ICTChris Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 As to whether this is terrorism, I guess there are points that say it is and those that say it isn't. There is clearly an incel/blackpill ideology of sorts, a mode of thinking. There have been several mass killings associated with this movement and probably lots of lower level violence too. There was a case in Edinburgh where someone was convicted of building pipe bombs as part of this movement - he had previously stabbed a policeman who was working to deradicalise him but he got community service somehow. I don't think you can say that it's a poltical movement though - what are their goals? What political changes do they support? It just seems a howling rage against women and humanity in general to me, although I can't claim expertise. However, can it be said that there is a political purpose behind these killings? It seems just nihilistic violence. The fact that it targeted his own family also backs that up. But on the other hand, a lot of terrorism is nihilistic violence for it's own sake and many terrorists commit violence against family members before their attacks. There is a professor who has published a book advocating for the view that domestic violence should be treated as a significant risk factor for radicalisation and terrorism - a very high percetnage of suicide terrorists or attackers in the UK have committed domestic violence in the past. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 7 minutes ago, ICTChris said: As to whether this is terrorism, I guess there are points that say it is and those that say it isn't. There is clearly an incel/blackpill ideology of sorts, a mode of thinking. There have been several mass killings associated with this movement and probably lots of lower level violence too. There was a case in Edinburgh where someone was convicted of building pipe bombs as part of this movement - he had previously stabbed a policeman who was working to deradicalise him but he got community service somehow. I don't think you can say that it's a poltical movement though - what are their goals? What political changes do they support? It just seems a howling rage against women and humanity in general to me, although I can't claim expertise. However, can it be said that there is a political purpose behind these killings? It seems just nihilistic violence. The fact that it targeted his own family also backs that up. But on the other hand, a lot of terrorism is nihilistic violence for it's own sake and many terrorists commit violence against family members before their attacks. There is a professor who has published a book advocating for the view that domestic violence should be treated as a significant risk factor for radicalisation and terrorism - a very high percetnage of suicide terrorists or attackers in the UK have committed domestic violence in the past. It's not political, it's societal changes that Incels want. They want the popular folk who get their hole all the time (Chads and Staceys, as they're known in America) to feel small and insignificant like they do. They want pretty girls to stop chasing "bad guys" and in their twisted logic, killing some of them will do that. Not sure what this guy was hoping to achieve by murdering his family, unless he felt they were the reason he was an Incel. In the case of the Toronto van attack though, it's difficult to say that driving a van down a city pavement over numerous unsuspecting innocent people isn't terrorism, regardless of what the guys goal was. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 1 minute ago, The Moonster said: Not sure what this guy was hoping to achieve by murdering his family Doesn't sound like he killed his family, just one woman that knew him. Some reporting that she's his maw. But the rest sound like a tragic case of wrong place wrong time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 Just now, 101 said: Doesn't sound like he killed his family, just one woman that knew him. Some reporting that she's his maw. But the rest sound like a tragic case of wrong place wrong time. Sorry, I thought I'd read his parents were 2 of the victims. Probably best we don't speculate too much now until we see what's happened. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 The police just gave a press conference, sounds like most of the victims weren't known to the victim. He shot and killed a very young girl in the park and her male relative. Absolutely horrific. Here's a quick Twitter thread on the incel movement and what they are and believe (in so much as you can generalise it). Covers some of the stuff that Moonster mentioned. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 Police also said he shot himself rather than the police killing him. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melanius Mullarkey Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 Further evidence for state sponsored National Getting Your Hole Service at 18 imo. (or 49 in case the govt are reading this) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 5 minutes ago, ICTChris said: Police also said he shot himself rather than the police killing him. The witness reports of a pump action shot gun are a bit worrying surely you can't get a licence for that in the UK? Hopefully folk got confused and it's just a regular one he had a licence for. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RH33 Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Sergeant Wilson said: He looks...so normal. Xbl.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, 101 said: The witness reports of a pump action shot gun are a bit worrying surely you can't get a licence for that in the UK? Hopefully folk got confused and it's just a regular one he had a licence for. Police said that the gun was legally held. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 His YouTube channel was taken down, here are some of his comments. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONKMAN Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 3 minutes ago, ICTChris said: Police said that the gun was legally held. I thought the chief Constable just said that they couldn’t confirm yet, whether the gun used was the one he was licensed for. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 10 minutes ago, ICTChris said: His YouTube channel was taken down, here are some of his comments. As a fat lad myself it's not yer weight that stops ye getting yer hole. It's being a fucking c**t. This bell end is exhibit A -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 40 minutes ago, ICTChris said: The police just gave a press conference, sounds like most of the victims weren't known to the victim. He shot and killed a very young girl in the park and her male relative. Absolutely horrific. Here's a quick Twitter thread on the incel movement and what they are and believe (in so much as you can generalise it). Covers some of the stuff that Moonster mentioned. Absolutely dumbfounded to find Toby Young is sympathetic towards incel victimhood. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 48 minutes ago, Melanius Mullarkey said: Further evidence for state sponsored National Getting Your Hole Service at 18 imo. (or 49 in case the govt are reading this) For incels it's not about getting their hole it's about a wider more mental cult. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coprolite Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 No evidence this guy was an incel as such is there? Common or garden VL. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 6 minutes ago, coprolite said: No evidence this guy was an incel as such is there? Common or garden VL. Some of his reported videos seem to lean that way. Anyway started a thread so as not to clutter up things to share. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamthebam Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Melanius Mullarkey said: Further evidence for state sponsored National Getting Your Hole Service at 18 imo. (or 49 in case the govt are reading this) The state would have to accept a bid from the lowest tender though. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiegoDiego Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 No evidence this guy was an incel as such is there? Common or garden VL. He's stated that he's not getting his hole and he'd desperately like to. That's the definition of incel, no? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbornbairn Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 1 minute ago, DiegoDiego said: 18 minutes ago, coprolite said: No evidence this guy was an incel as such is there? Common or garden VL. He's stated that he's not getting his hole and he'd desperately like to. That's the definition of incel, no? Thousands of married men might disagree 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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