St Mirren V Dundee

[hk blues]

8 hours ago, Bobby_F said:

Jeeze! I’m not even sure that’s a yellow.  

He pulls out, his leg is on the ground, he doesn’t contact his opponent.  

How after seeing that again can he say that’s a straight red!?!?

Almost as bizarre as flagging Saints second goal offside.  

But not as bizarre as saying it's not a yellow.  

[djchapsticks]

3 minutes ago, johnnydun said:

Although would've been a yellow, and still down to 10 men.

It would have been a second yellow without a doubt. Don't think there would have been complaint,even if the first yellow was nonsense.

Straight red could be a 2/3 game ban though and a second yellow one game, so it definitely needs downgraded to a yellow and take the one match ban as Bolton has grown into an important player for us.

[Lex]

34 minutes ago, 54_and_counting said:

Shouldnt have been ten men, its never a red card, the boy literally pulls out of the tackle as much as he possible could

Surely st mirren will appeal that? 

Yeah a scandalous decision which will surely be appealed. As with the last time Dundee visited Paisley, they got really fortunate with the refereeing decisions last night.

And they still lost. 

[hk blues]

3 minutes ago, Lex said:

Yeah a scandalous decision which will surely be appealed. As with the last time Dundee visited Paisley, they got really fortunate with the refereeing decisions last night.

And they still lost. 

[djchapsticks]

The penalty incident - people often ask 'where else can he put his arm?' when a ball strikes it. If you give that, you're genuinely as well lopping players arms off as you cannot get any closer to the side of the body than that.

There is absolutely no way you can look at that on a monitor, with any sort of clarity of thought and genuinely believe 'yeah that's a penalty'. Doc is talking out his hole to suggest otherwise. I understand that he's trying to make a point about Dundee's very soft one on Saturday but a referee getting that decision wrong last night would not have righted the ills. It's mental to suggest that bad decisions should be balanced by even more bad decisions.

Edited February 8 by djchapsticks

[MarbellaDEE]

3 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

The penalty incident - people often ask 'where else can he put his arm?' when a ball strikes it. If you give that, you're genuinely as well lopping players arms off as you cannot get any closer to the side of the body than that.

There is absolutely no way you can look at that on a monitor, with any sort of clarity of thought and genuinely believe 'yeah that's a penalty'. Doc is talking out his hole to suggest otherwise. I understand that he's trying to make a point about Dundee's very soft one on Saturday but a referee getting that decision wrong last night would not have righted the ills. It's mental to suggest that bad decisions should be balanced by even more bad decisions.

Have to agree with this. Does feel that any time something like that has happened in our box a pen has been awarded though. Either that offense is a penalty or it isn’t. 

Either way we were shite last night and our recent form is cause for concern. Desperately need the defence sorted out or we are going to drop like a stone. 

[smellthepaw]

50 minutes ago, houston_bud said:

He was already on a yellow, so he was always going to walk.

We should still appeal so he's available for Sunday.

It annoys me that the some of the replays the ref is looking at on VAR are from such a distance. Focus on the up close. He deffo pulls out of tackle. 

[djchapsticks]

8 minutes ago, MarbellaDEE said:

Have to agree with this. Does feel that any time something like that has happened in our box a pen has been awarded though. Either that offense is a penalty or it isn’t. 

Either way we were shite last night and our recent form is cause for concern. Desperately need the defence sorted out or we are going to drop like a stone. 

I genuinely do feel for you as when it feels like everything is going against you, it's really shite. If CBM had tucked his arm up towards his chest and it wasn't given, then I'd be saying we'd gotten away with a huge one.

The long and short is there is no consistency in Scottish refereeing or VAR decisions as the standard of refereeing in this country is undeniably appalling. There's a reason that there has been no Scottish officials selected for a World Cup since Hugh Dallas in 2002 and even no representation in 3 of the last 5 European Championships, including 2020 (and probably 2024 as well). Because they aren't just 'not very good', they are of a dreadful standard.

[houston_bud]

17 minutes ago, MarbellaDEE said:

Either way we were shite last night and our recent form is cause for concern. Desperately need the defence sorted out or we are going to drop like a stone. 

I thought Dundee started pretty well last night. First 20 mins you were the better side.

2 wins in this league makes everything look much rosier. Robinson was never under pressure or anything, but a lot of folk bemoaning the chopping and changing of forwards, the poor for of O'Hara/McMenamin etc. All of a sudden we've won two on the spin and everything looks great.

I wouldn't be at all worried if I was a Dundee fan. 

[Bobby_F]

2 hours ago, Uncle Scan said:

It was once the sought-after area in Feegie.

It's a shame how its turned out

 

2 hours ago, Molotov said:

Years of neglect. I really like those properties. With some care and attention they would have lasted much longer than some new builds.

I think the problem is really bad subsidence in that whole area, and slowly but surely the houses would have become unsafe.

Sad, as they houses themselves were good - just not what they were built on.

[boomboomyards]

2 hours ago, djchapsticks said:

Worth mentioning as well that the Tannahill area was also marked out as the 'centre for sport' in Renfrewshire with loads to facilities and about 8 or 9 full sized football pitches to replace the now dead St. James' racecourse and that was well pre-covid.

So that gives an idea of how long the houses there have been sitting on the condemned list. As @Ludo*1 said though, it is undeniably eerie. And pretty sore to see for someone like myself whose entire childhood was spent in that small area...my back garden looked onto the back gardens in Tannahill.

They made efforts previously of demolishing as soon as a property emptied (hence the big open flat spaces) but now seem to have just given up on doing this and are waiting for them all to finally empty which is definitely wrong in my opinion. 

 

Fun fact-  The council still cut the grass in some of the gardens of the empty buildings.  

[Coventry Saint]

3 minutes ago, Bobby_F said:

 

I think the problem is really bad subsidence in that whole area

...the area right next to SMP?!

We getting a sloping pitch? Maybe then it'd meet Tony Docherty's exacting standards.

[djchapsticks]

Just now, boomboomyards said:

 

Fun fact-  The council still cut the grass in some of the gardens of the empty buildings.  

That's because they have so much extra budget through fucking brown bin permits and slapping parking tickets on supporters (home and away) who are perfectly legally parked on matchdays.

[djchapsticks]

5 minutes ago, Bobby_F said:

 

I think the problem is really bad subsidence in that whole area, and slowly but surely the houses would have become unsafe.

Sad, as they houses themselves were good - just not what they were built on.

I don't believe there is any significant subsidence in that particular area. The buildings in Tannahill predate WWII as one in Tannahill and my old building in Bankfoot Road were both bombed during the attack on Clydebank and partially rebuilt. In fact the building in Tannahill has (or had, I think it's gone now) a completely different face on one half of the building to the other due to this. The only real problem was the wall on Tannahill Crescent which became really unsafe in last 10 years and could have been fixed but wasn't worth the while. 

Compare that to the Ferguslie Main road where they built flats next to the Railway line that had to be evacuated within 8 years and demolished within 10 due to them literally sinking into the marsh.

[greenock saint]

12 hours ago, bishoptonbuddie said:

 

No idea what Alan Combe was raging about during the VAR delay for Toyosi's goal. But GIRUY.

 

When the goal was given Gogic picked the ball up from centre spot and launched it high towards Greenhill rd. Combe was raging but Gogic looked as if he told him where to go also quite funny Bolton giving it to Docherty first half after he moaned about a tackle.

Edited February 8 by greenock saint

[Ludo*1]

52 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

The penalty incident - people often ask 'where else can he put his arm?' when a ball strikes it. If you give that, you're genuinely as well lopping players arms off as you cannot get any closer to the side of the body than that.

There is absolutely no way you can look at that on a monitor, with any sort of clarity of thought and genuinely believe 'yeah that's a penalty'. Doc is talking out his hole to suggest otherwise. I understand that he's trying to make a point about Dundee's very soft one on Saturday but a referee getting that decision wrong last night would not have righted the ills. It's mental to suggest that bad decisions should be balanced by even more bad decisions.

I've not heard the Sportsound interview but based on his interview with DeeTV, that's not really Docherty's point. His point was that the decision was basically justified as a correct decision to him in regards to the Ashcroft handball against Hearts' yet then last nights isn't even looked at. He didn't believe the Ashcroft one was a penalty but the authorities said that's the rules now so for it to then go against us in the very next game - I don't think it's unreal to demand consistency one way or the other.

I don't think Docherty is genuinely saying that was a pen last night, he's having a go at the authorities for basically lacking any sort of consistency and then defending their ineptitude when challenged.

[Pens_Dark]

St Mirren deserved to win. We were shite.

IF the pen given against Ashcroft is one, then that is nailed on. Referee's just don't do themselves any favours because they fucking make it up as they go along.

 

[Insaintee]

59 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

The penalty incident - people often ask 'where else can he put his arm?' when a ball strikes it. If you give that, you're genuinely as well lopping players arms off as you cannot get any closer to the side of the body than that.

There is absolutely no way you can look at that on a monitor, with any sort of clarity of thought and genuinely believe 'yeah that's a penalty'. Doc is talking out his hole to suggest otherwise. I understand that he's trying to make a point about Dundee's very soft one on Saturday but a referee getting that decision wrong last night would not have righted the ills. It's mental to suggest that bad decisions should be balanced by even more bad decisions.

And yet is that not the whole "these things even themselves out," argument? 

[djchapsticks]

2 minutes ago, Ludo*1 said:

I've not heard the Sportsound interview but based on his interview with DeeTV, that's not really Docherty's point. His point was that the decision was basically justified as a correct decision to him in regards to the Ashcroft handball against Hearts' yet then last nights isn't even looked at. He didn't believe the Ashcroft one was a penalty but the authorities said that's the rules now so for it to then go against us in the very next game - I don't think it's unreal to demand consistency one way or the other.

I don't think Docherty is genuinely saying that was a pen last night, he's having a go at the authorities for basically lacking any sort of consistency and then defending their ineptitude when challenged.

Again though, that fully quantifies my reply to @Pens_Dark that there is no consistency because the standard of officiating in the country is genuinely awful. It's easy to say 'That should be a penalty as it was a penalty on Saturday' but with a completely different set of officials and it seems, officiating standards, there is never going to be true consistency. McLean was awful last night, genuinely dreadful that I seriously think if VAR told him to have a look, he might have given it but thankfully whoever was using VAR had a modicum of common sense given they also suggested to McLean that perhaps the red card wasn't red after all. Next time we might not be so fortunate to have a VAR assistant who applies such sense.

Sucks for Dundee, just like I'm sure it will suck for a spell for Aberdeen and Motherwell and us etc but until there is a vast improvement on the standards of officiating in Scotland, we're all just stuck in a big fucking tombola with them.

[djchapsticks]

3 minutes ago, Insaintee said:

And yet is that not the whole "these things even themselves out," argument? 

It is but as you know, that phrase is usually said with dripping, mocking irony.

Controversy is good and part of football and it always should be but I don't think many of us enjoy the prospect of constantly not knowing if you're going to be on the right end or wrong end of consistently shite officiating.

The decision of a non-penalty in itself was a good decision - the context of the one Dundee conceded 4 days earlier made it in their eyes, a poor decision. At which point, if a poor decision is made and a penalty is given, they see it as good (whilst admitting it is still wrong) and we see it as a shocker.

Edited February 8 by djchapsticks