Queens v Falkirk

[Monkey Tennis]

9 hours ago, Artemis said:

Over the last few seasons, the home and away form has been quite similar, although home form has been marginally worse.

Even that probably represents an unusually bad home record though, especially over a few seasons.  

I suppose that teams who generally lose more often than they win, might have closer home and away records, than would sides who do better.  Given how long we've been lousy for, that might be part of it.

Obviously, it's especially pronounced this season, but in terms of the broader pattern, I've not got a clue as to an explanation.  It's now been in place for several managers.  It's now been in place for a few generations of players given the rate of turnover.  And it's even been in place over the span of two different physical pitches.

I can't believe that the Queens support is a particularly difficult one to play in front of.  For one thing, it's much diminished.  For another, dissatisfied grumbling is about as bad or as vocal as it generally gets.

 

Whatever the cause, it really does make following the club pretty bloody joyless.  It's no wonder now that more fans are picking and choosing, or even chucking it.  

[SUPERSOUTH]

7 hours ago, Mr Grimsdale said:

Is Marvin and his PR lady still on work? 

??? 

[Otis Blue]

37 minutes ago, SUPERSOUTH said:

??? 

I think he was referring to Eilidh Barbour, the media presenter, they were/are an item IIRC ...

[bairn88]

1 hour ago, Artemis said:

I think your first point is the main one by some distance - the teams in recent seasons have been so poor that “home advantage” makes little, or no, difference. I think that goes most of the way to solving the mystery.
I suppose you could add that if dissatisfied grumbling is as bad as it generally gets then the players know that they can get away with murder. Kind of like being under not enough pressure rather than too much. Whether it would make any difference if they knew the fans would get on their case, I don’t know.

Pretty much fully agreed with this. For years there I was trying to figure out some reason our home form was so disgusting. A hostile “large” home crowd meaning an inexperienced bunch of decent players played poorly? Something about coming to our ground that away teams relished? An aging plastic pitch we couldn’t play “our style” on? Etc etc? 

Nah. At this level, appoint a decent manager/coach who will bring in either a good squad or a decent squad who’ll want to work for him, and by god the home form takes a huge upturn. Shock. 

[Fae_the_'briggs]

50 minutes ago, Otis Blue said:

I think he was referring to Eilidh Barbour, the media presenter, they were/are an item IIRC ...

Actually thought he meant Sandra B, QoS Media Interviewer, who seems to give Marv an easy time in interviews. 

[Mr Grimsdale]

4 hours ago, Fae_the_'briggs said:

Actually thought he meant Sandra B, QoS Media Interviewer, who seems to give Marv an easy time in interviews. 

Correct 

[Mr Grimsdale]

9 hours ago, bairn88 said:

Pretty much fully agreed with this. For years there I was trying to figure out some reason our home form was so disgusting. A hostile “large” home crowd meaning an inexperienced bunch of decent players played poorly? Something about coming to our ground that away teams relished? An aging plastic pitch we couldn’t play “our style” on? Etc etc? 

Nah. At this level, appoint a decent manager/coach who will bring in either a good squad or a decent squad who’ll want to work for him, and by god the home form takes a huge upturn. Shock. 

I think you are under estimating the influence of supporters both positively and negatively. Every away team and their fans in this league knew that if they kept in the game for an hour our support would turn. Footballers are human beings and they will respond better to encouragement than negativity. I agree it is down to mentality and better players usually have more mental strength to deal with pressure but we are in League one. 

It is not just Falkirk fans who have been accused of this you can look at Sevco, Man Utd, Leeds Utd, Sheffield Wednesday, Bradford City etc for clubs fans who have had the same mud thrown at them. 

I think our improvement this season is no coincidence in a changed vibe coming out of the stands. The Ultra section, while vilified but some fans prior to its creation,  has helped hugely. Late goals this season are no coincidence as the support has really stuck with the side and help drive them on.
 

It wouldn’t surprise me that in the end the size and changed attitude of our support helps amongst other things in getting us over the line against a good Hamilton side. 

Edited November 3, 2023 by Mr Grimsdale

[bod]

The way our season’s going the team will be playing at home in deathly silence in an empty ground. Fans are leaving in droves due to the fare on show!

[Nithsdale Wanderer]

13 hours ago, Otis Blue said:

Apology accepted, thanks.

No, the Rangers game was the bigger attendance. I'm recovering from surgery at the moment so can't check my record books, but my memory says circa 18k for that one.

You are spot on Otis. I too am from that generation and remember both very well.  Some say the Rangers QF may have been nearer 19,000.

I suspect both games may be remembered more for off field issues than on as we were well beaten in both.

Hearts brought over 10,000 and I guess Rangers must have been even more.   

It was the seventies and the 'hooligans' tended to dress in Bay City Roller style - none of your Designer gear in those days !

Graffiti was also big in those days and I recall HMFC - in maroon paint - being sprayed on what seemed every building in town. It was particularly vivid on the light blue wall of Fleshers - right opposite the Police Station !

Inside the ground, the Rangers game seemed much worse.  Bottles and cans were constantly flying across the ' Covered End' and I felt really sorry for the Police Officers there in the middle who bore the brunt. There was a dividing line of about 4 to 5 wide from top to bottom who were really struggling to keep control and what seemed a constant procession of people being removed from the terracing and walked round the track and down the tunnel presumably to a waiting van or two.

It's a shame not a lot to talk about from either game. Hearts were comfortable winners if I remember correctly and Rangers absolutely  blew us away - they did win the Treble and had a really good team.  Having said that, given our form and previous Cup victories I think we did go into that QF with some degree of hope and expectation that we could compete and run them close.

Thanks for rekindling great memories.

[ShaggerG]

4 hours ago, Mr Grimsdale said:

I think you are under estimating the influence of supporters both positively and negatively. Every away team and their fans in this league knew that if they kept in the game for an hour our support would turn. Footballers are human beings and they will respond better to encouragement than negativity. I agree it is down to mentality and better players usually have more mental strength to deal with pressure but we are in League one. 

It is not just Falkirk fans who have been accused of this you can look at Sevco, Man Utd, Leeds Utd, Sheffield Wednesday, Bradford City etc for clubs fans who have had the same mud thrown at them. 

I think our improvement this season is no coincidence in a changed vibe coming out of the stands. The Ultra section, while vilified but some fans prior to its creation,  has helped hugely. Late goals this season are no coincidence as the support has really stuck with the side and help drive them on.
 

It wouldn’t surprise me that in the end the size and changed attitude of our support helps amongst other things in getting us over the line against a good Hamilton side. 

I agree, however, it wouldn't take too much to change things.

A defeat, particularly at home, would have some fans whining like f**k. I commented just a few weeks ago about the guy sitting close to us at the Hamilton match that was moaning because we weren't winning, saying that the players weren't trying and a whole lot of other shit. He also started on McGlynn, ranting and raving about the Airdrie play-off, despite the fact that we're top of the league, undefeated and were top scorers in Scotland at the time! There was another guy who was grumbling about individual players last Saturday, for no apparent reason that I could see.

Some fans are just dicks and would rather revel in our recent misery than enjoy success!

[Distant Doonhamer]

2 hours ago, Nithsdale Wanderer said:

It's a shame not a lot to talk about from either game. Hearts were comfortable winners if I remember correctly and Rangers absolutely  blew us away - they did win the Treble and had a really good team.  Having said that, given our form and previous Cup victories I think we did go into that QF with some degree of hope and expectation that we could compete and run them close.

Yes there was indeed a degree of optimism as we had done well in the cups that season. We took the ultimately treble winning Rangers to extra time in a 2 leg quarter final in the league cup after winning a section that included Falkirk, Hamilton and Stirling. It's very QOS that in the time period between the 2 legs v Rangers where we ran a very good side so close we lost 7-1 at home to Airdrie in a league game.

As you suggest we had also beaten premier league sides St Johnstone and Ayr in the Scottish Cup in some cracking ties. Fond memories.

[19QOS19]

2 hours ago, ShaggerG said:

Some fans are just dicks and would rather revel in our recent misery than enjoy success!

We have a couple of posters like that. I'm convinced if we ever stop being so shite they'll disappear from the place. When I (a pessimist to the core) look like a happy clapper compared to some folk, it shows how bad they are

[ShaggerG]

16 minutes ago, 19QOS19 said:

We have a couple of posters like that. I'm convinced if we ever stop being so shite they'll disappear from the place. When I (a pessimist to the core) look like a happy clapper compared to some folk, it shows how bad they are

Oh aye, we've got them too. There are one or two who hardly ever post unless there's something negative going on, then they're all over the threads like a rash!

[bod]

1 hour ago, 19QOS19 said:

We have a couple of posters like that. I'm convinced if we ever stop being so shite they'll disappear from the place. When I (a pessimist to the core) look like a happy clapper compared to some folk, it shows how bad they are

Aye that’ll be the ones that post about how we’re somehow becoming progressively worse, even though having inherited a squad our manager has since built and is playing his own team.

Facts sometimes are awkward when you’re trying to argue against them.

Anyway, we can but dream of turning a corner soon, starting tomorrow.

[Balde Bairn]

8 hours ago, Mr Grimsdale said:

I think you are under estimating the influence of supporters both positively and negatively. Every away team and their fans in this league knew that if they kept in the game for an hour our support would turn. Footballers are human beings and they will respond better to encouragement than negativity. I agree it is down to mentality and better players usually have more mental strength to deal with pressure but we are in League one. 

It is not just Falkirk fans who have been accused of this you can look at Sevco, Man Utd, Leeds Utd, Sheffield Wednesday, Bradford City etc for clubs fans who have had the same mud thrown at them. 

I think our improvement this season is no coincidence in a changed vibe coming out of the stands. The Ultra section, while vilified but some fans prior to its creation,  has helped hugely. Late goals this season are no coincidence as the support has really stuck with the side and help drive them on.
 

It wouldn’t surprise me that in the end the size and changed attitude of our support helps amongst other things in getting us over the line against a good Hamilton side. 

The fans respond to what they see. Falkirk sides prior to this season for the last 4-years were playing some of the worst stuff I had seen as a Falkirk fan in my lifetime. The players showed no ability and created next to nothing against part-time teams in a lot of cases which is why we couldn’t get a result. Blaming the fans for that is just ridiculous. Hardly going to see me clapping and happy losing at home to Clyde. The atmosphere this season has been excellent, coincidentally at a time where we’ve had the best start ever to a league campaign. 

[19QOS19]

41 minutes ago, bod said:

Aye that’ll be the ones that post about how we’re somehow becoming progressively worse, even though having inherited a squad our manager has since built and is playing his own team.

Facts sometimes are awkward when you’re trying to argue against them.

Anyway, we can but dream of turning a corner soon, starting tomorrow.

I wasn't actually thinking of you when I posted but you're actually a good example. You join the website after MB has built his own (admittedly shite) squad and do nothing but criticise him. It'll be interesting to see if you slink off after he leaves the club. 

[StuartA]

1 hour ago, Balde Bairn said:

The fans respond to what they see. Falkirk sides prior to this season for the last 4-years were playing some of the worst stuff I had seen as a Falkirk fan in my lifetime. The players showed no ability and created next to nothing against part-time teams in a lot of cases which is why we couldn’t get a result. Blaming the fans for that is just ridiculous. Hardly going to see me clapping and happy losing at home to Clyde. The atmosphere this season has been excellent, coincidentally at a time where we’ve had the best start ever to a league campaign. 

Fans aren’t stupid though, and understand that players are lifted by them. McGlynn was crystal clear about that this week. And it’s been confirmed that opposing managers used Falkirk fans’ well-known angst against us.  So it’s logical that fans now do the opposite and get behind the team more, especially when things are tough. I hope it lasts when a bad result or two comes along. 

[ShaggerG]

1 hour ago, Balde Bairn said:

The fans respond to what they see. Falkirk sides prior to this season for the last 4-years were playing some of the worst stuff I had seen as a Falkirk fan in my lifetime. The players showed no ability and created next to nothing against part-time teams in a lot of cases which is why we couldn’t get a result. Blaming the fans for that is just ridiculous. Hardly going to see me clapping and happy losing at home to Clyde. The atmosphere this season has been excellent, coincidentally at a time where we’ve had the best start ever to a league campaign. 

He's not blaming anyone as far as I can see, just simply pointing out that players react positively when the fans are getting behind them. I doubt anyone was either happy or clapping when we were losing at home to Clyde either. 

[HighlandQueen]

23 hours ago, Otis Blue said:

Scottish Cup tie at home to Hearts (73 or 74), crowd 14,000, lost 2-0.

Scottish Cup quarter final (75?) home to Rangers (after the famous 5-4 Ayr tie), crowd 18,000, pumped 5-0.

I'm not making it up. I was at both. Huge crowds for Palmy.

I was at both.

 

Never forget Rab Thorburn stopping a shot on the line with 2 hands and ref not giving a pen at Hearts game. 

Peter Dickson clean through on keeper at 0-0 in Rangers game and muffing his shot after being unplayable that season. 
 

Halcyon days. Wish we had either of these teams now

[HighlandQueen]

22 hours ago, Otis Blue said:

Apology accepted, thanks.

No, the Rangers game was the bigger attendance. I'm recovering from surgery at the moment so can't check my record books, but my memory says circa 18k for that one.

There was the league copy midweek Rangers game earlier that season in 75. I think the crowd was around 9, 000. Ayr 5-4 game that season in the cup was similar.