Michael W Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 (edited) FanTalk goes from one extreme to the other. These things happen when everyone on the forum supports the same team, as the lack of balance from other sides leads to a lack of perspective. If we win next week, the optimism brigade will be out in force. And it's easy to understand the frustrations given our performances last season. We became used to winning matches, and now we're not winning matches like we were. People are aware of why this is the case, but that doesn't make it any easier to accept. Edited October 23, 2011 by Michael W 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roverthemoon Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 We're now a run-of-the-mill 1st division team. We've been that for most of the 30 years I've supported them. Apart from a few years bobbing around the seaside leagues and that glorious period in the mid nineties. As long as we don't go back down to the second is my definition of success for this season. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graeme_p Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 We're now a run-of-the-mill 1st division team. Isn't that what we wanted when we were pissing about in the seaside leagues for years? Absolutely not! As far as I recall most fans would accept us being a well managed financial sound first division team. There is a big difference from being a run of the mill team with a sustainable base and secure future and a run of the mill team who are yet again living outwith their means, under performing and dusting down the begging bowls. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baillieinleeds Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Isn't that what we wanted when we were pissing about in the seaside leagues for years? The way things are going we might be heading back there very soon, we can't afford first division football and the players are showing no desire to play in it either. £17 to watch utter pish isn't going to get the punters back in a hurry. Sad but very true. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pantene proV Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Absolutely not! As far as I recall most fans would accept us being a well managed financial sound first division team. There is a big difference from being a run of the mill team with a sustainable base and secure future and a run of the mill team who are yet again living outwith their means, under performing and dusting down the begging bowls. Well quite, but I really didn't think that needed stating! Unfortunately, with the rental millstone around our necks those days are years off, that's why being a run of the mill 1st div side in these circumstances does John McG great credit. The way things are going we might be heading back there very soon, we can't afford first division football and the players are showing no desire to play in it either. £17 to watch utter pish isn't going to get the punters back in a hurry. Sad but very true. The problem is some teams have sussed us at home - press us in midfield and our play breaks down, counter-attack us sparingly, have enough cover in defence and our slow build-up play will resolve itself near the corner flag! Which is very strange because we're completely opposite away from home - swift, direct, keep possesion fairly easily, midfield up supporting play. It can't be down to the home crowd surely?? We won't go down automatically - Ayr will take care of that (whatever happened to Chick Young's prediction there?) - but a relegation play-off could be a possibility if we don't find an answer to the home displays soon. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broken Algorithms Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 (edited) Well quite, but I really didn't think that needed stating! Unfortunately, with the rental millstone around our necks those days are years off, that's why being a run of the mill 1st div side in these circumstances does John McG great credit. The problem is some teams have sussed us at home - press us in midfield and our play breaks down, counter-attack us sparingly, have enough cover in defence and our slow build-up play will resolve itself near the corner flag! Which is very strange because we're completely opposite away from home - swift, direct, keep possesion fairly easily, midfield up supporting play. It can't be down to the home crowd surely?? We won't go down automatically - Ayr will take care of that (whatever happened to Chick Young's prediction there?) - but a relegation play-off could be a possibility if we don't find an answer to the home displays soon. Not a dig at you, but don't discount it. Just because Ayr are part time doesn't mean that our players should swan about thinking that they'll be fine. They really need to start putting in the graft at home. It sums it up when you hear a good few Raith fans say "We should just go to away games where there is actual entertainment". Everytime the team put in a shit performance at home, we're seeing the numbers drop off even with the hardcore fans. As for Chick Young's prediction, journalistic start of season platitudes pretty much sums it up. It was the same with us during the first season when we came back up. The journalists were saying we could be title challengers because of our decent start, where as every Rovers (and the same goes for Ayr fans) said 8th places was the real achievement. Edited October 24, 2011 by rw89 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paco Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 The poor performances at home are entirely down to the one-dimensional tactics and, I hate to say it, on a couple of occasions a simple lack of fight and effort. Until that's sorted we'll continue to be awful at home, and crowds will continue to drop. And I don't think we can even complain - our home performances don't deserve a crowd. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.C Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Not a dig at you, but don't discount it. Just because Ayr are part time doesn't mean that our players should swan about thinking that they'll be fine. They really need to start putting in the graft at home. It sums it up when you hear a good few Raith fans say "We should just go to away games where there is actual entertainment". Everytime the team put in a shit performance at home, we're seeing the numbers drop off even with the hardcore fans. I hear it as well, at the end of the day we are paying for a product, its an entertainment business at the very least we should see players putting in an effort tho i would have to say that McGlynn's selection policy and sub uses still need to be sorted out as well. I really dont see the point of putting on a sub with 5 minutes to go who should of started the game or at least come on with 20/25mins to go when he has a chance to make an impact 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Never make assumptions, our fate is in our own hands. If continue the way we are, we may well finish bottom. If Ayr string a couple of wins together, something that could always happen from nowhere, we'll be in big trouble. We need to start getting some results. The following are all contributing factors to our form: crap tactics, no depth, no pace, no width and no fight. The latter of these is a particular disappointment, especially when you consider that we've relied on that for the past two seasons. Maybe the loss of Wilson/Campbell etc has had an impact here, I don't know, but the work ethic so prominent in the last couple of seasons appears to have gone. McGlynn also seems very reluctant to deviate from his favoured starting XI, and that's not helping either. If players aren't fit or are out of form, drop them. I know we're left with kids, but are they any worse than players out of form/half fit? I would like to think not. I should create a word document of exactly why we aren't winning games and c&p it on here every Saturday night. It's always the same reasons - strikers isolated due to no support from midfield, slow build up play, no width, no pace, senseless punts. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baillieinleeds Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Maybe the loss of Wilson/Campbell etc has had an impact here, I don't know, but the work ethic so prominent in the last couple of seasons appears to have gone. Precisely my point, the player cull was too extreme. We had some talented youngsters coming through, McKechnie and Brown being the prime examples. Gone. Simmons, Campbell, Wilson, Tade and Ferry gone. We replaced them with second rate shite. we are in a relegation dogfight now whether we like it or not. We have to have some parity with away performances and the shite home performances. Its fucking Dougie Cameron and Clydebank all over again. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Precisely my point, the player cull was too extreme. We had some talented youngsters coming through, McKechnie and Brown being the prime examples. Gone. Simmons, Campbell, Wilson, Tade and Ferry gone. We replaced them with second rate shite. we are in a relegation dogfight now whether we like it or not. We have to have some parity with away performances and the shite home performances. Its fucking Dougie Cameron and Clydebank all over again. Thing is, we're rooked and already predicting a loss this season with our small squad. That could of course lead us back to the board, but I'm fed up moaning about their financial management. Losing the first four of those has been a hammer blow, albeit one that was necessary to prevent the club from certain bankruptcy. Our style of play is ineffective without Tadé and for the first time In can remember in about 5 years, we are vulnerable at set pieces. We knew we hadn't replaced what has gone, but I think it's more than just numbers and ability that's lacking. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roverthemoon Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 The player cull wasn't too extreme. We're still predicted to lose 80k so it should have been even more extreme - if sound financial management is the measurement of success. Sums up the dilemma facing clubs in the First without a rich benefactor. Pay for decent players and live beyond your means or don't and get criticised by fans for performances. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Sums up the dilemma facing clubs in the First without a rich benefactor. Pay for decent players and live beyond your means or don't and get criticised by fans for performances. How about this refreshing idea - set reasonable budgets which don't set your club up for a major cull when the money runs out. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broken Algorithms Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Pay for decent players and live beyond your means or don't and get criticised by fans for performances. Don't really agree with the latter part of that. Players like Walker and Hill can do much better than they have put in so far this season. On paper, the loss of Wilson was expected to hurt us more than it did (one of the few positives of the cutbacks is Reece Donaldson, who again did well on Saturday). Simmons, as much as many of our fans dislike him for his laziness added an additional option for us and let Walker get further up the pitch. Campbell was poor towards the end of last season, but looked competent on Saturday. Dougie Hill has been unfortunate with injuries and may have lost some of the confidence he had when he first joined. How do we sort this out though? Real question which is difficult to answer. Ideally, the players and manager will see our style of play is hardly endearing to anyone who comes to Starks Park. Our players don't even look enthusiastic to player there at times. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roverthemoon Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 How about this refreshing idea - set reasonable budgets which don't set your club up for a major cull when the money runs out. The major cull is the result of setting a reasonable budget this year which because of the shite crowds and the SFL cutting money still isn't going to be balanced. I'd be the first to vote for a reasonable budget that matches what we bring in. The reality is we'd be bottom of the league, probably by a long distance. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roverthemoon Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Don't really agree with the latter part of that. Players like Walker and Hill can do much better than they have put in so far this season. I think there's a hangover amongst the fans and the players after going so close. Also it's hard to imagine the loss of Simmons, Ferry, Campbell et al not having an impact on the squad. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 The major cull is the result of setting a reasonable budget this year which because of the shite crowds and the SFL cutting money still isn't going to be balanced. I'd be the first to vote for a reasonable budget that matches what we bring in. The reality is we'd be bottom of the league, probably by a long distance. I was referring to our our budgeting over the last couple of seasons. We'd be in administration/bankrupt were it not for the cup run and significantly increased attendances last season. The bottom line is that we are all but finished as a full time team. It's not financially sustainable, and we can't go on losing money. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Westander of County Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Finance aside, inspiring characters like Tade and their work ethic may have made a bigger difference to team performances last year. McGlynn was a magician and now he has much less to work with so can't produce the same magic. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roverthemoon Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 The bottom line is that we are all but finished as a full time team. It's not financially sustainable, and we can't go on losing money. Totally agree. It's whether fans would accept the inevitability of what this would mean on the pitch. I suspect some wouldn't. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wardy Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Oh well the next 2 games are away from home. That will be 6 points then. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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