Conspiracy Theories

[BFTD]

Anyone have any documentaries about why people decide to believe a small handful of contrarian voices, often speaking on topics outside of their field of expertise, at the expense of the overwhelming majority of people who know the most about the subject?

Presumably it's some form of mental illness, but that's surely the most interesting aspect of most topics on this subforum. I mean, there are still millions who contribute to the lifestyle of exposed con man Andrew Wakefield and insist he's the top boi on matters related to vaccines and/or autism. It's fascinating, if not terrifying.

[GordonS]

On 05/04/2024 at 19:14, Bigmouth Strikes Again said:

The truth about the climate change bullshite......

 

I'll say this about you, at least you posted this on an appropriate thread. 

In terms of scientific credibility, rejecting the basics of climate change - that the atmosphere has warmed by about one degree in the last 150 years and that the cause is human action, mostly burning oil, gas and coal - is right on a par with flat earthism.

The amount of demented sh*tf*ckery they need to go through now to try to refute that reality is hilarious. They even deny warming has occurred, in which case someone's going to have to explain how the trees are in on it.

[GordonS]

8 minutes ago, BFTD said:

Anyone have any documentaries about why people decide to believe a small handful of contrarian voices, often speaking on topics outside of their field of expertise, at the expense of the overwhelming majority of people who know the most about the subject?

 

It varies hugely depending on the actual conspiracy. On climate change I've never come across a denier who didn't have strong political opposition to the implication of climate change. Reducing emissions inevitably means constraints on personal freedoms. Instead of reacting like the rest of us who are reluctantly accepting harsh realities and trying to find the least bad way to do it, like children they just yell "NO IT ISN'T!"

They choose to believe that the people warning them about climate change just want to control them, so the conspiracies are inevitable from there. There's no scientific evidence that could ever change their mind because they'll never believe anyone who produces it. 

[Loonytoons]

If the case is strong enough why have the condescending images and dreadful music to try and back up the claims.  Cringeworthy effort.

[TxRover]

5 hours ago, Bigmouth Strikes Again said:

Yeah, they're all a bunch of morons that don't know what they're talking about.

Unlike the experts on here.

Thank you.

Do elucidate on the Nobel Prize winner in this field that they are talking about...or the "top" scientist in the field...what, they're all experts in different fields? So, you'd call a plumber to fix the plugs?

[highlandmac]

9 hours ago, Bigmouth Strikes Again said:

Yeah, they're all a bunch of morons that don't know what they're talking about.

Unlike the experts on here.

Thank you.

[buchan30]

9 hours ago, BFTD said:

Anyone have any documentaries about why people decide to believe a small handful of contrarian voices, often speaking on topics outside of their field of expertise, at the expense of the overwhelming majority of people who know the most about the subject?

Presumably it's some form of mental illness, but that's surely the most interesting aspect of most topics on this subforum. I mean, there are still millions who contribute to the lifestyle of exposed con man Andrew Wakefield and insist he's the top boi on matters related to vaccines and/or autism. It's fascinating, if not terrifying.

I think it is probably to do with belonging to a group. They may get dragged in by an idea that the earth is flat or whatever and just end up in an echo chamber.

The cynic in me thinks half of them are just after a free jolly. Stuff like 9/11 they say “you can’t prove it, because i have never been there”. 
Andrew Maxwell done a thing on the bbc years back and took them to New York etc and some of them seemed like they were just there for the free trip. 

[sugna]

On 06/04/2024 at 09:09, coprolite said:

I only made two minutes. I got pst the "climate reasearchers make it up for grants" guy buy the "one world government" guy was too much. 

It's unfair to say it was just boomers. One guy looked like he might be in his mid fifties. 

Here's a review 

https://skepticalscience.com/climate-the-movie-a-hot-mess-of-cold-myths.html

That is an excellent and comprehensive rebuttal. Leads no room whatsoever for any doubt, and links to detailed debunking on every single point.

It's almost as though the scientific approach is to be evidence-based.

(The canard that someone with expertise in a field can speak with authority in an unrelated field is not new. Indeed, it's one of the standard fallacies that are taught when beginning to study things like logic and philosophy: it's the fallacy known as "argument from authority".)

[Bigmouth Strikes Again]

3 hours ago, sugna said:

That is an excellent and comprehensive rebuttal. Leads no room whatsoever for any doubt, and links to detailed debunking on every single point.

It's almost as though the scientific approach is to be evidence-based.

(The canard that someone with expertise in a field can speak with authority in an unrelated field is not new. Indeed, it's one of the standard fallacies that are taught when beginning to study things like logic and philosophy: it's the fallacy known as "argument from authority".)

[GNU_Linux]

Reminder that Nobel disease is a thing

[ICTChris]

Most people, maybe nearly everyone, will believe something that completely goes against evidence and will be unmovable from that position. There are millenarian cults who have predicted that the world will end on a specific date and when it hasn’t the cult has actually prospered.

That said, almost everyone who doesn’t believe in global warming or the general consensus around it, is a mad crank.

It’s almost a meme in our culture that the lone voice who everyone ridicules turns out to be right, it’s the theme of so many movies, TV shows and books. We should probably start producing shows about problems solved by careful planning and measured execution, where the subject matter experts and interested parties work collaboratively and professionally. The naysayers should be proved wrong and left to fester in their oddness.

[Florentine_Pogen]

29 minutes ago, ICTChris said:

Most people, maybe nearly everyone, will believe something that completely goes against evidence and will be unmovable from that position. There are millenarian cults who have predicted that the world will end on a specific date and when it hasn’t the cult has actually prospered.

I find that hard to believe. The Jehovah's Witnesses, for example, have suffered serious membership crashes each time they announce their ludicrous 'End-of-the-World' timeline.

Tell me more.

 

[Barry Ferguson's Hat]

Global warming - not real

Sasquatches - real

[ICTChris]

12 minutes ago, Florentine_Pogen said:

I find that hard to believe. The Jehovah's Witnesses, for example, have suffered serious membership crashes each time they announce their ludicrous 'End-of-the-World' timeline.

Tell me more.

 

I am slightly wrong after fact checking myself - The Seekers cult in the 1950s predicted a date that UFOs were going to come and get them but that after the first date came and went the membership stayed loyal but when the second date came and went most of them left. Not all of them though!

Do the JWs still say the world is going to end on a specific date?

[Florentine_Pogen]

39 minutes ago, ICTChris said:

I am slightly wrong after fact checking myself - The Seekers cult in the 1950s predicted a date that UFOs were going to come and get them but that after the first date came and went the membership stayed loyal but when the second date came and went most of them left. Not all of them though!

Do the JWs still say the world is going to end on a specific date?

These days I'm not sure but this Wiki piece will give some background if you're interested.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unfulfilled_Watch_Tower_Society_predictions

[welshbairn]

3 hours ago, GNU_Linux said:

Reminder that Nobel disease is a thing

I'm convinced.

Quote

Kary Mullis won the 1993 Nobel Prize in Chemistry for development of the polymerase chain reaction. Mullis disagreed with the scientifically accepted view that AIDS is caused by HIV, claiming that the virus is barely detectable in people with the disease. He also expressed doubt in the evidence for human-caused climate change. In his autobiography, Mullis professed a belief in astrology and wrote about an encounter with a fluorescent, talking raccoon that he suggested might have been an extraterrestrial alien.

 

[carpetmonster]

1 hour ago, Barry Ferguson's Hat said:

Global warming - not real

Sasquatches - real

It’s telling that there’s never been a Climate Change And The Hendersons

[Salt n Vinegar]

For more craziness no, I mean for another example of people believing stuff that others might unkindly refer to as "perhaps a bit strange", I would respectfully refer folks to this little beauty -

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Disappointment

A dude predicted the end of the world by fire in the 1840 and when it didn't happen it was referred to as the great disappointment.

Obviously folk are entitled to believe whatever they like...

Edited April 7 by Salt n Vinegar

[Salt n Vinegar]

I'm on a roll now. 

Apparently Marjorie Taylor Greene said that the New York earthquake was a sign from God that repentance was in order and that along with the coming solar eclipse was a sign of things to come.  She's not apparently sure about what should be repented for, or what else is to come but I'm sure she thinks she knows what she's talking about.  A representative of the people wouldn't be so irresponsible as to just make religious stuff up for political purposes.

Oops. Sorry, source - https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/marjorie-taylor-greene-nyc-earthquake-sign-god-b2524196.html

Edited April 7 by Salt n Vinegar

[Salvo Montalbano]

On 06/04/2024 at 15:56, Bigmouth Strikes Again said:

Only, it's not a couple of 'random wee guys' it's the top scientists in their field, Nobel prizes etc.

Would you perhaps describe them as...

Anyway, Americans are going nuts for the upcoming eclipse. Not only are they thinking it's some sign from God because the intersection of the paths of this one and the last one go over a town called Rapture or somesuch, they're also worried that CERN are doing Physics shit on the 8th and NASA are shooting probes at the Sun in some kind of Mission named after a serpent god. Really need to stop looking at Twitter and Facebook tbh.