how their fans will view the outcome of the season, it is often hard to gauge fans mood straight after a game as sometimes they need reflection time to fully assess things. 

 

The other game I was considering going to was the Beith v Pollok game which by all accounts was a good game as well, perhaps the 5 minute car ride was enough to sway me to New Tinto. Beith are still in pole position for the league however similar to Clydebank I think a near maximum points will be required.  Talbot have been gathering pace and creeping up, looking at all title challengers run ins, Talbot on paper have the hardest, I haven't seen Talbot since early January when they were at Holm Park against Clydebank, on the day wasn't much between them. 

 

A massive 3 points for Troon at the weekend and 3 points that may well be enough to secure their place in the league for another season. Portland Park is one of my favorite venues to visit so I would be glad to see them stay up. 

 

For me Irvine Meadow needed all 3 points at the weekend to give them a fighting chance of staying up, with a good social club at the ground this is another ground I enjoy visiting so would be sad to see them drop a division however if you don't get the points then you can't stay in the league. I now think they are too far adrift to stay up unfortunately. 

 

It will be an interesting end to the season at the bottom as well as at the top. This is the most open league I have seen for some time. 

 

Next game up for me is Wednesday night for a trip to Darvel where they host Arthurlie, I have seen Darvel 3 times this season however this will be my first trip to Recreation Park this season. I would 9/10 times back Darvel for the win however giving the stage in the season and Arthurlie fighting for their place in the premier league I think it will be a tough game for the home side. Although they still have an outside chance of the league, I think Darvel (fans included) will probably have accepted that their best chance of Silverware is in the Scottish Cup of WoS Cup so unsure if they have one eye on that.

 

I was hoping to take in both legs of both Scottish Cup semi finals however unsure if there is going to be general sale at Darvel, I will try and find out when I am there on Wednesday as I think it would be a good game as a neutral if pay at the gate was an option, I personally like flexibility on the day to decide where I go etc...unsure what Darvel have as a ground capacity however how likely is a sell out? With 900 tickets allocated to away fans, I would be assuming the home fans would have a higher number of tickets so approx 2000 plus capacity would be my guess? I am sure someone from Darvel on here could confirm. I would like to be in attendance at the Friday night Darvel/Talbot games as well as the Sunday Arthurlie/Johnstone Burgh games. 

 

I have heard Auchinleck Talbot are planning on refusing the uptake of away tickets for the second leg match against Darvel due to concerns raised from all their fan groups, as a club that are incredible well supported, this is a bold move and will starve the opposition of significant money. I have been told that the Talbot fans are also refusing to attend the league game at Darvel as well. Between the league game and the home Scottish Cup tie, Auchinleck fans refusing to go could cost Darvel in excess of £10k which I am sure would hurt any club. It would be sad to see this happen however as a football fan as oppose to a fan of any particular team at this level I think there is something noble about this stance from the club. I may be wrong however I believe similar to Clydebank, Talbot are fan owned and have an elected committee, I think in these circumstances it is right that the club listen to fans. 

 

Who is your favourite for the cups/league now? Mine are below

 

League - Beith

Scottish - Darvel

WoS - Talbot

 

 

 

 

Having taken in St Cadocs what do you think of their novel coaching innovation 

[wosgroundhopper]

43 minutes ago, clansman said:

Having taken in St Cadocs what do you think of their novel coaching innovation 

I don't know the coaches personally however I am unsure if you would describe it as novel coaching innovation however then again I suspect a slight dig, my take on the manager is he is probably someone that is well qualified through the likes of B or A license as oppose to having played at a good level, there will be an element of science to what he does. That is not knocking him that is purely the impression I get. Listening to his interviews back and forward he seems to be using the latest football buzz words. Certainly always have a fair amount of tech with them from ipads to heart rate monitors etc...I know he is not at WoS level however a contrast to more old fashioned managerial approach would be the likes of a Dick Campbell. Each team/manager etc...are all run different, if they are run and play the same it would be boring. 

 

I think St Cadocs have performed well in large spells this season.

 

Football is changing so can't stick to the old spit and sawdust. He strikes me as probably similar in terms of coaching style to the likes of Gordan Moffat at Clydebank however I know Gordon had a good level of football as a player, I don't know enough about Martin other than he had started out at East Kilbride, I was told as kit man however I am unsure the level of truth in that.

[clansman]

1 hour ago, wosgroundhopper said:

I don't know the coaches personally however I am unsure if you would describe it as novel coaching innovation however then again I suspect a slight dig, my take on the manager is he is probably someone that is well qualified through the likes of B or A license as oppose to having played at a good level, there will be an element of science to what he does. That is not knocking him that is purely the impression I get. Listening to his interviews back and forward he seems to be using the latest football buzz words. Certainly always have a fair amount of tech with them from ipads to heart rate monitors etc...I know he is not at WoS level however a contrast to more old fashioned managerial approach would be the likes of a Dick Campbell. Each team/manager etc...are all run different, if they are run and play the same it would be boring. 

 

I think St Cadocs have performed well in large spells this season.

 

Football is changing so can't stick to the old spit and sawdust. He strikes me as probably similar in terms of coaching style to the likes of Gordan Moffat at Clydebank however I know Gordon had a good level of football as a player, I don't know enough about Martin other than he had started out at East Kilbride, I was told as kit man however I am unsure the level of truth in that.

I am used to clubs using vevo at their games. Also having someone by the dugout with a laptop on a podium flying a drone overhead for the entire game seems unusual to me. 

Edited March 18 by clansman

[wosgroundhopper]

6 minutes ago, clansman said:

I am used to clubs using vevo at their games. Also having someone by the dugout with a laptop on a podium flying a drone overhead for the entire game seems unusual to me. 

Being honest, I never knew the drone was St Cadocs, I seen it flying around from time to time however assumed it was perhaps a local resident having a nosey. Never paid a great deal of attention to the St Cadocs bench to notice someone operating it in all fairness.

 

I personally don't think they should be allowed to use it overhead as it times it was fairly low. Unsure what they are gaining from it. I have never seen them post drone footage of matches. Is it a coaching aid? 

 

I like teams that have media teams etc...best teams in the league for it are Clydebank, Talbot, Beith and Pollok always good seeing clips of games you never went to. I don't agree with drone being flown overhead.

[Vanderbilt]

30 minutes ago, wosgroundhopper said:

Being honest, I never knew the drone was St Cadocs, I seen it flying around from time to time however assumed it was perhaps a local resident having a nosey. Never paid a great deal of attention to the St Cadocs bench to notice someone operating it in all fairness.

 

I personally don't think they should be allowed to use it overhead as it times it was fairly low. Unsure what they are gaining from it. I have never seen them post drone footage of matches. Is it a coaching aid? 

 

I like teams that have media teams etc...best teams in the league for it are Clydebank, Talbot, Beith and Pollok always good seeing clips of games you never went to. I don't agree with drone being flown overhead.

More drones than fans…..

[Shanner]

All the scientific stuff is great, but I always feel it belongs behind the scenes (ie. Where I don't have to hear about the xG of some guy who works in Tesco, smokes too much green, lives on kebabs, and occasionally turns out for Campbetown when three other guys are too hungover to play). 

[Stag Nation]

53 minutes ago, wosgroundhopper said:

Being honest, I never knew the drone was St Cadocs, I seen it flying around from time to time however assumed it was perhaps a local resident having a nosey. Never paid a great deal of attention to the St Cadocs bench to notice someone operating it in all fairness.

 

I personally don't think they should be allowed to use it overhead as it times it was fairly low. Unsure what they are gaining from it. I have never seen them post drone footage of matches. Is it a coaching aid? 

 

I like teams that have media teams etc...best teams in the league for it are Clydebank, Talbot, Beith and Pollok always good seeing clips of games you never went to. I don't agree with drone being flown overhead.

According to the Civil Aviation Authority, it's illegal to fly a drone within 50 metres of people. Measured horizontally, so well outside any football ground.

[Stag Nation]

3 hours ago, clansman said:

Having taken in St Cadocs what do you think of their novel coaching innovation 

All innovations are novel.

[wosgroundhopper]

16 minutes ago, Vanderbilt said:

More drones than fans…..

Sadly there are a few clubs like this in particular the clubs recently establish from youth football. I don't think it helps St Cadocs when they are effectively playing out of their catchment area so therefore not at the heart of any community. 

 

Gartcairn are probably the exception as they have their own ground and you do see the club trying to encourage young fans in etc...

 

[wosgroundhopper]

2 minutes ago, Stag Nation said:

According to the Civil Aviation Authority, it's illegal to fly a drone within 50 metres of people. Measured horizontally, so well outside any football ground.

I would say the drone flying at the weekend would definitely fall foul of that, I have little knowledge on drones or rules surrounding them. 

 

As I said, I never realised that the drone belonged to St Cadocs, my opinion it shouldn't be as close to play. It was a mild annoyance however I just assumed it was a local resident flying it. 

[Vanderbilt]

34 minutes ago, wosgroundhopper said:

Sadly there are a few clubs like this in particular the clubs recently establish from youth football. I don't think it helps St Cadocs when they are effectively playing out of their catchment area so therefore not at the heart of any community. 

 

Gartcairn are probably the exception as they have their own ground and you do see the club trying to encourage young fans in etc...

 

A lot of clubs have small home supports but St Cadocs seem to have absolutely nobody!

[wosgroundhopper]

12 minutes ago, Vanderbilt said:

A lot of clubs have small home supports but St Cadocs seem to have absolutely nobody!

They are a large youth club, the issue with them is that they rent New Tinto off of Benburb which is in a completely different area to where the club is meant to be. When St Cadocs took the lead there was almost total silence other than a mild applause breaking out somewhere in the ground. 

 

This is my gripe when the West of Scotland League was formed, I think clubs not coming via the West Region Juniors should have ,teams should have been made to prove they are a worthwhile addition to the league i.e. have a meaningful fan base, have a permanent ground and show a financial forecast for the coming 5 years or so. With exception to the clubs that came via the West Region Juniors that had establish ground sharing arrangements, no new club should have been accepted into the league without their own pitch and I personally do not think they should have accepted clubs with no experience in adult football ahead of well establish amateur teams with decent standard of infrastructure and following. 

 

Take a Clydebank, Pollok, Talbot for example, these are teams that add value to any club they visit. They have strong away support which obvious helps support other teams financially when they visit. Too many teams which includes teams within the WoS Premier take little to no fans. 

[passbackdave]

25 minutes ago, Vanderbilt said:

A lot of clubs have small home supports but St Cadocs seem to have absolutely nobody!

So who's funding them? And how long before he decides enough is enough? 

 

Mon the papers

[wosgroundhopper]

8 minutes ago, passbackdave said:

So who's funding them? And how long before he decides enough is enough? 

 

Mon the papers

My understanding is there is a lot of internal funding i.e. from the 800 kids paying £50/month. There is also meant to be a couple of wealthy business men involved as well. The area the youth sides play out of is an affluent area. 

 

You could question any club that is reliant on just one major sponsor, it has happened for years at various clubs often with same outcome, financial ruin for many years after the funder pulls out. 

[Thejackdaw]

This talk of drones is just another reason to really dislike All St cadocs stand for and the kiddy on club that they well and truly are , sounds like their young manager thinks he's genuine world class material,  drones jesus christ get back to the basics and stop over egging it . 

[Shanner]

1 hour ago, wosgroundhopper said:

My understanding is there is a lot of internal funding i.e. from the 800 kids paying £50/month. There is also meant to be a couple of wealthy business men involved as well. The area the youth sides play out of is an affluent area. 

 

You could question any club that is reliant on just one major sponsor, it has happened for years at various clubs often with same outcome, financial ruin for many years after the funder pulls out. 

I hope they go bust and all the weans learn Santa isn't real. 

[Thejackdaw]

Anyone any updates on the super dooper 6k all seater stadium that st cadocs were boasting about when they first came on our scene? Plus the boasts of playing in the SPL within ten years ??

[FairWeatherFan]

1 hour ago, wosgroundhopper said:

This is my gripe when the West of Scotland League was formed, I think clubs not coming via the West Region Juniors should have ,teams should have been made to prove they are a worthwhile addition to the league i.e. have a meaningful fan base, have a permanent ground and show a financial forecast for the coming 5 years or so. With exception to the clubs that came via the West Region Juniors that had establish ground sharing arrangements, no new club should have been accepted into the league without their own pitch and I personally do not think they should have accepted clubs with no experience in adult football ahead of well establish amateur teams with decent standard of infrastructure and following.

Glasgow University an established amateur club. Do have their own pitch. Just use Airdrie for licensing reasons.

Drumchapel United was an established amateur club. Donald Dewar Centre's their own pitch.

Bonnyton Thistle had been part of the South of Scotland for a few years. Have their own pitch.

Really just St Cadoc's you're talking about that meets most of your criteria.

Annbank United folded. Ardeer Thistle I remember being saved because Kilbride Thistle used them as a means to get in. Might want to think about the state of the WoSFL if you get what you wanted.

Fan base is meaningless since 30/60 teams that bothered to give head counts from the West Region in 2019-20 were averaging under 100. It's committees that keep the majority of these clubs going not fans. Your 5 year financial forecast kills off semi-professional football and turns the WoSFL into an amateur league.

 

[Bestsinceslicebread]

3 hours ago, wosgroundhopper said:

My understanding is there is a lot of internal funding i.e. from the 800 kids paying £50/month. There is also meant to be a couple of wealthy business men involved as well. The area the youth sides play out of is an affluent area. 

 

You could question any club that is reliant on just one major sponsor, it has happened for years at various clubs often with same outcome, financial ruin for many years after the funder pulls out. 

St Cadocs, do not have and where near 800 kids in their academy

If they are paying £50 a month, the math is, this money goes towards two home games a month, think the park costs, £140/£150 per game so expected to be £280/£300 and paying 2 training sessions a week, unsure what is left over but to be fair, its not  too much.  Also, not every kid is paying £50 a month.  Theres also paying for traning kit, training materials and tools, match and training balls and the football strips.  If they have a small sponser that helps then brill but not much money left, and that money would not go towards the first team

 

Is it true that St Cadocs met the league requirements and were voted in by all the members clubs? I'm unsure of that, sure someone cant let us all know.

it looks like St Cadocs have a major sponsor, so if the team run their finances well then god luck to them and have a backdrop incase the money leaves when the sponsor finishes with the team.

 

(You could question any club that is reliant on just one major sponsor, it has happened for years at various clubs often with same outcome, financial ruin for many years after the funder pulls out. )

Well Hurlford United did exactly this and they came out well and have been an established premier team for many years, even after the money man/men left

Edited March 18 by Bestsinceslicebread

[Vanderbilt]

5 minutes ago, Bestsinceslicebread said:

St Cadocs, do not have and where near 800 kids in their academy

If they are paying £50 a month, the math is, this money goes towards two home games a month, think the park costs, £140/£150 per game so expected to be £280/£300 and paying 2 training sessions a week, unsure what is left over but to be fair, its not  too much.  Also, not every kid is paying £50 a month.  Theres also paying for traning kit, training materials and tools, match and training balls and the football strips.  If they have a small sponser that helps then brill but not much money left, and that money would not go towards the first team

 

Is it true that St Cadocs met the league requirements and were voted in by all the members clubs? I'm unsure of that, sure someone cant let us all know.

it looks like St Cadocs have a major sponsor, so if the team run their finances well then god luck to them and have a backdrop incase the money leaves when the sponsor finishes with the team.

 

(You could question any club that is reliant on just one major sponsor, it has happened for years at various clubs often with same outcome, financial ruin for many years after the funder pulls out. )

Well Hurlford United did exactly this and they came out well and have been an established premier team for many years, even after the money men/men left

I heard there were 2 money men involved but now it’s just 1.