Willie Collum; good guy? complete dick? corrupt? / ..and should (Old Firm) clubs "have the power to ban him"?

[tamthebam]

Some of us had to suffer Willie Collum when he was on the way up.. 

 

[10menwent2mow]

19 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

Boy that I used to go on a supporter's bus with was on the refereeing path when we were in our late-teens/early twenties.

He got to the point of doing adult matches, not sure what level. Eventually binned it off for similar reasons to your mate. He just couldn't justify driving miles every weekend to take abuse in the pishing rain. He's a very laid-back lad, but I think even for someone like him there's a tipping point where you just get fed up. Some of the stories of folk offering him out (players and coaches) with nobody to back him up were quite frightening.

Football in general has an issue with arseholery. Players are encouraged to cheat, and it's the ref's fault if he falls for it. Players are encouraged to scream at refs, swear in their faces etc. All joking aside, that is no way for an adult to behave and it's shameful that the sport has allowed it to go on so long. Referees on the telly have police around, and the sort of protection of cameras etc. Refs in a public park have f**k all, so I think there's probably a heavy bias in certain personality types making it to the top of refereeing. You'd need thick as f**k skin, and I don't see why we all just accept that.

Behaviour in football is a disgrace.

This about sums it up. This is why I said earlier that everyone involved in Scottish football, be it at welfare, schools etc etc has to take responsibility for the shite standard of refereeing in this country. Until kids, coaches, parents and then players at welfare, amateur, junior, semi-pro level start actually respecting the officials this shite will continue to dilute the pool of decent refs and we continually have pish. 

[pozbaird]

3 hours ago, gannonball said:

I have seen Collum give a penalty against us whilst facing the wrong way ffs. The guy is an atrocious referee but he isn't biased imo. He is just utterly clueless.

Sums it up for me. He’s not biased, corrupt, or anywhere near it . He’s just shite. The amount of games I’ve seen where it turns into the Willie Collum show, with both sets of fans spitting feathers? Also, when he makes a decision, the way he runs, skips across the pitch to brandish a card with a flourish? Officious wee scrote, but not bent. IMHO etc and all that jazz.

[kennie makevin]

25 minutes ago, tamthebam said:

Some of us had to suffer Willie Collum when he was on the way up.. 

 

Can we not just ban the Old Firm and leave Willie Colum out of this ?

[bennett]

2 hours ago, GeorgiosSamaras said:

The "Old Firm" are not trying to pick referees, Rangers are. Collum is a dreadful referee, he didn't check the only real penalty decision at the weekend - the foul on Turnbull wrongly ruled offside and he didn't send Walsh to the VAR monitor for the straight red card Goldson should have been given for the knee high challenge on Bernardo. 

Rangers issue with Collum is that he is a catholic and they despise catholics. Baldemort and his band of losers needed an excuse for yet another derby day walloping and the catholic watching from the van was a convenient scapegoat. It is patently ridiculous that a club who have had one penalty against them in 70 odd games think they are hard done to, I doubt they believe it themselves, but they have to placate the hoards who know little other than their team being battered by Celtic. So, they are playing up to and encouraging the worst elements of their fanbase who see this as the culmination of a wider Papal plot, started by Pope John Paul II's visit to Scotland in 1982. If it leads to violence against Collum, which those at Ibrox must surely know they are encouraging - that is a price worth paying to buy Clement's losers more time in their eyes. 

That's outstanding 

 

Edited January 4 by bennett

[Cappiecat1.2]

33 minutes ago, pozbaird said:

The amount of games I’ve seen where it turns into the Willie Collum show, with both sets of fans spitting feathers?

Why would poor refereeing make both sets of supporters thirsty for a cup of tea?

[kingjoey]

4 hours ago, gannonball said:

I have seen Collum give a penalty against us whilst facing the wrong way ffs. The guy is an atrocious referee but he isn't biased imo. He is just utterly clueless.

I have no idea of the incident you remember, but one thing that almost everyone doesn't know/conveniently forgets, is that the referees and linesmen are mic'd up and are constantly speaking to each other. It is possible that the linesman saw said incident and told Willie that it was a penalty. 

[ClydeTon]

Worst referee in Scotland, but he has upset the Rangers...

 

Maybe he's good after all?

[gannonball]

28 minutes ago, kingjoey said:

I have no idea of the incident you remember, but one thing that almost everyone doesn't know/conveniently forgets, is that the referees and linesmen are mic'd up and are constantly speaking to each other. It is possible that the linesman saw said incident and told Willie that it was a penalty. 

Nah it was instant he turned round seen Kirk broadfoot on the ground then just blew his whistle and pointed to the spot .  You could see from the replay no interaction was had. I laugh now but my head went in to orbit when I seen the replay. As someone else mentioned earlier he never thinks just acts straight away.

[AJF]

3 hours ago, GeorgiosSamaras said:

The "Old Firm" are not trying to pick referees, Rangers are.

Are you completely ignoring the whole Dougie McDonald fiasco? Celtic forced referees to go on strike, ffs 

[AJF]

6 minutes ago, gannonball said:

Nah it was instant he turned round seen Kirk broadfoot on the ground then just blew his whistle and pointed to the spot .  You could see from the replay no interaction was had. I laugh now but my head went in to orbit when I seen the replay. As someone else mentioned earlier he never thinks just acts straight away.

Great positioning from Collum with a clear view of the incident  

[AJF]

I reckon this probably will end up with Collum officiating less games of ours, at least at Ibrox anyway, but not because the SFA will be giving in to any demands.

They will probably try and look out for his own wellbeing and avoid giving him our home games as it would likely be toxic and I wouldn't blame him if it affected his performance.

[DiegoDiego]

Collum gave a 94th minute penalty against Roma for this header, erm, I mean, handball.

I'm not saying there's no bias in him, but Occam's razor says incompetence.

[Alberto Spencer]

Hearts went through a spell of getting Celtic every year in the Cup - and Collum ref all the time with a penalty every game - to be fair some were pens. Worst was Giudetti's dive with no one within a yard of him (score was already 5-0 but Willie couldn't help himself as default was/is "Penalty to Celtic").

The most game deciding was the 2019 Cup Final where Celtic were guff and 1-0 down and creating nothing. Eduard chased a hoof up the park with cover behind but Zlamal came out of goal but then pulled out the challenge but Eduard dived then kicked out at Zlamal. Default setting kicked itself in ("penalty") with the extra ref at the post happily looking the other way. Still, for Celtic haters the fact that Celtic went on to win the game meant Lennon got the job full time and combusted the "10iar" in spectacular fashion. If they'd lost the final, he would not have been appointed and a better choice might have reached the "nirvana" of 10iar....

I actually don't mind having Collum in any game EXCEPT against Celtic - he just can't help himself there. Last season on VAR, he intervened to send off Cochrane at 0-0 when Celtic were struggling to keep the score at 0-0 (no win and the Rangers game would be a league decider...). In other games he is usually fine. He's certainly no Kevin O'Donnell (demoted to linesman for being too biased/garbage) or Ian Brines (hilariously he's been touring Europe as a Supervisor!). Compared to them, Willie is wonderful!!!

[Melanius Mullarkey]

3 hours ago, DukDukGoose said:

Are you Snowy Treasurer?

 

2 hours ago, Alert Mongoose said:

You're Duggie Fordyce*, aren't you?

* the only ref to give me a red card in my 15 year football career. Merited, in fairness.

I’ll be anyone you want me to be. For the right money.

[craigkillie]

2 hours ago, VincentGuerin said:

Boy that I used to go on a supporter's bus with was on the refereeing path when we were in our late-teens/early twenties.

He got to the point of doing adult matches, not sure what level. Eventually binned it off for similar reasons to your mate. He just couldn't justify driving miles every weekend to take abuse in the pishing rain. He's a very laid-back lad, but I think even for someone like him there's a tipping point where you just get fed up. Some of the stories of folk offering him out (players and coaches) with nobody to back him up were quite frightening.

Football in general has an issue with arseholery. Players are encouraged to cheat, and it's the ref's fault if he falls for it. Players are encouraged to scream at refs, swear in their faces etc. All joking aside, that is no way for an adult to behave and it's shameful that the sport has allowed it to go on so long. Referees on the telly have police around, and the sort of protection of cameras etc. Refs in a public park have f**k all, so I think there's probably a heavy bias in certain personality types making it to the top of refereeing. You'd need thick as f**k skin, and I don't see why we all just accept that.

Behaviour in football is a disgrace.

I did the refereeing course when I was still at school and started off when I was 17 doing youth matches around Ayrshire. Within a couple of years I was refereeing amateur games and running the line in the lower tiers of the Juniors. It was perfect for me at that age because it kept me fit (I've never been that fit again in my life, even when I was training for a marathon) and you could make £40-50 by refereeing on a Saturday and Sunday.

At both youth and amateur level I'd say the vast majority of the issues came from the touchlines, mostly spectators and parents rather than coaches. 95% of players were brand new, and mostly the other 5% had teammates or coaches who kept them in line. Maybe it was just me being naive, but I didn't generally feel unsafe at any point - the only time I can remember was when I got some aggressive shouts coming off the park, so I put a chair against the door of the changing room and very quickly got clothes on and got out of their in the car, but nobody actually tried anything.

I think it probably helped me that I generally had a good attitude to it, I enjoyed talking to the players and was generally quite approachable, so even when I made mistakes I think they mostly were quite understanding. I remember being extremely pissed off at getting feedback from a couple of observers saying that I spoke to the players too much - I can sort of understand where they were coming from because you can talk yourself into trouble that way sometimes, but I think the best referees are ones who can build that rapport on the pitch.

I've come to realise I was probably actually quite a good referee - years after I packed it in I would have people coming up to me at Killie games or whatever asking if I was still refereeing and saying it was a shame I wasn't etc. If I had kept going, there's probably a pretty good chance I'd be in the Premiership by now, some of my peers from around that time have refereed at that level and been involved with UEFA.

The problem for me was that I reached a stage in my life where I didn't want to commit my entire weekend to refereeing. I'd have Friday/Saturday nights where I'd be out with my uni pals, only really able to have one drink. Then you'd drive for 30 minutes the next morning to a frozen or waterlogged pitch and have to drive straight back home having only been paid a tenner or whatever it was to do a pitch inspection. My girlfriend (now wife) was at uni in Edinburgh so it also ate in to the time I could spend with her. I absolutely loved being out on the pitch, but the rest of it became a drag and I realised that wasn't the life I wanted for the next 30 years.

Edited January 4 by craigkillie

[DukDukGoose]

5 minutes ago, craigkillie said:

I did the refereeing course when I was still at school and started off when I was 17 doing youth matches around Ayrshire. Within a couple of years I was refereeing amateur games and running the line in the lower tiers of the Juniors. It was perfect for me at that age because it kept me fit (I've never been that fit again in my life, even when I was training for a marathon) and you could make £40-50 by refereeing on a Saturday and Sunday.

At both youth and amateur level I'd say the vast majority of the issues came from the touchlines, mostly spectators and parents rather than coaches. 95% of players were brand new, and mostly the other 5% had teammates or coaches who kept them in line. Maybe it was just me being naive, but I didn't generally feel unsafe at any point - the only time I can remember was when I got some aggressive shouts coming off the park, so I put a chair against the door of the changing room and very quickly got clothes on and got out of their in the car, but nobody actually tried anything.

I think it probably helped me that I generally had a good attitude to it, I enjoyed talking to the players and was generally quite approachable, so even when I made mistakes I think they mostly were quite understanding. I've come to realise I was probably actually quite a good referee - years after I packed it in I would have people coming up to me at Killie games or whatever asking if I was still refereeing and saying it was a shame I wasn't etc. If I had kept going, there's probably a pretty good chance I'd be in the Premiership by now, some of my peers from around that time have refereed at that level and been involved with UEFA.

The problem for me was that I reached a stage in my life where I didn't want to commit my entire weekend to refereeing. I'd have Friday/Saturday nights where I'd be out with my uni pals, only really able to have one drink. Then you'd drive for 30 minutes the next morning to a frozen or waterlogged pitch and have to drive straight back home having only been paid a tenner or whatever it was to do a pitch inspection. My girlfriend (now wife) was at uni in Edinburgh so it also ate in to the time I could spend with her. I absolutely loved being out on the pitch, but the rest of it became a drag and I realised that wasn't the life I wanted for the next 30 years.

Craigkillie, you're such a fucking penis.

Goon insight from the other side tbh.

Edited January 4 by DukDukGoose

[Brother Blades]

2 hours ago, VincentGuerin said:

Boy that I used to go on a supporter's bus with was on the refereeing path when we were in our late-teens/early twenties.

He got to the point of doing adult matches, not sure what level. Eventually binned it off for similar reasons to your mate. He just couldn't justify driving miles every weekend to take abuse in the pishing rain. He's a very laid-back lad, but I think even for someone like him there's a tipping point where you just get fed up. Some of the stories of folk offering him out (players and coaches) with nobody to back him up were quite frightening.

Football in general has an issue with arseholery. Players are encouraged to cheat, and it's the ref's fault if he falls for it. Players are encouraged to scream at refs, swear in their faces etc. All joking aside, that is no way for an adult to behave and it's shameful that the sport has allowed it to go on so long. Referees on the telly have police around, and the sort of protection of cameras etc. Refs in a public park have f**k all, so I think there's probably a heavy bias in certain personality types making it to the top of refereeing. You'd need thick as f**k skin, and I don't see why we all just accept that.

Behaviour in football is a disgrace.

Lad I know who refs in our local pub and amateurs used to take dogs abuse from everyone in their younger days & he used to walk about our small town, head held high & not giving a shit. Those same 17/18/19 year olds that used to abuse him now think he’s the best ref in the leagues as he doesn’t give a f**k and will call the decision as he sees it, even if he’s wrong a certain amount of the times, they realise that he isn’t biased etc, but appreciated that he’s dedicated nearly 30 years, being abused to something he loves. Like a marriage so to speak. 

[cmontheloknow]

Grim club of gremlins.

[Thistle_do_nicely]

7 hours ago, Ric said:

According to the Daily Record (yes, I know..) Rangers have apparently called for Willie Collum to be banned from refereeing games.

This, to me, is classic entitlement. A refereeing decision goes against you and suddenly the pram is empty and the toys are everywhere. Before anyone decides to throw all this at VAR, you need to remember that Collum is no newcomer when it comes to "questionable" refereeing decisions. Long, long before VAR existed he has officiated the game with his own "personal take on the rules of the game". What might strike some as surprising about this little rant from Rangers (oooh, they do love a press release, with each and every one a humiliation), is that I could probably list 10 or 12 bizarre refereeing decisions Collum has made that very specifically benefited the Old Firm. In fact, I am trying to think of a single time my team has benefitted from a "Collum appraisal".

However, perhaps my memory is playing tricks with me, so in this thread I want people to give their opinion of Collum decisions that he has made against their team when playing the Old Firm. Let us, once and for all, list everything in one place, rather than it being piecemeal in separate game threads.

 

I have added in a poll too, but ideally I want people to reply with instances of Collum decision making that seemed really fucking odd at the time (and I trust there will be enough replies for several pages with that topic!). What would be nice is if you mention any follow up; was there any appeal? If so, how did it go?

 

I dont think its been mentioned in the thread as yet, but was it not relatively recently there was a referee strike from Celtic doing much the same thing?

This isnt intended as any sort of whataboutery, more making the point that its a dangerous PR game to play - easy to forget that referees have the power to collectively give Rangers a middle finger and either refuse to referee their games until they get an apology/the club get punished, or ref any games in the top flight whatsoever.

6 hours ago, 2426255 said:

I think Rangers are being a bit shortsighted in the sense that they get a lot of questionable decisions so I expect this little episode will be used against their fans on this website for years to come. You can't have it both ways, so next time Rangers get a dodgy decision in their favour this example will be cited. 

I'm fine with refereeing becoming transparent, but the self-interest element from Rangers while claiming to be acting in the interest of Scottish football as a whole is setting off my Spidey sense. If it were the case they were commited to refereeing standards and transparency they would point out erroneous decisions they benefit from with equal outrage.

Also theoretically possible, yeah. You could easily pick apart all of the 400ish penalties rangers have been given over the last few seasons and find at least a few that (leaving aside masonic conspiracies) *look* wrongly given in hindsight.